mypetjawa v. 2.0 (beta) "<i>Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to ev

April 27, 2005

Syria has WMD and connections to terrorists

Whether or not Iraqi WMDs were moved to Syria is the least of our worries. The Syrians produce their own WMD and they are not allies in the GWOT.

Does the ISG report really claim that there were no transfers of WMD from Iraq to Syria? No, it does not. What it does claim is that:

ISG judged that it was unlikely that an official transfer of WMD material from Iraq to Syria took place.

As we reported here last year, if WMD were moved they might have been moved to the Al Safir facility. So, is the ISG really suggesting they have inspected that chemical weapons plant? No. In fact, in an addendum to the report:

ISG was unable to complete its investigation and is unable to rule out the possibility that WMD was evacuated to Syria before the war

We've known for a long time that there is a strong connection between insurgents in Iraq and Syria. For instance, after the battle of Fallujah, a GPS unit was discovered in a terrorist safe-house with Syrian coordinates on it. Ansar al-Sunnah terrorists have confessed to recieving training from Syrian intelligence officers. Suspects in the Najaf bombing also confessed to having links to Syria. Photos have been found of insurgents with senior Syrian military officials. And Syrian fighters are routinely captured or killed in Iraq. Do a quick search for 'Syria' on my site and you'll see much, much more.

So what the ISG report tells us is simply, "we don't know". I am not claiming that Syria has Iraq's WMD nor am I claiming the Iraq actually had substantial amounts of WMD before the invasion. Just that 'we don't know', that is all.

But whether or not WMD were moved out of Iraq and into Syria is really the least of our worries. Why? Because Syria produces WMD and because at least some elements of the Syrian military and Baathist establishment are directly tied to the Iraqi insurgency.

For instance:

Since the 1970s Syria has pursued what is now one of the most advanced Arab state chemical weapons (CW) capabilities. It has a stockpile of the nerve agent sarin that can be delivered by aircraft or ballistic missiles, and has engaged in the research and development of more toxic and persistent nerve agents such as VX....
Syria has a combined total of several hundred Scud and SS-21 SRBMs, and is believed to have chemical warheads available for a portion of its Scud missile force. Syria has also developed a longer-range missile -- the Scud D -- with assistance from North Korea. SyriaÂ’s missiles are mobile and can reach much of Israel from positions near their peacetime garrisons and portions of Iraq, Jordan, and Turkey from launch sites well within the country. Damascus is pursuing both solid- and liquid-propellant missile programs and relies extensively on foreign assistance in these endeavors. North Korean and Iranian entities have been most prominent in aiding SyriaÂ’s recent ballistic missile development. Syrian regional concerns may lead Damascus to seek a longer range ballistic missile capability such as North KoreaÂ’s No Dong MRBM....

In addition, Syria is believed to be developing biological weapons.

So while the jury is still out on the Iraqi WMD question, let us not forget that the Syrian Baathists are in no way less dangerous. The point of the Iraqi WMD investigatioin is largely political: was the Iraq War justified? But that question is moot. The more pressing point is the extent to which present and future dangers are prepared for and met.

Captain Ed has more as does Jack Lewis.

Posted by: Rusty at 09:05 AM | Comments (105) | Add Comment
Post contains 607 words, total size 4 kb.

1 How long will it take for the Moonbats to defend Syria

Posted by: Filthy Allah at April 27, 2005 09:07 AM (yBHNA)

2 I would be amazed if Assad is in power in the next 6 months. The Bush fire is burning and Syria seems to be the next one to feel the heat. THen Iran.

Posted by: Obsnooks at April 27, 2005 09:09 AM (yBHNA)

3 Oh so now I'm being called a pussy by a limp wristed, ass swishin', lisp talkin', sperm gargling, pillow biting, bung hole spelunking, flamboyant, prematurely balding, dihydrotestosterone spewing faggot. Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 08:28 AM WOW!! You sound so bitter and filled with Hate. I will pray for you.

Posted by: Filthy Allah at April 27, 2005 09:14 AM (yBHNA)

4 That's from an old string. You liked that one, eh Filthy?

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 09:53 AM (/+dAV)

5 Better hope Assad is not out. I'm afraid the alternative is worse. Syria is at a tipping point could go either way. We are making progress with them. If Assad goes out and the more radical parts of the Syrian Baathists get power it's war for sure. Not that we can't win but the best thing is to use the credible threat of war to get what we need. It may come to war and we may be closer than a lot of people realize at this point. Hope for the best and prepare for the worst. I got 1 question is your selective service registration up to date???

Posted by: Howie at April 27, 2005 10:19 AM (D3+20)

6 "The Bush fire is burning"-Obsnooks The closest thing I've ever had to a burning bush experience was when I dated this red-headed Irish girl.

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 10:20 AM (/+dAV)

7 Assad is not running the show anyway. They guy is a weak as Greg here.

Posted by: Ob Snooks at April 27, 2005 10:31 AM (yBHNA)

8 It's a pretty fucked-up situation, to say the least. The Baathists have no love for al Qaeda/Muslim Brotherhood, yet both seem to need each other to accomplish separate goals in Iraq (al Qaeda to set up a Muslim theocracy, the Baathists to return to power). There might be some coordination going on right now, but I'd liken this to the coordination the Taliban had with other factions in helping overthrow the Soviet Union in Afghanistan. If the coalition were to leave now, they'd pretty quickly turn on each other. Also, don't be too quick to judge Syria as not helping in the GWOT. Since they hate the Muslim Brotherhood (and its inspired offshoots) more than the U.S., it's no huge surprise that the U.S. has been under suspicion of sending suspected terrorists to Syria for "questioning." Syria may or may not be a covert ally in this (after all, it wouldn't be the first time the U.S. has counted a Baathist regime as an ally), but like in your article, we simply "don't know." So, yeah, Syria is in a pretty delicate position right now. They likely want a return of the Baathists to power in Iraq, but not at the expense of strengthening their biggest ideological adversary (al Qaeda).

Posted by: Venom at April 27, 2005 10:56 AM (dbxVM)

9 Venom, You're right, of course, but don't forget that there are other Safist and even Shia terror organizations that Syria directly funds. Granted, these are anti-Israel organizations, but still the Syrians have no qualms in funding and giving weapons to allies of convenience. The biggest thing we have going for us is that the Syrians seem much more savvy in calculating U.S. reaction. Saddam, as you know, was full of miscalculations. So, the Syrians seem much more like the classical 'rational actor' than did the Baathists in Iraq. Thus, they seem much less of a threat in turning over their WMD to terror organizations because they know what the consequences of that would be.

Posted by: Rusty Shackleford at April 27, 2005 11:09 AM (JQjhA)

10 It would be a good thing if Israel were wiped off the face of the map.

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 11:34 AM (/+dAV)

11 So, Greg hates the Jew now. Greg hates America, Gays, blacks & now Jews. Excellent work Greg.

Posted by: Filthy Allah at April 27, 2005 11:36 AM (yBHNA)

12 Ever wonder why most Jews look so different from the Palestinians? That's because most Jews (the Ashkinazis) have no Biblical claim to the Holy Land. In about 1100 AD the Khazar Kingdom of western Russia adopted Judaism. This is the origin of most Eastern European Jews.

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 11:46 AM (/+dAV)

13 I bet you like to measure noses too

Posted by: FIlthy Allah at April 27, 2005 11:48 AM (yBHNA)

14 greg hates the Jews? Never saw that coming.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 27, 2005 12:03 PM (jPCiN)

15 Greg hates jews, you guys hate muslims, whats the fucking difference? You both hate. You are hypocrites. Shut the fuck up.

Posted by: Jim at April 27, 2005 12:07 PM (jcSwY)

16 I don't hate Muslims. I hate Fanatical Muslims. You on the other hand have a potty mouth.

Posted by: Ob Snooks at April 27, 2005 12:12 PM (yBHNA)

17 Blaha hate da jew. GO figure.

Posted by: Filthy Allah at April 27, 2005 12:14 PM (yBHNA)

18 Ok you guys knock it off. This Greg bashing haas got to stop. I am going to tell you something about Greg and I hope it will make you feel differently about him. Greg lost a close relative during WW11 in the holocost. The loss still haunts him and sometimes manifests itself in some anger management problems. You see, his Grandfather was at Dachau. He was killed in a tragic accident when he fell out of his guard tower. So just give him some space and back off!

Posted by: Brad at April 27, 2005 12:18 PM (aUEhc)

19 Asked during the briefing "are we winning" the war, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld did not directly respond. "The United States and the coalition forces, in my personal view, will not be the thing that will defeat the insurgency," Rumsfeld said. "So, therefore, winning or losing is not the issue for 'we,' in my view, in the traditional, conventional context of using the word 'winning' and 'losing' in a war. The people that are going to defeat that insurgency are going to be the Iraqis." Rummy's confused response sent Joint Chiefs of Staff chair Richard Myers into a sputtering attempt at damage control. After Rumsfeld finished, Myers interjected, "I'm going to say this: I think we are winning, OK? I think we're definitely winning. I think we've been winning for some time." But even Gen. Myers had to admit that U.S. forces have made absolutely no progress over the past year. Iraq's insurgency remains undiminished in its capabilities in the past year despite U.S.-led efforts to crush the rebels, the top American general said on Tuesday. "I think their capacity stays about the same," Air Force Gen. Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said of Iraq's insurgents during a Pentagon briefing. "And where they are right now is where they were almost a year ago." [snip] Myers said rebels are staging 50 or 60 attacks a day in Iraq after the number had dipped to about 40 daily. He said the number of daily attacks is about the same as a year ago.

Posted by: Max at April 27, 2005 12:37 PM (HFKAk)

20 The number of serious international terrorist incidents more than tripled last year, according to U.S. government figures, a sharp upswing in deadly attacks that the State Department has decided not to make public in its annual report on terrorism due to Congress this week. Overall, the number of what the U.S. government considers "significant" attacks grew to about 655 last year, up from the record of around 175 in 2003, according to congressional aides who were briefed on statistics covering incidents including the bloody school seizure in Russia and violence related to the disputed Indian territory of Kashmir [...] "Last year was bad. This year is worse. They are deliberately trying to withhold data because it shows that as far as the war on terrorism internationally, we're losing," said Larry C. Johnson, a former senior State Department counterterrorism official, who first revealed the decision not to publish the data.

Posted by: Freemen at April 27, 2005 12:39 PM (HFKAk)

21 Hey you toolbags! This is about syria

Posted by: Obsnooks at April 27, 2005 12:46 PM (yBHNA)

22 Offcourse Syria has chemical weapons! Their no 1 enemy is Israel, which has nuclear (and chemical?) weapons. Very effective weapons to keep baddies outside. If you like it or not, scum like the Syrian Baathists and the North Korean communists appreciate this.

Posted by: Lennard Vogelaar at April 27, 2005 12:53 PM (rEp/L)

23 OBsnooks To the moonbat, the only topic is ensuring that their worldview is supported.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 27, 2005 01:04 PM (jPCiN)

24 OK which one of you punks is the hack. bastard. By the way I recovered anyway.

Posted by: Howie at April 27, 2005 01:07 PM (D3+20)

25 Wonder what happened to Dr. Blaha

Posted by: Filthy Allah at April 27, 2005 01:08 PM (yBHNA)

26 "So, Greg hates the Jew now. Greg hates America, Gays, blacks & now Jews."-Filthy For the record, I don't hate Jews, just Israel. I love America-the Constitutional Republic not the fascist state. Gays are OK as long as they're not flamers like Earl Dittman. I've got nothing against blacks.

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 01:25 PM (/+dAV)

27 Freeman, unfortunately your numbers are bogus since the methodology used changed from year to year.

Posted by: Rusty Shackleford at April 27, 2005 01:28 PM (JQjhA)

28 It appears I might need apologize here. Sorry, my mouth tends to overload my ass. The problem appears to be an iffy power supply at this point. The old girl is on borrowed time. anyone else getting strange behavior on this site today??

Posted by: Howie at April 27, 2005 01:37 PM (D3+20)

29 Dr. Greg, you are so filled with hate it consumes you. YOu only hate flamers? Right. YOu despise anyone that is not just like you. A hate filled bigot. You hate israel? THen you hate the Jew. You disgust me.

Posted by: Filthy Allah at April 27, 2005 01:48 PM (yBHNA)

30 So Freeman, What is the acceptable amount of terrorist attacks in your mind? Should we be appeasing them like the Spanish, French, Germans and Russians? Not really working for them but, that is what the liberals want.

Posted by: Ob Snooks at April 27, 2005 01:50 PM (yBHNA)

31 You hate israel? THen you hate the Jew. You disgust me.-Filthy Are you Jewish Filthy? Be disgusted if you wish, but there are plenty of good peace loving Jews. For example: http://www.jppi.org/ Â“Jews for Peace in Palestine and Israel (JPPI) is a group of American Jews who believe that a just, comprehensive, and lasting peace in Palestine and Israel is attainable through negotiations based on international law and the implementation of relevant United Nations (UN) resolutions. We believe that as Jews outside of Israel, we have both a right and obligation to speak out in favor of an Israel that pursues peaceful, ethical, just, and democratic policies.Â”

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 02:01 PM (/+dAV)

32 Dr. Blaha hate da jew.

Posted by: Ob Snooks at April 27, 2005 02:07 PM (yBHNA)

33 Ah, that Jew loving orginization known as the UN. It seems as if their definition of a good Jew is one that doesn't complain when he is busy being blown up on a bus, or a disco, or a pizza parlor. Have any condemnation for the Pali's greg? Perhaps you just like to cut to the chase and call those murders retaliation.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 27, 2005 02:21 PM (jPCiN)

34 What should the Palestinians do? Throw stones at tanks?

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 02:34 PM (/+dAV)

35 Perhaps they could start with stopping support of those who blow up busses.

Posted by: Rusty Shackleford at April 27, 2005 02:36 PM (JQjhA)

36 They should keep killing as many Israelis as they can, by any means possible, until the Israelis want to get serious about peace talks.

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 02:43 PM (/+dAV)

37 Israeli governments who bulldoze homes with women and children still in them, attack refugee camps, kill innocent people with indescriminant machine gun fire, and build aparteid walls are JUST AS GUILTY as Palestinians who bomb innocents in cafes and on buses. Intelligent discussion will NEVER occur until both sides and their supporters acknowledge this to each other. Peace in that region will only happen if one thing occurs - The United States grows some balls and tells Israel they have two years to achieve permanent, lasting peace with Palestine and return the land they stole, or every dime they recieve from us will be cut off. Reciporically, Palestine will receive no financial or humanitarian support until they achieve a stable government of their own and prosecute all who try to break the agreement. Personally, I believe the Israeli and American leadership (both past and present)is far more responsible for this mess than Palestine. Also, If you do any kind of research at all, you'll find public opinion polls in Israeli newspapers and other sources showing that nearly half the Jewish population is against what the Israeli government is doing, and would prefer open dialogue and REAL peace agreements with the Palestinians. It's not an easy situation to deal with, but labeling anyone a "Jew Hater" because they're against the policies of the Israeli government is not only a tired excuse, but an incredibly ignorant one as well.

Posted by: deccles at April 27, 2005 02:50 PM (UCtX/)

38 No, greg, that kind of talk will only get ALL of the pali's killed. If it was happening here, it would have already happened.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 27, 2005 02:50 PM (jPCiN)

39 New York Times Minimizes Palestinian Deaths we found that in 2004, at a time when 8 Israeli children and 176 Palestinian children were killed Â– a ratio of 1 to 22 Â– Times headlines and lead paragraphs reported on Israeli childrenÂ’s deaths at a rate almost seven times greater than Palestinian childrenÂ’s deaths. http://www.counterpunch.org/weir04252005.html

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 02:52 PM (/+dAV)

40 Once again we get an 'expert' on ME peace who puts the entire brunt of the situation on the Israelis. Deccles, the orginizations known as Hamas and Hizbollah will never stop killing the Jews. It's what they do, and until you wrap your head around that little nugget, you will only sound like a clueless twit when offering your 'advice'.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 27, 2005 02:54 PM (jPCiN)

41 deccles, Well said.

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 02:55 PM (/+dAV)

42 Â“The Bush White House gay sex scandal heats up, as new revelations show that fake reporter and male prostitute Jeff Gannon "slept over" on numerous occasions at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.Â” Â“These records reveal that the White House is like a Gay Roach Motel -- they check in but they don't check outÂ” http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=65&contentid=2123 Either W likes it up the rump or W likes watching Laura getting long-stroked.

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 03:04 PM (/+dAV)

43 First counterpunch then conspiracyplanet. Are you off your meds again greg?

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 27, 2005 03:06 PM (jPCiN)

44 Jeff Gannon is going to become Bush's Monica Lewinsky.

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 03:06 PM (/+dAV)

45 As long as the Pali's teach their kids that Jews drink Pali kid blood for passover, then nothing will change.

Posted by: Filthy Allah at April 27, 2005 03:27 PM (yBHNA)

46 You mean they don't? Have you seen that fat slob Sharon's gut lately? He has two Palestinian babies for breakfast every morning with his bagels.

Posted by: greg at April 27, 2005 03:32 PM (/+dAV)

47 Hey folks let's not lose focus here on what the mission is - crushing the enemies "silly little asses" and wiping their cult-like religious ideology of hate and evil, Islamofascisim," from the face of the earth. For more see my comment I posted over at Capt Ed's site: HSPIG Blog and why you're fretting over this here's a way you can spend all this nervious enery expended here on something that just might be productive: HSPIG Link Screw the MSM they are no longer relevant and in fact there is plenty of evidence to suggest they are rooting for the enemy in the GWOT!

Posted by: Ron Wright at April 27, 2005 04:55 PM (wIdaE)

48 Greg give it a rest, It's obvious you hate the jews, the rest is convenient ad-hoc for you. Israel won that land fair and square from the raiding marauders back in 1947, they defeated an overwhelming number of enemies in 1967 and another invasion in 1973. They gave back all of the Sinai and only asked peace in return. Of course, they did not throw out the troublesome Pali's after the takeover. The Pali's were always too stupid to realise they've been defeated, never know when to quit and just continue to cause trouble and bitch about their lost land. They'd gain more from peaceful methods, but they rather keep the destruction going. So go ahead and blame it all on Israel like the Pali's do... An Israeli doctor was treating an severly injured Palestian kid, did family appreciate or thank the doctor? Nope, he survived only by Gods will.

Posted by: IM at April 27, 2005 05:27 PM (a9tRx)

49 Bashar Al-Assad is almost as bad as Saddam Hussein.

Posted by: Anwar at April 27, 2005 05:40 PM (8vKPW)

50 Well, hes not as reckless as Saddam but he doesnt like democracy either.

Posted by: Anwar at April 27, 2005 05:42 PM (8vKPW)

51 IM - you have no idea what you talking about.

Posted by: Jim at April 27, 2005 06:00 PM (jcSwY)

52 If you've got something to say then say it.

Posted by: IM at April 27, 2005 06:41 PM (a9tRx)

53 Jews gathering into Israel during and after world wars was just colonization, they went there, took the natives land and fought against them until the natives didn't have the people and resources to create effective counter offenses. So Jews have a right to their country now, but if the Palis can organize a massive slaughter that drives them out of there, they have earned the right to claim the land, due to arabs owning it for milleniums.

Posted by: A Finn at April 28, 2005 04:25 AM (cWMi4)

54 The Israel haters never mention the fact that when things really got heated up around 1920 the Arabs did not attack who they called the Zionist newcomers. They attacked the Jewish families and civilians that had been living in the region for 2,000 years. Not only had they been simply living there, they had been there under Muslim rule for centuries and being good dhimmis. Here are some of the dhimma laws they had to live under: * dhimmi people had to cede the center of the road to Muslims; * the only animal they could ride was a donkey; * they could not testify against a Muslim in court; * they could not build houses taller than those of Muslims; * they could not build new places of worship; * they had to pray quietly so as not to offend the ears of passing Muslims; * a dhimmi man could not so much as touch a Muslim woman but a Muslim man could take Jewish or Christian women as wives; * a dhimmi could not defend himself if physically assaulted by a Muslim; * dhimmis could not bear arms; * dhimmis had to pay a special tax every year and were treated in humiliating fashion when paying it; * in public, dhimmis had to wear distinctive clothing, intentionally designed to be humiliating; * at least in the 9th century, dhimmis had to nail wooden images of devils to their doors; I'd be mad too. And now in more recent times can anyone tell me how many UN "resolutions" have been leveled against Israel? I'll tell you; somewhere around 23. How many against the Palestinians? "0"

Posted by: Oyster at April 28, 2005 07:25 AM (YudAC)

55 I find this whole string sooo entertaining. People its simple: Jewish fundamantalism, Christian fundamantalism, Muslim fundamantalism, or anyone from Montana will always give us interesting moments in our lives: Oklahoma City, 9/11, etc. Angry people in combat fatigues talking to God over a two way radio, and mumbeling incoherent rantings about freedom will give us many more interesting moments in life. I just can't wait till white supremist cattle-F####r's like grey rooster carries out the ideas that the new Aryan Nation leader is espousing as their new friend to be used in destroying all those who are against the white brotherhood: Al Queda. WOOW! Can't wait to see this one, lone wolves sitting in the corner of their nuclear bunker spanking the monkey while watching tattered copies of "Red Dawn" and "Turner Daries", all this while waiting for their mujahedeen friends to come over for a "stomping".

Posted by: Salamander at April 28, 2005 08:07 AM (W2YA6)

56 "Not only had they been simply living there, they had been there under Muslim rule for centuries and being good dhimmis."-Oyster They Jews should have left well enough alone and there would still be peace today. "And now in more recent times can anyone tell me how many UN "resolutions" have been leveled against Israel? I'll tell you; somewhere around 23. How many against the Palestinians? "0""-Oyster Is this statement meant to support Israel? It seems more like an idictment to me.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 08:15 AM (/+dAV)

57 Jewish fundamantalism, Christian fundamantalism, Muslim fundamantalism, or anyone from Montana will always give us interesting moments in our lives: I've been saying for a long time we need to build a wall around the state of Montana. Glad someone else is on board. They Jews should have left well enough alone and there would still be peace today. Yes, greg, and if the black folk had just accepted their enslavement and the uppity woman had just stayed in the kitchen... Not a big fan of Patrick Henry, or history for that matter, I see.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 28, 2005 08:29 AM (jPCiN)

58 Defense Guy, You don't know shit you ZioNazi. Don't wave your one-sided view of history around as if it was Gospel.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 08:41 AM (/+dAV)

59 And here I was wondering when you would get around to calling me Nazi. Do you get a lot of dates telling the womanfolk to take off their shoes and get back in the kitchen? I didn't think you believed in the gospels. I guess you learn something new everyday, or were you being ironic?

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 28, 2005 08:49 AM (jPCiN)

60 Defense Guy, comon you are just being so progressive ... Greg can't help it if the world just evolves like that. No email, no fax , no phone call to notify him about those changes ... AH! just how is he going to tell the women that he is standing in the way of change and progress, but needs his cloths washed by sundown?

Posted by: Salamander at April 28, 2005 08:59 AM (F26eZ)

61 THE LAVON AFFAIR In 1954, Israeli agents working in Egypt planted bombs in several buildings, including a United States diplomatic facility, and left evidence behind implicating Arabs as the culprits. The ruse would have worked, had not one of the bombs detonated prematurely, allowing the Egyptians to capture and identify one of the bombers, which in turn led to the round up of an Israeli spy ring. Some of the spies were from Israel, while others were recruited from the local Jewish population. Israel responded to the scandal with claims in the media that there was no spy ring, that it was all a hoax perpetrated by "anti-Semites". But as the public trial progressed, it was evident that Israel had indeed been behind the bombing. Eventually, Israeli's Defense Minister Pinhas Lavon was brought down by the scandal, although it appears that he was himself the victim of a frame-up by the real authors of the bombing project, code named "Operation Susannah." It is therefore a fact that Israel has a prior history of setting off bombs with the intent to blame Arabs for them. This is not the only example of a "False Flag" operation designed to trick the United States into attacking Israel's enemies. According to Victor Ostrovsky, a Mossad defector now living in Canada, Ronald Reagan was tricked into bombing Libya by means of a radio transmitter smuggled into Tripoli by the Mossad, which broadcast messages designed to fool the United States into thinking Libya was about to launch a massive terror attack on the west. On the basis of this fake evidence, the US bombed Libya, killing Khadaffi's daughter. The Jews of Iraq is a story by a Jewish writer revealing yet another false flag operation where Israelis used bombs and planted the blame on Arabs More recently, Captain Ward Boston, who served as senior legal counsel for the Navy's Court of Inquiry into the Israeli attack on USS Liberty, has come forward to report that the Court of Inquiry was ORDERED to conclude that the attack was an accident by President Lyndon Johnson. In hindsight, given the use of unmarked aircraft and boats by Israel during the actual attack, it appears that Israel intended to sink the US ship and frame Egypt for the attack, tricking the US into the war against Egypt. "By Way of Deception, We Shall Make War" The Motto of the Mossad

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 09:04 AM (/+dAV)

62 Greg, DidnÂ’t the bombing of Libya have something to do with the Libyans blowing up a 747 over Scotland?

Posted by: Brad at April 28, 2005 09:17 AM (HoSBk)

63 1954. Jim Crowe was still in effect in THIS country. The Soviets still had their jackboot firmly placed on the necks of much of the world. France loses Dien Bien Phu and starts to think that Vietnam might not be worth keeping. If you are trying to convince me that Israel is not perfect or angelic, then you can stop. I already know that.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 28, 2005 09:17 AM (jPCiN)

64 greg, you had me there for a few moments, until you mixed it up with the USS Liberty. Then you lost me. What crap. I'm the resident expert on the USS Liberty. I've always said, let the Leftists and Israel-haters keep talking. Eventually they say too much and go too far, and it all falls apart.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 09:19 AM (8e/V4)

65 "I'm the resident expert on the USS Liberty."-Carlos Please Professor, preach.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 09:31 AM (/+dAV)

66 Defense Guy, precisely right. The Lybia bombing was a culmination of a whole series of events, including the Lockerbie downing, the Berlin disco bombing, the "Line of Death" confrontation, etc. Leftists said the disco bombing was a hoax too, but the Berlin court found otherwise and convicted a Libyan diplomat, and a couple of palestinians and a Bulgarian in connection with it. The evidence must have been quite specific if they snagged a Bulgarian. Re the USS Liberty, recently released TRANSCRIPTS of Israeli pilots, as well as personal accounts by a pilot breaking his silence, confirms they believed the USS Liberty was an Egyptian vessel.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 09:35 AM (8e/V4)

67 Please Professor, Preach. greg, please don't make me. I've done it once too often and it bores me to death. And I'm not going to change your mind.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 09:36 AM (8e/V4)

68 I meant to say Israeli chopper pilots, as well as jet fighter pilots.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 09:37 AM (8e/V4)

69 "DidnÂ’t the bombing of Libya have something to do with the Libyans blowing up a 747 over Scotland?"-Brad No, I don't believe so. Pan Am Flight 103 was brought down over Lockerbie in 1988. Whereas the US bombing of Lybia occured in 1986. Double check me on this, I could be mistaken.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 09:40 AM (/+dAV)

70 you're right greg.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 09:44 AM (8e/V4)

71 Brad, I double checked myself and I'm correct. We bombed Lybia 2 years before the crash of Pan Am Flight 103 in Lockerbie Scotland. So Carlos is mistaken on this point.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 09:46 AM (/+dAV)

72 greg, Ghaddafi agreed to pay compensation for the victims of the disco bombing. Hardly the behaviour of an Arab leader framed by the Mossad.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 09:48 AM (8e/V4)

73 "greg, please don't make me. I've done it once too often and it bores me to death. And I'm not going to change your mind."-Carlos You're right. I doubt you'd change my mind but you might "educate" some of the other readers.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 09:50 AM (/+dAV)

74 More interesting info on the disco bombing alleged Mossad frame-up. Much of the info used to convict the perpetrators came from East Germany Stasi files after the wall fell. Files planted by the Mossad? Not likely. It was those Stasi files that led the cops to a Lybian diplomat and some palestinians.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 09:51 AM (8e/V4)

75 My mistake Greg.

Posted by: Brad at April 28, 2005 09:51 AM (HoSBk)

76 "Ghaddafi agreed to pay compensation for the victims of the disco bombing."-Carlos Yes, in the long term it was the prudent thing to do even if they were innocent. It's not like it was his money. You can't fight city hall and you damn sure can't fight America.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 09:53 AM (/+dAV)

77 "Much of the info used to convict the perpetrators came from East Germany Stasi files after the wall fell. Files planted by the Mossad? Not likely."-Carlos Files planted by the CIA? Quite likely.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 09:57 AM (/+dAV)

78 greg, These boogeymen you love to hate so much beat the Soviets and kept you free. Why do you shit on them at every opportunity without any evidence.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 10:00 AM (8e/V4)

79 I don't hate America Carlito. I love the Constitutional Republic. And when I "shit" I always have evidence.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 10:13 AM (/+dAV)

80 THE ISRAELI ATTACK ON THE U.S. LIBERTY It was during the 6 day war on June 8, 1967. It was a clear day and a ship lay in the Mediterranean off Egypt's coast and Old Glory was flying for God and everyone else to see. There could be no mistake about it, this was the USS Liberty, an American intelligence gathering ship. Suddenly, Israeli planes circled the ship more than a dozen times. Then they unleashed hell. The Americans called in a distress call but no help was sent. The Israelis strafed, bombed and torpedoed the ship for nearly 2 hours. When all was done, 34 brave Americans lay dead and more than 170 wounded. A 70% casualty rate. The Israelis claimed they mistook the USS Liberty for an Egyptian ship and this explanation was excepted by the US military. But not a single survivor of the attack believes that lie. The American flag had flown proudly for 2 hours during the attack. Only Israel could get away with bitch slapping America like that.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 10:16 AM (/+dAV)

81 greg, I'm not going to play. Needless to say, the record and TRANSCRIPTS from the Israeli pilots indicate they believed it was an Egyptian vessel.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 10:18 AM (8e/V4)

82 greg hates America. Don't listen to his lies. He also happens to think that posting links to the insane counts as evidence.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 28, 2005 10:23 AM (jPCiN)

83 More pilot TRANSCRIPTS: MIGDAL: Can you identify the target? KURSA: Can you identify his target, Migdal? KURSA: She's running from you in the direction of El Arish, correction, Port Said. What is it? What is it? A destroyer? A patrol boat? What is it? MIGDAL: Kursa, Can you manage to identify it? KURSA: I can't identify it, but in any case it's a military ship. MIGDAL: OK, what is it? KURSA: It has one mast and one smokestack MIGDAL: Roger KURSA: It has one mast up front. Later in the attack: SHIMON: Kislev, there's doubt as to the identification. KISLEV: If there is a doubt, don't attack. SHIMON: Don't attack Menachem. ROBERT: Pay attention. There is doubt as to the identification. (Robert consults with a naval liaison officer in his headquarters) KISLEV: What does that mean? ROBERT: OK, you can go in. (apparently resolving the issue with the Navy) KISLEV: You may go in. KURSA: Affirmative, you have permission, Royal. Still further in the attack: ROYAL: Homeland from Royal, do you read me? Pay attention. This ship's markings are Charlie-Tango-Romeo 5. There is no flag on her! She looks like a minesweeper with that marking. Roger, I'm leaving her. I'm staying around one more minute. (the Liberty's correct markings were GTR-5) Later in the attack: KISLEV: Leave her! (his flat tone changes dramatically as he realizes this was no Egyptian ship) ROBERT: Leave her. What ship is this? KISLEV: Leave her. (he says tersely) Menachem report the approximate damage. (Redirect) 116 to its original mission. And soon thereafter: MENACHEM: Kislev, what country? KISLEV: Apparently American. Attack is called off. Transcripts published at Jpost: http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1086230742987&apage=1

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 10:40 AM (8e/V4)

84 Carlos, Easy to fabricate such a tape. I wouldn't give much credence to it. How does one mistake an American Intelligence vessel for an Egyptian Supply ship for 2 hours when the ship is flying an American flag. Now if the duration of the incident were only 5 minutes that MIGHT be believable. But for nearly 2 hours? No way. I''m going to let you slide on calling me an SOB, but it seems out of character for you. This must REALLY bother you.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 10:46 AM (/+dAV)

85 Easy to fabricate such a tape. greg, buddy of mine is a conspiracy theorist. I no longer argue with him because whenever evidence shatters his worldview it must be "fabricated." And I'm talking hard evidence, like these tapes. In fact, to him, the more credible the evidence the stronger the PROOF it's a conspiracy. It's funny how you all think alike.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 10:58 AM (8e/V4)

86 Carlos, Give your buddy this link, he'll love you for it. http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article7545.htm If you thought your buddy was irrational he wouldn't be your buddy.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 11:04 AM (/+dAV)

87 ISRAELI SPIES IN AMERICA The United States gives three BILLION dollars to Israel every year. ThatÂ’s $500 for every Jewish Israeli. The American taxpayers foot this bill. What do we get in return? We get spied on by Israel. In 1985, Jonathon Pollard, an American Jew working at the Pentagon, stole enough U.S. classified secrets to fill a closet including technology that Israel then traded to the USSR in return for relaxing emigration laws for Soviet Jews wanting to go to Israel. HeÂ’s considered a hero in Israel and is currently in an American prison. This technology cost the American taxpayers billions of dollars and we are still paying for it to this very day. Furthermore, this transfer of technology has endangered the American people. http://www.capitolhillblue.com/artman/publish/article_6397.shtml As we speak, the American Israeli Public Affairs Committee "AIPAC" is being investigated for transfer of classified material from the Pentagon to Israel. The problem is that there are many many American Jews in highly sensitive positions within the Pentagon and elsewhere whose primary allegiance is to Israel not America. So called Â“Israeli FirstersÂ”. http://www.warandpiece.com/blogdirs/001514.html In the months just before and after 9-11, over 200 Israeli spies were caught in the United States and whisked quietly back to Israel. This was reported by Brit Hume and Carl Cameron of Fox News in a 4 part series on Dec. 11-14, 2001 and was then removed from FoxÂ’s website on Dec. 15, 2001. In the report, a senior U.S. intelligence agent was asked if the spy ring was in anyway related to 9-11 and he said, Â“This information is classified, I cannot speak about itÂ”. This 4 part series is still available at: http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article7545.htm I highly recommend that you listen to these reports. TheyÂ’re about 5 minutes long each. With friends like this, who needs enemies? Wake up and smell the bagels.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 11:07 AM (/+dAV)

88 greg, difference between Israeli spies and Arab spies is Israelis don't use the info to damage us, but Arab spies do. Pollard discovered that information vital to Israel's security was being deliberately withheld by certain elements within the U.S. national security establishment. Israel was legally entitled to this vital security information according to a 1983 Memorandum of Understanding between the two countries. He was indicted on only one charge: one count of passing classified information to an ally, without intent to harm the United States. See the diff?

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 11:20 AM (8e/V4)

89 Israel traded nuclear secrets that Pollard stole to the Russians in exchange for relaxed emigration rules. This was during the cold war. Do you understand the severity of the situation? Do you understand why the United States levied a life sentence on Pollard? Do you put Israel before America? You're not a Traitor are you?

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 11:26 AM (/+dAV)

90 greg, my buddy is a religious christian, and I appreciate such people, that's why we're buddies. But his politics aren't worth a dime. And he's not a very logical thinker. And when he doesn't like certain evidence, they must be "fabricated." Amazing how you used the same language. CIA planted Stasi files-- also fabricated. As if such files could just be printed off on Word and passed off as aged commie docs. Your worldview takes great faith. Israel has no vital interest in resurrecting a dead issue. The tapes, and corroborating pilot testimony, are real.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 11:28 AM (8e/V4)

91 "Israel was legally entitled to this vital security information according to a 1983 Memorandum of Understanding between the two countries."-Carlos BULLSHIT! Then why did the US give him a life sentence?

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 11:29 AM (/+dAV)

92 greg, show me proof that Pollard passed off secrets to the Soviets. I think that's a lie. And when you show me the evidence, prove to me it's not fabricated. That's the game we're going to play now.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 11:30 AM (8e/V4)

93 The proof is in the puddin'. He was given a llife sentence by the United States.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 11:37 AM (/+dAV)

94 They should have shot the bastard.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 28, 2005 11:49 AM (jPCiN)

95 "They should have shot the bastard."-Defense Guy We are still paying the consequences today. Jonathan Pollard Was No Jewish Patriot by Eric Margolis The Toronto Sun, Jan. 14, 1999 Â“Some of the enormously sensitive secrets stolen by Pollard may have been either sold, or bartered, by Israel to the Soviet Union. A number of key CIA agents in the East Bloc were allegedly executed as a result of Pollard's spying. The KGB likely gained access to top-secret U.S. codes - either directly from Israel, or through spies in Israel's government. In short, Pollard's treachery caused one of the worst security disasters in modern U.S. history.Â” http://www.aci.net/kalliste/pollard_em.htm

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 11:52 AM (/+dAV)

96 The proof is in the puddin' greg, that's exactly the kind of sloppy conclusions that drive conspiracy theories. During his time in jail awaiting trial, Pollard was hopeful that Israel would intercede on his behalf. Instead, Israel cooperated with the U.S. government in its efforts to nail him. They agreed to turn over all the documents that Pollard had given them. PollardÂ’s attorneys cut a deal with the prosecution. Their client would plead guilty if the prosecutors would not ask for the maximum sentence-- death. The deal was accepted. The reasons as to his harsh sentence are still in dispute today. Also, there is nothing in the record about selling secrets to the Soviets. Another lie by the Israel-haters. And please, nothing by Counterpunch if you can help it. Read this very detailed account for some of the theories. The account doesn't appear to have an axe to grind: From Court TV's crime Library http://www.crimelibrary.com/terrorists_spies/spies/pollard/1.html?sect=23

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 11:57 AM (8e/V4)

97 Carlos, Why don't you bake him some sugar cookies. I believe he's in Marion prison.

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 12:02 PM (/+dAV)

98 Carlos Irregardless, the man was given the trust of the American government (or a branch of it) and hence of the people. He betrayed that trust in the interest of another country. It doesn't matter one iota which country it was for, or whether it was an ally or not. He is lucky he escaped with his life.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 28, 2005 12:05 PM (jPCiN)

99 "Some of the enormously sensitive secrets stolen by Pollard may have been either sold, or bartered, by Israel to the Soviet Union." greg, zero proof of that. At least I give you "fabricated" evidence. From your incredibly biased article: "With remarkable chutzpah, Israel, which receives up to $5 billion in U.S. aid annually," and? Also: "While Israeli PM Benjamin Netanyahu kept calling for Pollard's release on "humanitarian" grounds, he refused to free prisoner of conscience Mordechai Vanunu," and? Try a source without such immense axes to grind.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 12:08 PM (8e/V4)

100 Defense Guy, I'm not that concerned about his sentence. But there's a difference between allies spying and enemies spying. The U.S. also spies on Israel, as most allies do. You don't see people using that to drive a wedge between these allies, do you? Allies spy on each other. Always have, always will. But only the haters would try to use it as a wedge.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 12:11 PM (8e/V4)

101 Bake some sugar cookies for him!

Posted by: greg at April 28, 2005 12:13 PM (/+dAV)

102 funny greg

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 12:15 PM (8e/V4)

103 I have no interest in using it as a wedge, but I take your point. However, I will not excuse this bastard just because he spied for an allied country. I would be curious to know of Israelis imprisoned for providing information to the US. If there are any, I am sadly ignorant of their existence.

Posted by: Defense Guy at April 28, 2005 12:19 PM (jPCiN)

104 I am hereby invoking Godwin's Law.

Posted by: Oyster at April 28, 2005 04:14 PM (fl6E1)

105 Oyster, just so you know, there is a codicil to that law which says that any intentional invocation of Godwin's law for its thread-ending effects will be unsuccessful.

Posted by: Carlos at April 28, 2005 04:49 PM (8e/V4)

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