Heard it. Loved it. Fine Political Theater.
I doubt very much that any minds were changed, but I think Hitchens won in a walk. Galloway savaged Hitchens; Hitchens savaged Galloway, but he also laid out an unrefuted case for regime change in Iraq. Plus many of Galloway's ad hominems lacked any real sting--he triumphantly bellowed that Hitchens had opposed the 1991 Gulf War, but he had apparently changed his mind, so how could we ever trust him again?
That may be a more effective insult in Galloway's fever swamp, where deviating from blind orthodoxy and reconsidering one's position is considered treasonous. Among the right, many of us (not me so much) got here from liberalism after being, as Irving Kristol put it, mugged by reality. It's called growing up.
1
Galloway is a piece of shit who, like all other liberals, needs a hemp necktie.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at September 16, 2005 07:23 PM (0yYS2)
2
I finished the second half 17 hours ago.

So the entire Galloway vs. Hitchens transcript is there now. Enjoy!
Posted by: George at September 17, 2005 04:28 AM (9RcD9)
3
While what I've read so far is quite entertaining, it devolved into nothing but guttersniping.
Then I read this in the UK's
Independent:
"The "sold out" sign on the doors of Baruch College spoke volumes about the thirst for open public debate on the issue, and the rarity of home-grown voices who might quench it. For a subject that is often discussed but seldom debated, the talent had to be imported."
It made me want to personally go over there and slap the crap out of the writer. That was not a "debate". Debates have moderators and an air of decorum. Debates stick to facts and appeal to the intellect of the listeners. And last of all, the debators should be evenly matched. I mean really - I could have beat Galloway myself. He's a disgusting and vile man and a compulsive liar. No wonder he's so loved by the extreme left in this country.
They said roughly 2/3 of the audience was with Galloway. Sure they were. It was in NY. Next time, let's have it in Texas and see how well received he is.
Posted by: Oyster at September 17, 2005 06:24 AM (YudAC)
4
"They said roughly 2/3 of the audience was with Galloway. Sure they were. It was in NY."
Didn't some sort of terrorist attack happen in NY some time back? Is it just me, or do New Yorkers have a much higher incidence of absolute morons than most populations? Where I live, I've even heard some flaming pansyass liberals say muslims should be deported, so WTF is the matter with these idiots?
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at September 17, 2005 08:30 AM (0yYS2)
5
Actually, IM, I think California's got 'em beat.
Posted by: Oyster at September 17, 2005 12:08 PM (YudAC)
6
It's funny that Oyster is lecturing the British about decorum.
Not that Oyster isn't decorous, I mean, just the idea of Americans telling them to act like grownups.
Posted by: See-Dubya at September 17, 2005 01:41 PM (hmJ+A)
7
Good point, See-Dubya. What I was going to allude to as well, but did not mention, was the raucous manner in which they even conduct Parliament sessions. Heckling and shouting insults while people speak. It's quite amazing to watch. And while our own House and Senate display their share of snide and sideways remarks during sessions, it's never quite so, well, boisterous and disorderly. Of course that's only because we've so far been able to keep Ted Kennedy relatively constrained.
Posted by: Oyster at September 17, 2005 02:09 PM (YudAC)
8
Impy, you would be crying after five minutes with Galloway.
Posted by: Downing Street Memo at September 18, 2005 12:14 AM (VhNDM)
9
Yes, I would be crying after five minutes with Galloway, for one of the following reason:
1. The human body only contains so much blood, and that tends to leak out too quickly during vigorous "debate".
2. Because I left my propane torch and vise-grips at home.
3. Because I didn't bring my weighted gloves, and my fists are too sore to continue.
4. Because there's only one of him, and he's too soft to last long.
5. Because it's a once in a lifetime chance, and there's nobody around with a camcorder.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at September 18, 2005 12:50 PM (0yYS2)
10
C'mon Impy, the rattling medicine bottles are ringing in your ears!
Posted by: Downing Street Memo at September 18, 2005 07:49 PM (VhNDM)
11
The Incapability of the American right to deal with anything from a Hurricane to a bomb, is outstanding. Not only can the United States not keep the price of Oil down when it steals it from Iraqis but it cannot even organise a few buses to get poor black people out of New Orleans. Galloway was opposing Saddam Hussein When you kids were probably in cradles. He was my local representative,a very true and caring man. The comment he made to Saddam was addressed to the people (something which he very quickly expressed to the press and others). Hitchens is a turncoat, a fool and a warmonger. And like all other American Warmongers he's not in the front line. Plenty of Black Amnericans are in it though. For some reason when it came to getting them from New Orleans to Baghdad, it was a smooth effective operation.
PS. My Url is not being accepted because its from the UK.
Posted by: Brian Christopher at September 19, 2005 11:00 AM (I70Fk)
12
Futhermore, George Galloway is not a "Liberal". In American politics and culture the term Liberal has been skewed and distorted for propaganda terms. Many might remember a time when Liberty was something the United States was proud of - but no more. Liberals in America are people who believe in social change and are open minded about the way these social changes should be brought about. All of them believe in Liberal markets - capatalism and free enterprise. George Galloway is a socialist. That's not a liberal. He may have some liberal attitudes but that does not make him a "Liberal". After all, in the US you can call yourself a "Democrat" but it doesn't mean that you believe in willy-nilly liberal ideas like Democracy. At least not if coercion is more beneficial to you and your Papa's business partners.
Posted by: Brian Christopher at September 19, 2005 11:09 AM (I70Fk)
13
BC: In Britain, do the articles appearing in the leftist BBC just get pasted into hardcover scrapbooks and sent off to the schools for your children to read (while held only in their left hands--their right hands tied behind their backs--and with their right eyes taped shut)? And then they all speak with one voice, out of--guess with side of their mouths? (No.... way further south!) Is that where you learned your propaganda?
Posted by: JV at September 20, 2005 03:14 PM (9UtjO)
14
Yes, Brian - Galloway is a socialist. In America many, many liberals are socialists as well. But America is not a socialist country (or at least we are fighting an uphill battle not to become one). What do you know about American liberty? Is cradle to grave socialism liberty? Is abortion, mercy killing, rationed healthcare, confiscatory taxes and living from welfare check to welfare check liberty? I think not. How dare you impune the American political right in regards to 9/11 and Hurricane Katrina. Those are cheap shots. You know, we Yanks are constantly being accused of being arrogant - we've got nothing on you Brits. Your media - the BBC World News especially - makes our leftist media look like the amatuer hour. Fortunately our TV's and radios have an on and off button that we exercise when ever the BBC comes on. Good day.
Posted by: Craig Willms at September 24, 2005 10:33 PM (0nyqN)
15
Interesting that you refer to the "leftist BBC". In the UK the BBC is considered a right-wing government mouthpiece (just ask Andrew Gilligan). I couldn't have learned anything from the BBC as the only encounters I have with them is when their security men try to silence my protests (The BBC Building here in Glasgow is a stone's throw from my house - depending on how big my stone is). Incidentally the BBC apologised to Israel for not going through the Israeli censor when it interviewed Israel's illegally detained anti-nuclear hero Mordecahi Vanunu (who I am proud to say is the Rector of my student council).
Abortion is not socialism. Mercy killing is certainly not Socialism (Mr Galloway isn't a fan of it by the way). rationed helath care is the opposite socialism, nor is confiscatory taxes or living from one welfare cheque to another.
Health care in this country is free by the way.
What you are describing is a slanted view of the failed American liberal left - that is the very point I am trying to make. Socialism, my friend and comrade is the equality of all human beings. It is the attempt by the democratic masses to ensure that equality exists in fact as well as on paper. It does this by ensuring that every individual is rewarded in proprtion both to his or her needs and according to his or her value to society as a whole. It puts people before profit. that is it's essence. In a socialist society unemployment is non-existent and so "welfare" is not required unless someone is unable to work, in which case it is assumed that they nonetheless deserve necessities to live a healthy and fulfilling life.
Therefore real socialism isn't about taking taking away taxes from the owners of production. Its about getting them to pay people a fair wage in the first place - result fat Cats dont get so fat and the little guy doesn't slave his life away for nothing.
My problem with the United States right-wingers is not that I am a socialist or that Socialists in the United States are targeted as madmen or dreamers. I don't care that your twin towers of so called "Free trade" were bombed or that your President will go down in history for his lack of intelligence. What I do care about are the people of Iraq, Afghanistan and Palestine who suffer from your arrogance, your hypocrisy and your lies (not to mention your bombs) . I do care about the people of Saudi Arabia who have campaigned for democratic change only to see your Government (And mine) sell them £40 billion of arms to suppress their people. I do care about the people of Malawi, Sudan and Ethiopia who work as slaves to make pills for Westerners and yet cannot afford to buy medicine for themselves or their familes. Even though in a single year the US Arms buget could wipe out african debt. Every year each Israeli citizen gets the equivilent of $1000 curtesy of Mr and Mrs John Q taxpayer in the US - A country of Six Million relatively wealthy people. Just to the west of them an entire continent sits on the biggest mass of fertile land in the world and starves - receiving less money in aid (as a continent) than the zionist pet project that the US funds as a way of keeping Christian fundamentalists and arms dealers in America happy and as a way to further Anti-semetic aims by encouraging Jews to leave the land of the free and head for Israel.
Oh! And I hear creationism might be on it's way back into science class.
You're absolutely right, the US is on the brink of becoming a socialist utopia any day now. You better buy a flight to Britian. Our Mr Blair only has a little while left before he's kicked out of the Labour party for being an under-cover Nazi.
Posted by: Brian Christopher at October 03, 2005 08:41 AM (6RMND)
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