I'll admit it, I'm a Dan Simmons fan. Both
deal with the time paradox problem & I loved both books. Incidentally, one of the major heroes of the Hyperion series is a Muslim.
On that note, what if some one was to come back from the near future and warn you about the coming War with Islam, Eurabia, & a future global caliphate? And what if it was your society's own damn fault that they are enslaved in the future because they were so self-critical and unwilling to engage in the ruthlessness needed to win a war?
I tried to relax. “What do you want to talk about?” I said.
“The Century War,” said the Time Traveler.
I blinked and tried to remember some history. “You mean the Hundred Year War? Fifteenth Century? Fourteenth? Sometime around there. Between . . . France and England? Henry V? Kenneth Branagh? Or was it . . .”
“I mean the Century War with Islam,” interrupted the Time Traveler. “Your future. Everyone’s.” He was no longer smiling. Without asking, or offering to pour me any, he stood, refilled his Scotch glass, and sat again. He said, “It was important to me to come back to this time early on in the struggle. Even if only to remind myself of how unspeakably blind you all were.”
“You mean the War on Terrorism,” I said.
“I mean the Long War with Islam,” he said. “The Century War. And it’s not over yet where I come from. Not close to being over.”
“You can’t have a war with Islam,” I said. “You can’t go to war against a religion. Radical Islam, maybe. Jihadism. Some extremists. But not a . . . the . . . religion itself. The vast majority of Muslims in the world are peaceloving people who wish us no harm. I mean . . . I mean . . . the very word ‘Islam’ means ‘Peace.’”
“So you kept telling yourselves,” said the Time Traveler. His voice was very low but there was a strange and almost frightening edge to it. “But the ‘peace’ in ‘Islam’ means ‘Submission.’ You’ll find that out soon enough”
Great, I was thinking. Of all the time travelers in all the gin joints in all the world, I get this racist, xenophobic, right-wing asshole.
“After Nine-eleven, we’re fighting terrorism,” I began, “not . . .”
He waved me into silence.....[snip]
Posted by: Howie at April 10, 2006 03:28 PM (D3+20)
Posted by: MiB at April 10, 2006 03:44 PM (2hPsb)
3
Too far fetched! Come on now - lets be honest and say what we really think!
The only reasons Islam is in the headlines is 1)(most important) OIL and 2) (less important) Israel.
When the industrialized world develops a viable alternative to petroleum - Islam, Arabs, the whole lot will fade back into backwater 10th century oblivion trying to figure out how to manufacture toilet paper!
Does anybody seriously fear these people? Beyond their perchance for senseless cruel violence (which BTW - they tend to inflict on themselves 90% of the time!) they are freakin' idiots!
I am tired of people building this group up like some kind of giant! Yeah! They had their moment for a few centuries a thousand years ago - when the competition was a heavily divided Europe stuck in the Dark Ages and constantly at war with each other!
Now and the distant forseeable future belongs still to the West and Asia - as it has during most of the past!
Islam, like a few other "regions" of this world remain a sideshow of on again-off again interest - best left to a National Geographic Special of quiant customs and costumes.
Stop whining and fretting about Islam! Does anyone really believe we got to being on top by being whining pussies? Does anyone really believe our current crop of whining pussies would simply give it all up - in the face of ISLAM? (They may be lame - but they are not stupid - and really like being on top as much as we all (they just won't admit it).
Worry about real adversaries - like the Chinese, Japanese, the Euros (when they get their heads out of their asses), the Russians (yes - they will be back because they are tough talented SOBS).
ISLAM?????
Posted by: hondo at April 10, 2006 04:25 PM (4mgfY)
4
Hondo, the other civilizations you mention generally value this life more than the "afterlife". The problem with muslim radicals is they willingly die and take others with them. A nuclear weapon in their hands doesn't bear thinking of.
They will always be an irritation to the planet and I think using the term "civilization" when referring to Islam is a loose one.
Posted by: Jester at April 10, 2006 04:46 PM (TuAMG)
5
Jester
I understand that - they can be dangerous - like a pitbull - but a pitbull is still just a dog! I fear we are making the same stupid mistake multi-cultural diversity believers make by unwarrantly "building up" another culture - in their case - unwarranted achievements and respect - in ours - unwarranted fear and the respect that comes with it.
For god's sake! How many tanks, planes, bombers, warships etc. are manufactured in the islamic world? - ZILCH! NADA! ZERO!
The preferred rifle - an AK-47 (made in Russia, China or Yugoslavia) - not a Mohammed-18!!!!
Their missiles - cheap obsolete export from China - or worse - cheaper clones from NK!
Yeah! They are make some newer ones - based on the cheap NK obsolete clones!
Am I the only one willing to say the biggest problem a country like Iran will have with nukes is the dud factor!
Have we forgotten that during the first Gulf War some of the Scuds fired by Saddam had concrete warheads! WHY? He had the warheads - he had the Chemical ones too - but they need to be installed first! What was installed was done prior by Russian technicians! The Iraqis didn't know how!
When the islamic world starts manufacturing flat screen TVs, computer components, cars that can compete with Nissen or Saab etc. - then I will give them the respect of fear.
Lets be honest! Our "fears" aren't about islam - they are about ourselves - our own insecurities whether we still got it or not!
God! the Asians must be giggling behind our backs over our "uncertainties". No self-respecting Chinaman would go weak-kneed at the sight of islam! This whole debate is embarrassing!
Posted by: hondo at April 10, 2006 06:49 PM (4mgfY)
6
hondo,
I rarely ever disagree with you, but just this one time I do. I remember reading about a man in a small city in an unimportant peninsula in a desert who had a dream. He wanted his people to be something more than a bunch of warring tribes beheading and murdering each other and fighting over caravans of supplies moving through the deserts. He claimed to be a prophet, was forced out of the city he knew and occupied another city. There a religion and a force grew.
After a few short years, and the conquest of the city he had to flee, this man and his followers came riding out of the desert to face two great powers of the ancient World, the Persian Empire and the Byzantine Empire. How would it be possible for these people to defeat these great ancient powers? Within 100 years, all of the Middle East, North Africa, Spain, southern France, the Persian Empire(which consisted of Iraq, Iran, and other parts of Asia), Syria, and parts of Anatolia had fallen to these invaders.
It was only possible for these two great powers to lose large parts of their empires or to be conquered because they had populations who were fractured, where unity had been destroyed, and large numbers of people felt no loyalty to the empires they lived in. Does this sound familiar? In other words, the people had gone soft.
Has this happened to us? Yes, to some extent this process is rotting the US, and has left Europe only a shell of what it once was. The West is at a crossroads. Can it recover? I think the jury is still out on the US, but Europe as a whole will not fight. This is a major problem for the West, because Europe, especially GB, had been the major power in the World for 300 years. France is gone, Germany is consumed by self-hate, and Italy and Spain are only interested in the status quo. The West may or may not survive, but if it does, it is time right now to take the action necessary to assure that survival.
Posted by: jesusland joe at April 10, 2006 08:00 PM (rUyw4)
7
JJ
Sorry - no. When Rome collapsed in 476AD that whole region of the world went to hell in a handbasket fast - they don't call it the Dark Ages for nothing. The Byzantine Empire was an empty shell (like the later Holy Roman Empire - a grand title - nothing more. The Parthian/Persian empire was in the same situation - it was like without Rome to compete against, there was no real reason to be.
Islam was born (by luck) into a world regional void of self-doubt, fracture and collapse. There was absolutely no unity whatsoever to oppose it.
The region was filled with mini-states only nominally politically associated (on paper no less) with larger entities (like the Byzantine Empire - kinda like the relationship with a guy on the western Tennessee frontier circa 1750 and King George in London).
Christianity already had it first breakup (East/West) and the Eastern churches were arguing amongst themselves. People also tend to forget that at this point in Euro history, most Europeans WERE NOT CHRISTIANS! THEY WERE PAGANS!
I believe the last region in Europe to be Christianized was the Eastern Baltic around 1200!!!
Islam is a religion - a unifying factor that spread rapidly amongst pagan Arab/North African populations that were no longer under the control or influence of any outside power of substance - and unity at that point in time easily lent itself to the world's second oldest profession - world conquest. Their "victories" were inevitable - there was no one to stop them! They were in much the same situation as the Euro barbarians were in at Rome's end - easy pickings.
Islam was not monolithic in its conquests! It was Arabs, Moors, Berbers, Turkmen, Kurds etc all out grabbing a piece of the world under the faux banner of Allah - it was just convenient! lots of voices - one false face for PR purposes - and they conquered and slaugthered each other with equal gusto.
Much of the Arab/islamic world history is more myth than anything else. It would be like giving credit to the Ukranians for exploring and navigating the world - even though it was the English, Portuguese etc. - but using the rationale that the Ukranians are white Euro Christians too - just like the English etc. See how it works.
Arab time in the sun was extremely short-lived (a few centuries only). the Turks took over the regional ballgame next and held most of it till the early 20th century. After the Euros took back Spain they essentially ignored the Arab world as a backwater wasteland - till the early 1800s when they wanted empires for the hell of it and picked away at the islamic world - more for ego than anything else. They ended up giving it back as not worth it.
Who knew then about the oil and how important it would be - but when its no longer important - its back to camels, bedsheets,rugs and dust.
We make them out to be bigger and more influential that they are - why? - who knows.
This lesson will cost you 3 Micky D's JJ - I work/write for food now.
Posted by: hondo at April 10, 2006 09:40 PM (4mgfY)
8
hondo,
You ask the wrong questions.
The question is: how many weaponizable diseases are manufactured in these countries? The answer? We don't know.
The intent is clear. Only capability may be lacking.
Posted by: M. Simon at April 10, 2006 10:14 PM (Yim1P)
9
Sorry
Its not Arab/islam strength we are discussing - but our own perceived weaknesses. Sure, there are problems - but nothing that can't be fixed or changed in short order.
Whatever our self-doubts - islam is not gonna be the one to capitalize on them - they are indeed backwater idiots. Now those Chinese are another story - let us hope our kung fu mojo returns before we square off against this real giant of the past and future.
Posted by: hondo at April 10, 2006 10:21 PM (4mgfY)
10
Simon
I'm sure there is a tribe of pygmes somewhere who also hate us - and one may have a degree in Biology (from a Western University no less). And - so what!
Intent means nothing - all that really matters is skill, capability and real committment with a realistic quantifiable goal!
Sure - mr. mohammed is dangerous - not denying it - but I'm just tired of "building him up" to be 10 feet tall! I am a firm believer in never underestimating an opponent ... but this has become rediculous!
Posted by: hondo at April 10, 2006 10:33 PM (4mgfY)
11
Hoo ha ha Hoo haha haaaaaaaaaa hooooohahaaaa Islam is coming to invade you, run, run for your life hoo hahaha , What a rubbish, you know, you people are scared, scared even to yourselves. It is not Islam who will kill you, your fear, greed and lust will kill you. If you people have the guts then read the book not the people. We have only one book not dozens that you should be confused which one to read. Will anybody be brave enough to tell, follower of which religion killed the most human? anybody, hello anybody, no, ok ..................... I am afraid it is Christianity, but we the Muslims have never feared that we are in danger because we know the truth will be victorious. I know the truth which I have found by my self. If you want to find the truth then do your own search don't just follow the warmongers.
Posted by: Raja Saeed at April 11, 2006 03:46 AM (XfUdJ)
12
JJ and Hondo are both right.
------------
"We have only one book not dozens that you should be confused which one to read."
Raja, you dumbass, that's your problem. Because you don't think for yourselves you will fail. You have only one book and your book is full of lies and deceit. hoo hahaha .... the joke's on you, fool. Who's the warmonger? You and your "prophet". You make war on your own people in too many ways. Keep killing each other. We'll help.
Posted by: Oyster at April 11, 2006 05:37 AM (YudAC)
13
raja
So Raja! You read a book once! - That's part of an old American joke which I'm sure you won't understand. Me? - Oh, probably in the thousands. Like I said - a backwater idiot with a hyped past, and no future.
Try your luck frightening small children - it doesn't work with me. But, while your here ....
I'll have a coffee - milk - 2 sugars - buttered roll - and the Post.
Posted by: hondo at April 11, 2006 07:34 AM (4mgfY)
14
raga,
You better get your moon god worshipping ass to the gym. I'm looking for your kind every day.
Posted by: Leatherneck at April 11, 2006 07:46 PM (D2g/j)
15
They say a million monkeys on a million typewriters will eventually produce the collected works of Shakespeare; it can now also be said that one muslim on one computer should get a monkey to do his typing.
This idiot's post is just more evidence as to why we should kill them all.
Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at April 12, 2006 05:49 AM (0yYS2)
16
As I told you before it is your fear not Muslims who will kill you, and follow the book not the people. Go to this web http://www.jews-for-allah.org/index.html and see for your self how Islam has changed their lives, Fanatics has no religion or faith they are everywhere in every religion like the people who say ' you better get your moon god worshipping ass to the gym. I'm looking for your kind every day'. and some one said ' This idiot's post is just more evidence as to why we should kill them all'.
Lets be very honest to our selves, who was the Hitler? a Muslim or............... and who used the two atomic bombs and killed hundreds of thousands of innocent people, who started the first and second world war and who killed the innocent Muslims in Bosnia and raped 25,000 women were they Muslims?????
Who burned the black people alive and killed their children and women where they some fanatic Muslim, no I am afraid no, they all were Christians. So who is fanatic, uncivilised and barbarian, I think it is not very hard to tell who is. It is still not bad, what we all need is positive thinking and honest approach, do we have that?
Posted by: Raja Saeed at April 13, 2006 05:50 PM (XfUdJ)
17
Raja,
Your problem is that you view America as the representative of Christianity.
Hitler did not represent or practice Christianity, and he absconded from his jewish background.
America dropped 2 bombs to stop a baberic war it not start.
As far as black people, America has made great progress in civil rights and realized its own shortcomings. I can't say the same for the "Easterners" who make their women cover up from head to toe and murder their daughters and wives in "honor killings".
Terrorists are bastards, and coincidentily, they are Muslim. America is progressive because it is not constrained by connections between religion and government. If your people's position is so intolerable, then do something about it. Come get some.
America fights its batlles face to face. America is not on a religious crusade. Muslims are on a religious crusade, and they tie their captives hands behind their backs and cut their heads off.
If you any problems, please see the Marines Stationed in Iraq, they will be happy to assist you.
Posted by: Garner at April 15, 2006 05:20 PM (x7v0S)
18
I don't want to get into this never ending debate. As I told you all before, don't follow the people because they might not be the true followers, read the book and you will get all your answers. Today, even the majority of the Muslims don't follow the Quran and Sunnah and they have brought bad name to Islam and its followers. That's why it is important for all of us to read the book and then raise the questions if there is any. may Allah guide us all on the straight path.
Here is another link, the people who chose to discover the Islam and they did. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYo2T3V3y7U&search=Islam%20Muslim%20Khattab%20Hakamia
Posted by: Raja Saeed at April 16, 2006 06:29 AM (XfUdJ)
19
Madchen, die pfeifen und Hennen (Hahnen), die krahn, soll man beizeiten den Hals herumdrehn.
Posted by: Milosh at June 14, 2006 07:31 AM (+RUJH)
Posted by: Felix at June 14, 2006 07:36 AM (Y6y60)
Hide Comments
| Add Comment