mypetjawa v. 2.0 (beta) "<i>Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to ev

January 24, 2006

What is this 'Canada' you speak of?

What's a 'Canada', anyway? INDCent Bill has the answer.* more...

Posted by: Rusty at 12:00 PM | Comments (3) | Add Comment
Post contains 44 words, total size 1 kb.

Leftist: "I Don't Support Troops"; Urges Them to Disobey Orders

Newslinker has this L.A. Times article revealing a pretty disgusting sentiment which is all too common on the radical Left. If I was a mainstream liberal I'd be first in line to stone this S.O.B. just to prove that his view is a minority one.

The underlying assumption of this is that wars are fought by Administrations, not by nations. By joining the military a soldier is volunteering as an extension of the Bush Administration. Hence, the soldier is complicit in Bush's alleged crimes.

While Administrations may start wars, they do not fight them. Nations fight wars.

There was no war against the Nazis. We fought Germany. And the Roosevelt Administration did not fight in WWII, America did. America is at war. When did the Left stop being part of America?

This is why the antiwar position is unpatriotic. This is America's war, and to be against it is to be against America.

There is a time to be against a war, and that time is before the war begins. Strategies for victory are legitimate debate, but as long as troops are on the ground then that is where debate should end.

In past wars an article like this would have landed the author in jail. Encouraging troops in battle to disobey commands is worse than the kind of defeatism that FDR would have arrested you for--it is inciting to treason.

Joel Stein in the L.A. Times:

I DON'T SUPPORT our troops. This is a particularly difficult opinion to have, especially if you are the kind of person who likes to put bumper stickers on his car. Supporting the troops is a position that even Calvin is unwilling to urinate on...
But I'm not for the war. And being against the war and saying you support the troops is one of the wussiest positions the pacifists have ever taken Â— and they're wussy by definition....
But blaming the president is a little too easy. The truth is that people who pull triggers are ultimately responsible, whether they're following orders or not. An army of people making individual moral choices may be inefficient, but an army of people ignoring their morality is horrifying. An army of people ignoring their morality, by the way, is also Jack Abramoff's pet name for the House of Representatives....
But when you volunteer for the U.S. military, you pretty much know you're not going to be fending off invasions from Mexico and Canada. So you're willingly signing up to be a fighting tool of American imperialism, for better or worse. Sometimes you get lucky and get to fight ethnic genocide in Kosovo, but other times it's Vietnam...
I'm not advocating that we spit on returning veterans like they did after the Vietnam War, but we shouldn't be celebrating people for doing something we don't think was a good idea. All I'm asking is that we give our returning soldiers what they need: hospitals, pensions, mental health and a safe, immediate return. But, please, no parades.

Wow. Two tin foil posts in one day. Update: Make that three tin foil post.

UPDATE: In addition to fatwas issued below (all worth the read), James Joyner, Michelle Malkin, Rob Port, and Ace

Posted by: Rusty at 11:36 AM | Comments (54) | Add Comment
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1 Dr. Rusty, it's not often that I agree with you, and in fact I can't subscribe to every word you said (for instance, I don't believe that opposing an ongoing war is treason -- if one feels that a war is actually a misuse of American forces, or was illegally begun, I believe it is one's patriotic duty to oppose the policy). But the idea of accusing American troops of willingly becoming "tools of American imperialism" is way, way over the line. Maybe it's because I grew up in a military town, and had family and family friends who have served (including two who attended West Point), but as one of those Democrats you spoke of (and a fairly liberal one) I find what Mr. Stein wrote in his LAT piece offensive and repugnant. As you stated, members of the uniformed military do not start wars. They carry out the policies of their civilian government. They are no more responsible for the rightness or wrongness of the policies they carry out than are the companies that produce the MRE's the troops are served in the field. However, it is no longer true, as you say, that nations fight wars. In the all-volunteer military of today, soldiers and their families pretty much fight alone. The rest of us go on with our lives, with nothing much asked of us -- no sacrifices, no war bonds, no limiting our use of gasoline to counteract the escalating price of oil... This administration has failed, not only in divising and executing its policies competently, but also in making the war an American -- rather than strictly a military -- conflict. All their strategists ask of the rest of us is unquestioning personal loyalty to the president, something that would have been an anathema to the other Roosevelt -- Teddy -- not to mention the Founding Fathers, who carried us away from the King. So I agree with you and I disagree. As an American, I worship no president, and I feel no obligation to support his administration's policies when I find them objectionable; war or no war. But I DO support our men and women in uniform, and feel that the line must clearly be drawn at "spitting on them" -- literally or figuratively. That is true both for liberals like Stein who denigrate their service to some sort of hit squad for Dubya, and for conservatives who have argued with me that troops have no right to complain because they volunteered. I believe that in but for a few cases of people who can't handle the pressure or don't follow the rules, our fighting men and women are the bravest, most honorable, humblest and least appreciated people among us. They often deserve better military and civilian leadership, but you know what? I know I wouldn't be brave enough to do what they do, and to do it whether I agreed with the policy or not (I've talked to some who disagree, but who go forward with absolute honor and integrity anyway). They are duty bound to try and make this war work, and they are doing the best job they can. I commend them for that, and for their sakes (and the sake of our national honor) I want them to kick ass and win in Iraq, asap so they can come home. But Dr. S, I will go to my grave believing that the invasion of Iraq was a needless and costly mistake -- perhaps the greatest foreign policy blunder in a generation. You and I clearly disagree about that, but I feel absolute confidence that my opinion makes me as good an American as anybody. Respectfully, Joy Reid

Posted by: ReidBlog at January 24, 2006 11:54 AM (o1EiK)

2 I don't support this guy. I urge anyone to bitch slap his ass open hand kung fu- julie numar style!

Posted by: Filthy Allah at January 24, 2006 11:57 AM (5ceWd)

3 I love it! Its got a kinda 3rd World feel to it - politicalizing the military (which is what this adds up to). Shows you where there heads are at. Got a cool one for the Left - convince some Govenor and State assembly to recall their National Guard components. Should make for some interesting legal mumbo-jumbo over authority and chain of command.

Posted by: hondo at January 24, 2006 11:58 AM (3aakz)

4 (Sorry for the bad English, I'm French Canadian) I live in Quebec, Canada. I went in Bosnia when Canada was needed there. And like a lot of my colleagues and friends, we were sad to know that we wouln't go to Iraq, letting all the US do the work almost alone. I talked to some guys who were about to leave there when I was at Camp Shelby, Mississipi. I was so upset when they said that a lot of people in their own country didn't support them. It was a non-sense to me. And now, I can read something like this article in what appears to be a major publication. What kind of message is been sent to troops?!? Support by the people who don't fight is at least 50% of the war effort. Rest assured that a lot of people are proud in Quebec of what the US do for the rest of the world. Leadership par l'Exemple, Max

Posted by: Max at January 24, 2006 11:59 AM (WM45z)

5 This is humongogigantinormous. Joel Stein isn't some obscure diarist at DailyKos. Imagine, a Time magazine columnist actually coming out on the same side as Michael Crook.

Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at January 24, 2006 12:02 PM (RHG+K)

6 Filthy, will a digital bitch slap do? Because I just fisked the guy - and in an Olympian move, only cussed once.

Posted by: KG at January 24, 2006 12:41 PM (eRMCR)

7 The guy's supposed to be a humor writer; I wonder if this is an incredibly misguided attempt at being arch? BTW, I predict that the Lefties will be angry about this column too, over Stein's repeating of the "myth" that soldiers returning from Vietnam were spat upon.

Posted by: Brainster at January 24, 2006 01:42 PM (hEScd)

8 What do you expect? This moron writes for the same idiots at Time who put Ann Coulter on the cover. If they think she's an intelligent commentator, they probably think he's funny.

Posted by: Ed at January 24, 2006 01:50 PM (yfKhZ)

9 Ed, Ann's smarter than you by an infinite order of mangnitudes.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 02:04 PM (0yYS2)

10 Max, Once again I applaud your support. You astound me. I only wish that all French Canadians were like you. I solute you as a brave soldier. (SOLUTE) Joy Reid, You are right to voice your own opinion but you are not respected for them. Remember this; "You should not judge unless prepared to be judged". Sometimes battles don't come out as planned. We lost good men and women on that field (mothers/fathers/brothers and sisters) DON'T GIVE UP ON THEM NOW! By saying you don't believe in this war is just the same as saying you don't believe in them. Your killing the AMERICAN Faith! Each and every soldier INCLUDING BUSH need to be soluted! He lead them in to battle believing for you and me and everyone in America, including the world, that what we were doing is for the better. "SO, maybe the psychic hotline was closed". I didn't hear your voice screaming out; "I KNOW WHO DID IT". So you already condemmed him for being wrong, BUT.... Just a thought, what if Bush was right. What if after 9/11, came more bombings all over the U.S.? What if Bush had waited to act, so that our Generals can ponder on where this attack was originated? What if he had just waited a second longer? Would you have argued that he should have acted quicker? What if he had attacked before 9/11? Would you have told him; "there never was going to be an attack"? You knew as much information as I did. We never said you had to like Bush, but when someone comes to knock a fellow American soldier like Bush to the ground, you had BETTER be there to defend him. (if he is wrong, you punch him for it later) but not in the middle of a fight. I KNOW that any fellow AMERICAN would NEVER let another AMERICAN FALL. WE STAND UNITED, SHOULDER TO SHOULDER. I maybe an ignorant brave AMERICAN, but atleast i'm a BRAVE AMERICAN! And I would NEVER turn my back on another AMERICAN no matter how wrong he is. IF HE IS WRONG, he has me to deal with but I will NEVER disgrace him/her. America is #1 because we all STAND AS 1! the AMERICAN Taco Bandit

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 24, 2006 02:53 PM (MOKXn)

11 >>"I don't support our troops." shocka! No, really. I'm shocked, shocked!

Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at January 24, 2006 03:04 PM (XA7De)

12 So why do you assume he's a "leftist"? I've read Stein's mildly amusing stuff (he's supposed to be a humor writer) over the years, and I don't recall him taking an political stand. For all you know he's a closet Pat Buchanan groupie. I'm a REAL Leftist, and I say Stein is not one of us. I have family in the army and I support the troops even if I disagree with the mission. If the mission is wrong it's up to us civilians to put pressure on the government to change it. The troops, who have their lives on the line, can't afford to do anything cute to protest the mission. Stein isn't speaking for the Left; he's speaking for Stein. Keep that straight.

Posted by: maha at January 24, 2006 03:16 PM (k55rZ)

13 Stein isn't speaking for the Left; he's speaking for Stein. Except he sounds so much like so many on the left, it's hard to tell the difference.

Posted by: Brian B at January 24, 2006 03:48 PM (rGfpg)

14 maha He's your baggage - we've got ours - accept it - and deal with it - the Pontius Pilate route doesn't work.

Posted by: hondo at January 24, 2006 03:59 PM (3aakz)

15 Maha, if you're a true leftist, then you can't possibly support our troops, because the core ethos of leftism is to undermine and attack America at every opportunity. You may have swallowed some leftist propaganda about wealth, etc., but if you truly support our military, you're just misguided, not leftist.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 04:15 PM (0yYS2)

16 idiot

Posted by: Thomas at January 24, 2006 04:48 PM (8LwRE)

17 Maxi, I think we have many more misguided people than we have true Leftists. It takes a mental disconnect to actually believe the rubbish of the Left. I remember a time in my life when a professor tried to corrupt my mind with Leftist doctrine, but I could feel in my bones that what he said and advocated was a crock of crap. Most people are not fooled by the stupidity of the Left, confused maybe, but most people eventually see the light, just as I did.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 24, 2006 05:21 PM (rUyw4)

18 Now Now People, I can relate to what you say about the left for most of the population. But, as for some like these two, they say they support our troops and they like America, then that will do. They have nothing to prove until the time comes to prove it. I have a friend from Canada and even he is willing to kick ass for america. I once banged a chick from Canada and she was a nice peace of ass for America. Leave that last part out. The TACO BANDIT

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 24, 2006 05:34 PM (MOKXn)

19 Taco Bandit said, "America is #1 because we all STAND AS 1!" But you don't stand as 1. To an external observer surfing the blogs it looks like you (Americans) genuinely hate each other. The name-calling and general visciousness of the debate is almost stomach churning. You don't discuss issues any more because everyone's mind seems to be made up. "Liberal" and "conservative" are no longer descriptive of a intellectual positions, they're just longer words for "good" and "bad". Like "Catholic" and "Protestant" or "Palestinian" and "Isreali" - and the consequences are likely to be just as stupid, tragic and generational. It's a terrible shame because the world faces many urgent problems and it would be great if the world's wealthiest nation could provide some enlightened and coherent leadership. But that's not going to happen while you guys are tearing each other's throats out. I don't have any magic solutions to the mess you're in but you could start by being civil to your fellow citizens.

Posted by: Barry at January 24, 2006 05:37 PM (VwY0N)

20 Guess they don't have satire on Tatooin (or whatever the fuck planet you live on.)

Posted by: Noodle at January 24, 2006 05:41 PM (9qMLa)

21 Kinda hard to tell at times, but it doesn't matter if it's satire or not. The point I was trying to make remains exactly the same.

Posted by: Barry at January 24, 2006 05:50 PM (VwY0N)

22 Barry, Please don't steal my quotes. I say them because I feel them. And yes, America does stand together. I will take up arms agains the enemy if i have to. Just because what you see here isn't to your liking, doesn't give you the right try and change it. Move your happy ass on to the next blog if you want. Yahoo has a good one on Canadians striking Oil in the Middle East again! GEEZ! Blow it out your ASS! How's that for name-calling visciousness!

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 24, 2006 05:51 PM (MOKXn)

23 Taco Bandit, Thank you for your thoughtful response. It fills me with hope for the future of your great nation.

Posted by: Barry at January 24, 2006 05:54 PM (VwY0N)

24 Nevermind what I said...your right. You see so many people come here and so so many bad things about America, it gets annoying! But, anyways. My bad. Lets be Civil. (Handshake)

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 24, 2006 05:56 PM (MOKXn)

25 Well...I hope that's not satirical...but hey, nice to meet you.

Posted by: Barry at January 24, 2006 06:00 PM (VwY0N)

26 Barry, nope, no mocking intended. I agree, Americans are civil (most) and it shouldn't change here. Nice to meet you too. O.k. I don't want to turn this thing in to a instant messenger. I'm out. later.

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 24, 2006 06:04 PM (MOKXn)

27 This whole Jill Carroll thing is really frustrating me. We went to War to fight terrorism (people who say "if you don't meet our demands we'll commit horrible acts and it's your fault for not heeding our warnings"). Anyway, I'm witnessing for the first time otherwise pro-war Americans question a policy to not negotiate. I've never wanted to be so cold hearted not to listen to a fathers plea, but, so far I've taken the position that we shouldn't, as she was anti-war, out of the green zone and pretty pretty much brought this on herself like we'ld all go running out into 100-mi hr. hurricane to save a reporter standing on a beach selling papers. This one however is pulling at the hear strings which gives light to the fact that Terrorism Pays so they should just keep on doing it, even if we didn't give in...the effect has been achieved with myself and swayed way more Patriots than any little lefty girl out hugging Iraqis could have done with a pen. This is really a difficult position to be in...I feel like to question it would mean my ultimate demise and a true burning in Hell, but, by my nature I must question the facts here. My best friend a former Marine with a daughter like myself is almost coming to blows with me...it's terrible -A no name anti-war "journalist" works for a barely read paper (news organizations would never be dishonest to sell papers)gets kidnapped...everyone knows who Jill is now, her word and ideas are a spreading. -She gets kidnapped by a terrorist org noone has ever heard of in front of a supposed meeting with a arabic leader who wasn't aware of the meeting in grand fashion. -She's been living amongst the Iraqi people outside the Green Zone telling their story for years (thanks for that because us dumb rednecks thought bombs were so smart they only hit bad guys and drop gold coins for good...I had no idea a War zone would suck)...anyway wouldn't it be safer to take her from her home rather than in front of an embasy type setting? -The women were set to be let go anyway! Information a journalist may be privy to. But, now it adds merit to being a terrorist and gives the appearance of negotiation. -I go out to the internet and try to find her recent articles (all I see is old, but, they may be listed way back as so many articles have her name now)...I can however join CSMonitor (bizarre that they are the only news site I've been to that has join and pay as the first article...bet their distribution is up)and see if it's in their archives, but I would never give money to increase their liberal distribution who are obviously desperate to get their point of view out). -I just get the feeling dead or alive Jill isn't getting what she deserves (the lefty premise in calling me a sadist for not thinking we should negotiate), I get the feeling Jill is getting what she wants...whether it be of her own attrition or not. -the people she's been living with strap bombs to their chests and achieve less than she has... It just sux to have these feelings and be in this position morally...Why are some of these people there? It's not like she wrote for ABC or CNN! Why is she putting herself and we the American people in this position and chancing setting US Policy back 100 yrs?

Posted by: Bob at January 24, 2006 06:56 PM (EKMxC)

28 Barry Pity you missed our group Christmas video - great duet of Maxie & actus singing "What The World Needs Now ..." Sure! Some call each other names - but its done with affection!

Posted by: hondo at January 24, 2006 07:36 PM (3aakz)

29 Did you see the MULLET on that boy?!?

Posted by: Aaron's cc: at January 24, 2006 08:09 PM (ov6Vw)

30 Barry, the reason that we seem to hate one another is because we genuinely do. We are not a homogenous people by any means, and all normal boundaries of ingroup/outgroup have been chucked out the window long ago. We are a nation of many different groups with blurry distinctions which collide as often as they overlap, and often within the same group. You can't describe Americans with any sort of a pat label, and must take each of us as individuals. The split comes when you get to the two major groups; those who love America and those who don't. There are things about this country that sicken me, but it's still my country, and I love it, and I have have put my life on the line to serve it, and still would again without hesitation, because that's just the way I am. Likewise, there are those who hate America despite the ease which it affords them to live, yet they refuse to contribute or serve in even the least way, though they also won't leave. We are approaching an unbridgable chasm in our society, and I'm not sure how things will get sorted out, but I am sure of one thing; the fate of the world follows the fate of America. If we fall, everyone loses.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 08:40 PM (0yYS2)

31 That is a beauty, isn't it?

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 08:41 PM (0yYS2)

32 "So why do you assume he's a leftist?" Because he sounds like one. I'm pleased that you disagree with him on the rightness of this war, but it seems as if you are a minority on the left. "Stein isn't speaking for the Left; he's speaking for Stein. Keep that straight." Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. He speaks just like an awful lot of leftists. I've been talking to leftists like him for decades. He is NOT some sort of anomaly. Please read Putting Cruelty First: An Interview with Kanan Makiya in Democratiya. He talks about how the left (and non-Iraqi Arabs) attacked him unmercifully for speaking the truth in his book "Cruelty and Silence." This is not a new phenomenon. For generations the left has attacked those who spoke the truth about leftist tyranny. Each generation attacks and attempts to silence the witnesses to murder and cruelty. Then, when the mountains of evidence become too high to ignore, the next generation says "that's old news, mistakes were made, errors of enthusiastic young idealists, time to move on" and then proceeds to do exactly the same thing to the witnesses of their day.

Posted by: pst314 at January 24, 2006 09:58 PM (7cTig)

33 "This is America's war, and to be against it is to be against America." I would argue that Stein's language reveals that he is against the war because he is against America.

Posted by: pst314 at January 24, 2006 10:00 PM (7cTig)

34 I think pst314 just nailed it. America represents everything that Marxism opposes, and leftism is Marxism, plain and simple. One cannot be a leftist and a loyal American any more than one may sit while standing.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 10:31 PM (0yYS2)

35 Improbulus Maximus - "We are approaching an unbridgable chasm in our society..." Yep, that's how it looks. Again speaking as an external observer I'm amazed at how determined you all seem to be to keep throwing petrol on the fire. The insistence on framing the debate in us versus them terms can never, ever have a constructive outcome (well, not unless you view an actual war against the "leftists" as constructive). BTW, I'm no airy fairy "love conquers all" type. I love my wife, family and close friends, I mostly tolerate the rest of mankind. That's the best I can do. But one thing OBL and co. would dearly love to see would be the US tearing itself apart internally. Surely that should be sufficient incentive for you lot to put a little more effort into seeing each other's point of view.

Posted by: Barry at January 24, 2006 10:44 PM (VwY0N)

36 thejoelstein@yahoo.com drop him a note, i'm sure he'd be tickled pink.

Posted by: h at January 24, 2006 11:34 PM (flksM)

37 Responses to responses to earlier comment: "Except he sounds so much like so many on the left, it's hard to tell the difference." Not really. He sounds like what YOU IMAGINE the Left sounds like, but you never really listen to the Left. You listen to what Rush Limbaugh tells you about the Left. Yes, the Left has its whackjob extremist fringe, but so does the Right -- white supremacists, for example. I'm sure you'd feel ill used if I called you all Klansmen. "He's your baggage - we've got ours - accept it - and deal with it - the Pontius Pilate route doesn't work." Once again, there's no way to know whose baggage he is. He is a humorist. He doesn't usually express political opinions in his columns. For all we know he's a lifelong Republican. Remember, lots of Republicans (the Pat Buchanan faction comes to mind) opposed the Iraq War. "Maha, if you're a true leftist, then you can't possibly support our troops, because the core ethos of leftism is to undermine and attack America at every opportunity. You may have swallowed some leftist propaganda about wealth, etc., but if you truly support our military, you're just misguided, not leftist." Again, you have no idea what the Left believes. You've just swallowed propaganda yourself. There IS a whackjob extremist fringe that would like to bring down the government (e.g., International ANSWER, which most of us disown), but there's a whackjob extremist fringe on the Right that wants to bring down the government also (Tim McVeigh types). You judge the mainstream Left by the fringe. If I assumes you were all just like Tim McVeigh you'd probably be insulted, wouldn't you? ""So why do you assume he's a leftist?" Because he sounds like one. I'm pleased that you disagree with him on the rightness of this war, but it seems as if you are a minority on the left." Here is the majority opinion of the Left, to which I subscribe: Invading Iraq was one of the most colossaly stupid things this country has ever done. I supported fighting the Taliban in Afghanistan; indeed, I think we should have gone into Afghanistan quicker and harder. We blew opportunities in Afghanistan, let bin Laden get away, etc. But invading Iraq should have been a much lower priority than the Bush White House made it. Saddam Hussein was a long way away from being a threat to the U.S., and the money, lives, and resources wasted in Iraq could have been put to better use elsewhere. As I said in the earlier post, the Iraq war is wrong, wrong, wrong. But the burden of finding solutions to the mess there falls on us civilians, not the soldiers. I believe most of the soldiers are working very hard to help establish a secure Iraq and come home safely. That's enough on their plates. THAT, sir, IS the majority opinion of the Left. There are some who opposed invading Afghanistan, but they are a small minority. ""Stein isn't speaking for the Left; he's speaking for Stein. Keep that straight." Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. He speaks just like an awful lot of leftists. I've been talking to leftists like him for decades. He is NOT some sort of anomaly." Once again, you take one brick and assume you know what the whole building looks like. And in all the "decades" you've been talking to "leftists" I doubt you've encountered a representative cross-section. "He talks about how the left (and non-Iraqi Arabs) attacked him unmercifully for speaking the truth in his book "Cruelty and Silence."" If you ever want to be attacked unmercifully, just try being a leftie in America speaking out against the Bush Administration. I've actually received obscene and threatening phone calls from you righties because of opinions I have expressed. So don't give me any whiny crap about how nasty lefties are until you clean up your own act.

Posted by: maha at January 25, 2006 07:23 AM (k55rZ)

38 Guess Who showed up in Orlando, Florida! @ the TD WATERHOUSE Centre today. Zig Ziglar <- What a name!> Steve Forbes Bobby Bowden Suze Orman Tom Hopkins Phil Town Gen. Colin Powell Rudolph Giulliani Appears they are giving MOTIVATED SEMINARS about success (speeches are listed above, right of their name) @ only $225.00 a person (WOW!) and let me tell you, the roads and highways were packed! Since I'm poor and my trailor got repoed, leaving me to this BOX behind my parents house (the dog gets to sleep inside) talking to you guys on my Apple 1 computer and watering down my last beer to make it last longer, I might as well attend. Anyone have some money than can fax me?

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 25, 2006 07:46 AM (MOKXn)

39 LOL Taco, In French we say: "Ou il y a de la vie, il y a de l'espoir!" (Where there's life, there's hope!) Max

Posted by: Max at January 25, 2006 10:26 AM (aPkwd)

40 Rough week for Stein. He even made Atrios' Wanker of the Day.

Posted by: Cynical Nation at January 25, 2006 10:53 AM (vC1jc)

41 >>>You listen to what Rush Limbaugh tells you about the Left. Not really. That's what *you* IMAGINE Rush Limbaugh says to us. But you never really listen to Rush. Us rightwingers are all racist, sexist, warmongering pigs, greedy, hate the poor, religious wingnuts. But you Lefties are all a picture of moderation-- except for that one Leftard out on the margins. Riiiight. >>>Again, you have no idea what the Left believes. You've just swallowed propaganda yourself. Right again. We have "no idea" what the Left believes. roflmao! No matter that many of your greatest foes have been Lefties for most of our lives, and we're onto you. Yup, you Lefties are a great mystery wrapped in an enigma inside a riddle. You're all very shy about your beliefs, apparently. You're totally misunderstood. See, that's your problem. You just haven't gotten your message out! Yeah, that's the ticket!

Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at January 25, 2006 11:25 AM (paKD6)

42 Us rightwingers are all racist, sexist, warmongering pigs, greedy, hate the poor, religious wingnuts. But you Lefties are all a picture of moderation-- except for that one Leftard out on the margins. Riiiight. This describes the looney Right fringe. Does it describe you? I take it you don't think so. I accept that; the mainstream Right is not racist, sexist, etc. So why is it you (and Michelle Malkin, who is the worst offender these days) insist that the looney Left fringe represents the mainstream Left? It does not. And I still have seen no evidence that Joel Stein is anything but an asshole with no particular political agenda.

Posted by: maha at January 25, 2006 12:02 PM (k55rZ)

43 "And in all the 'decades' you've been talking to 'leftists' I doubt you've encountered a representative cross-section." How kind of you to put 'decades' and 'leftists' in quotes. Since you "doubt" what I wrote, let me be more specific: In my youth I was on the left, and most of my friends were liberals and leftists. I have over 30 years of adult interactions with such people, ranging from academics in various fields to union activists and ordinary individuals. Their incomes ranged from upper-upper middle class to on welfare. They ranged from blue collar to white collar. Their ranged all over the political spectrum, from Hubert Humphrey liberals to every sort of leftist you can imagine, including Wobblies, Maoists, Trotskyites, Fidelistas, Spartacist Leaguers, Wobblies, social democrats of various sorts, and so on. I have books in my library by various liberals and leftists, and have read others, including, for example, some Marx and Lenin. One brick? I've seen hundreds. One phenomenon I noticed across much of the left was, as I mentioned before, an inclination to defame and denigrate refugees from Communist tyranny, in an attempt to silence any criticism of leftist thugs. And of course to do everything possible to deny assistance to those fighting such tyranny. Was this universal? No, of course not, but it was very common. Kanan Makiya wrote of how he was betrayed by his "comrades." The same thing happened with the boat people of Vietnam, refugees from Cuba and Nicaragua. And of course, it happened earlier with refugees from the Soviet Union and from China. The left has still largely failed to face up to this shameful legacy of betrayal. Oh sure, you can find a principled leftist here and there who discusses the issue honestly, but too much of the left wants to either explain away and excuse, or just pretend it didn't happen. But don't take criticism of the left too personally: Just because many of the people posting here see the left in in general is deeply pathological, that does not necessarily reflect on you. Our opinions of you will largely depend on the opinions you express here. But if you insist on denying history we'll have difficulty taking you seriously. As for "don't give me any whiny crap" well, even back in the 60's and 70's I was noticing how comfortable ordinary leftists were with harassment and assault on people they disagreed with. Furthermore, who's whining? Do you have trouble handling disagreement? Well, you wouldn't be the first leftist I've met who blew up when faced with dissent from dogma, not by a long shot.

Posted by: pst314 at January 25, 2006 12:08 PM (OA547)

44 Oh--as for Rush Limbaugh, sorry, wrong again. I don't listen to talk radio much. I've heard maybe 20 minutes of him in my entire life. I got my opinions of the left by speaking with leftists and reading what they wrote.

Posted by: pst314 at January 25, 2006 12:11 PM (OA547)

45 pst314: As a 55-year-old myself, what I've observed over the years is that when you argue with a Leftie you may be cursed and insulted, but when you argue with a Rightie you are asking for physical assault. The blogger David Neiwert at Orcinus documents hate speech coming from the Right, if you want to check it out. Here's just one example. Righties are far more likely than lefties to threaten to eliminate people who disagree with them. I spend a lot of time on the blogosphere, and one finds rightie bloggers and their commenters who fantasize about doing physical harm to, even killing, the opposition. This is more rare on the Left. Lefties hurl insults, yes; but they don't threaten to kill people at nearly the same rate righties do. So don't give me any crap about how you poor righties are so reasonable and lefties are so nasty. Also, regarding "in my youth I was on the left" -- I run into this a lot. Inevitably, with a little digging, I find out that the individual was either a committed Marxist who did a complete flip (David Horowitz comes to mind) or was some fairly apolitical kid who considered himself to be a "leftist" because in the 1960s that's what young people were supposed to be. If in your youth you were seriously knowledgable of and committed to liberal/progressive ideals and values and then changed your mind, you would be most unusual.

Posted by: maha at January 25, 2006 12:25 PM (k55rZ)

46 Maha, As your Canadian population grows and winter hits, you guys seem to magically appear in and around America. Why? Righties must not be that bad. I would say more lefts go right than rights go left. Is that Right or not right? You put your right foot in, You put your right foot out, you put your right foot in and you shake it all about. You do the Hokey Pokey and you turn yourself about......That's what it's all about....

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 25, 2006 03:30 PM (MOKXn)

47 >>>If in your youth you were seriously knowledgable of and committed to liberal/progressive ideals and values and then changed your mind, you would be most unusual. That's why people tend to be more Liberal when they're young and stupid-- because they don't know what the fuck they're talking about. And then as they grow older and wiser, they turn more conservative. Especially when they start raising a family. To quote Churchill, if you're not a Liberal at 20, you have no heart. If you're still a Liberal at 30, you have no brain. I thought myself very clever back in my young Lib days. Very, very clever indeed. Now I can only look back at myself and shake my head in amusement. What was I thinking. But I was a full-on Lefty, and committed enough to put my money where my mouth was. I travelled several times to Nicaragua to support the Sandinistas, I was at all the protests, and stopped traffic on numerous occassion during our "die-ins" to protest the warmongering Reagan. I could argue your ears off on Lefty dogma. Today Reagan is my hero! hahaha! Now you Lefties don't have a bigger enemy in the world than me. And unlike most rightwingers, I've been on the inside. I know you better than you know yourselves.

Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at January 25, 2006 03:52 PM (FBm0F)

48 ...well, you may have "bigger" enemies than me, but certainly not more committed ;-)

Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at January 25, 2006 03:55 PM (FBm0F)

49 This is ridiculous. The article had self deprecation and sarcasm all through it. And everyone missed the point. All he says in this article is he doesnÂ’t feel you can separate supporting the troops and support for the war. He says he doesnÂ’t hate them as people; donÂ’t spit on them and so on. He just means he canÂ’t and doesnÂ’t see it as correct to say you support the troops and donÂ’t support the war. He even goes on to say that it would be ok to fight for real issues like genocide. And the whole article is more about a liberal saying they are for the troops but against the war. Whether I agree with this article or not doesnÂ’t matter. I think everyoneÂ’s outrage is ridiculousÂ…encouraging troops to disobey orders, please. I think this whole country needs a giant enema. Oh and I find it funny that this site has a quote by Thomas Mann in its title. Many people wouldnÂ’t understand, be appalled or highly disagree with his works with gay and sexual undertones, support for socialism, communism and other issues many would disagree with. People should think before they just pull quotes they think fit their views.

Posted by: qwerty at January 25, 2006 04:37 PM (Zg8jo)

50 maha, if you think that the left is so much less prone to hate speech or threats or even violence, well, the kindest way I can put it is that you are deluding yourself. And the left has a record of excusing and condoning it. Hey--look at the unrepentant terrorists and terrorist aiders who were eagerly given tenure by major universities, and lauded by liberal journalists. But even a hint of violent past for someone on the right is a career-killer. As for your assertion that I "would be most unusual" well, again you are wrong. Oh, and by the way, the pervasive intolerance of dissent is one of the things that drove me away from the left. I have found it much easier to debate issues with conservatives. (Although one should remember that "conservative" today usually would be better called "classical liberal".)

Posted by: pst314 at January 25, 2006 08:16 PM (7cTig)

51 Barry, all of nature is "us versus them", and war is indeed the only meaningful way to solve major societal problems with any finality, only most people are too gutless to admit it. If it weren't for the righteous employment of warfare, the Nazi's and Communists would still be fighting over the scraps of the world, but we big bad Americans put a stop to them, with no thanks from those we saved, by the way. If problems can be solved by means other than war, then they mostly are, and people do it all the time, but sometimes we run into problems that just can't be resolved peacefully, such as muslims wanting to enslave or murder everyone, for example. This is dealbreaker among civilized humans, and unless one is a spineless liberal, one is inclined to resist such efforts by the savages who commit such acts. The only solution to the muslim problem is to kill them until they get tired of it and slither back to hide under the rocks whence they emerged, or be exterminated like the vermin they are. They cannot be reasoned with. They don't want to negotiate. They just want to conquer, murder, rape, and pillage, because they're unevolved primitive savages, and that's what they do. Anyone who would make apologies for them should be shot along with them for betraying humanity and civilization.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 26, 2006 03:04 AM (0yYS2)

52 I wouldn't go so far as to describe all of life as "us versus them" but I would maintain that there is nothing wrong with condemning seditionists. Some things are beyond the pale. (Of course much of "progressive" talk has been aimed at making nothing, no matter how vile, beyond the pale--except for disagreement with those tolerant, peaceful progressives.)

Posted by: pst314 at January 26, 2006 09:07 AM (OA547)

53 Mr. Stein is right. Soldiers are not bound to obey immoral or illegal orders. I think the Nuremberg trials made it clear that "I was just following orders" defense, does not absolve guilt. Just remember, Germans supported their troops too! "It is the first responsibility of every citizen to question authority."- Benjamin Franklin

Posted by: Jason at January 26, 2006 01:59 PM (mgKhS)

54 Ah, now I understand. America is like Nazi Germany because we brought down a fascist regime that was and continued to be a menace to the region and to the world. Thanks for explaining that.

Posted by: pst314 at January 27, 2006 12:14 PM (OA547)

Hide Comments | Add Comment

Kos Kids to March at Ground Zero in Protest of 9/11 'Conspiracy'

The tin foil brigades will march on President's day to protest the 9/11 conspiracy. And by conspiracy they mean that 9/11 was an American conspiracy. They will also attempt to arrest former Mayor Giuliani for his part in the conspiracy. Which is odd because Rudy isn't, as far as I know, a J-O-O.

The rally is being organized by Daily Kos writer and conspiracy nut Greg Nixon. A guy who thinks the Bush Administration was behind 9/11.

Indy Media Watch has more.

Indeymedia: March for Truth:

The rally will conclude at the office of former N.Y.C. Mayor Giuliani in Times Square, where we will deliver citizenÂ’s warrant for his arrest for his role in the attacks at The World Trade Center and criminal complicity in removing evidence from a crime scene. Civil disobedience will then be encouraged by protesters in an effort to call on fellow Americans to speak out against the colossal crimes being committed in the name of a fraudulent Â‘War on TerrorÂ” and to demand the U.S. Government be arrested for treason and mass murder....
Please spread the word to any and all to come to Ground Zero on February 20th and make their voice heard that this frame-up on humanity in the name of Â‘The War on TerrorÂ” Ends now. March for Truth N.Y.C. 2006!

It would be funny if these people were indeed as marginal as I would hope to believe. As it is, I believe their march constitutes a legitimate 'fighting words' defense.

UPDATE: If Kos is now the Democratic kingmaker, what does that say about the Democratic party?

Posted by: Rusty at 09:40 AM | Comments (50) | Add Comment
Post contains 287 words, total size 2 kb.

1 Alright. Who lives in NYC that can take pictures of this circus for us? Marginal doesn't even begin to describe these whack jobs.

Posted by: Oyster at January 24, 2006 09:54 AM (osKlJ)

2 Somebody who lives in NYC needs to throw a stink bomb in the crowd. Oh, never mind, who would notice?

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 24, 2006 09:58 AM (rUyw4)

3 Protestdriod: "We are here to serve a CITIZEN'S WARRANT and arrest the Ex-Mayor!" Officer Mulligan: "Sure y'are, laddie. But I'm afraid it's not going to happen. Move along now, there's a good little moonbat. Don't be makin' me and the boys thump yer pointy little heads."

Posted by: mojo at January 24, 2006 10:04 AM (kvY5N)

4 In all fairness, nearly every commenter following the post is laughing at him. Some are pretty damn funny. A couple tried to defend him and came off just as looney.

Posted by: Oyster at January 24, 2006 10:10 AM (osKlJ)

5 "We will then confront the media organizations The Nation Magazine, Democracy Now, The New York Times, and A.N.S.W.E.R as symbolic targets of de facto complicity with their silence and neglect of journalistic duties" When you've started to think that The New York Times and ANSWER have become too soft, perhaps it's time to do a self-examination of your mental health.

Posted by: Graeme at January 24, 2006 10:16 AM (svnaF)

6 An examination of the mental health of these people would be quite interesting, actually. I would be curious to know the medical term for the mental illness that afflicks these people. It's good for them, I suppose, that mental illness no longer gets you automatically confined to an institution, and good for the taxpayer also, as the numbers of these idiots has climbed over the years.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 24, 2006 10:30 AM (rUyw4)

7 Where can I sponsor one of these kids? Every time one of these freaks are spotted a bell rings and a New Yorker votes Republican.

Posted by: Gordon at January 24, 2006 10:39 AM (JwR1N)

8 >>>A.N.S.W.E.R And I thought is was merely a mental disorder. These people have veered off into full-fledged madness.

Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at January 24, 2006 10:50 AM (paKD6)

9 Who puts this consperacy crap into the heads of this kuds? they should be hung

Posted by: sandpiper at January 24, 2006 10:54 AM (U+eLg)

10 "Rudy isn't, as far as I know, a J-O-O." Well his name is JOO-liani! What further proof do we need? "When you've started to think that The New York Times and ANSWER have become too soft, perhaps it's time to do a self-examination of your mental health." Since when do crazy people admit they're crazy?

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 11:12 AM (0yYS2)

11 Greg? Hmmm.

Posted by: Howie at January 24, 2006 11:17 AM (D3+20)

12 Name the punk band: Here are a couple of lines of the lyrics. I'm not crazy (institution) You're driving me crazy (institution) Taking me to an institution, telling me it's the only solution Hint: "All I wanted was a Pepsi"

Posted by: Rusty at January 24, 2006 11:18 AM (JQjhA)

13 Rusty - Suicidal Tendencies of course.

Posted by: scarletbegonia at January 24, 2006 11:27 AM (z77r4)

14 I operate in NYC and would be extremely happy to take pictures, even video, of these wing nuts.

Posted by: Agent Meatball at January 24, 2006 11:32 AM (30FRH)

15 Suicidal Tendancies?

Posted by: Howie at January 24, 2006 11:33 AM (D3+20)

16 Institutionalized- Suicidal Tendencies.

Posted by: disgruntledinca at January 24, 2006 11:34 AM (IpG/2)

17 You all win thes valuable prizes.....

Posted by: Rusty at January 24, 2006 11:38 AM (JQjhA)

18 I think the more media coverage the better. There has to be an archival photo somewhere of one of their leaders arm in arm with Hilary, Dean or Gore. Fox could have a field day pasting one of these photos up while running the story of the 9-11 conspiracy nuts Â“day off in New YorkÂ”. If weÂ’re lucky, they may even bring up the weather machine, fake moon landing in 1969, or bombing of the NO dikes. Give them rope, plenty of rope.

Posted by: Brad at January 24, 2006 11:51 AM (3OPZt)

19 I love this! Here in NY the left is pulling out all stops to alienate .... marginal liberals! Cannibalism on parade! If I got some time, I'll try and check it out. Should be some really cool Performance Art stuff on view - they really like that stuff - and its often amusing in a bizzaro kind of way.

Posted by: hondo at January 24, 2006 12:06 PM (3aakz)

20 Hondo and Agent Meatball - I beg you, PLEASE, get pictures. I need a really good laugh. Oh and if you see inflatable scrotum guy, pass him up, okay? [shudder]

Posted by: Oyster at January 24, 2006 01:43 PM (osKlJ)

21 That Greg Nixon guy is also a member of impeachbush.meetup.com/ Still looking ...

Posted by: Oyster at January 24, 2006 03:30 PM (osKlJ)

22 He's even posted his screed on the History Channel site. On the same message board there are a whole slew of TFH wearing kooks. He lives in Burlington VT. I have his email too.

Posted by: Oyster at January 24, 2006 04:03 PM (osKlJ)

23 It sounds like they chose sides. heh.

Posted by: newc at January 24, 2006 04:40 PM (HUiqh)

24 Who is behind this web site, and why do you wish to hide / belittle the truth of 9/11?

Posted by: bill giltner at January 24, 2006 05:32 PM (PXRQW)

25 wow. bill giltner is insane. Just look at his website.

Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at January 24, 2006 08:32 PM (XA7De)

26 The truth? We all know it was the JOOOOOooooOOOOOoooooOOOOOOZZZZZzzzzz Bill.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 10:32 PM (0yYS2)

27 Hey Bill, did you hear the U.S Government has retrofitted the crashed Roswell space shuttle with a earthquake generator, and a "PROJECT BLUEBEAM" Jesus projector?

Posted by: dave at January 24, 2006 10:35 PM (CcXvt)

28 lmao!!! too fucking funny.

Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at January 24, 2006 10:36 PM (51oif)

29 Yeah, I remember those nutcase last 9-11. It was my son's first trip to Ground Zero since his father died there. We saw those idiots spewing there garbage and I just had to say it. I looked their speaker straight in the eye and said in a loud voice "Your are sooo full of shit!" The entire crowd did a whiplash manuever and my son thought we were about to be mobbed. We exited back on the subway before anyone could do anything. I despise these jerks!

Posted by: mithglin at January 25, 2006 04:42 AM (kp3ms)

30 Mithglin, I'm sorry you had to endure that. These people are soulless.

Posted by: Oyster at January 25, 2006 10:04 AM (osKlJ)

31 Always a liberal, on 9/11, I became a supporter of the President and stayed glued to FOX NEWS 24/7. I supported both wars, too. Just like the President, I wanted to get those evil-doing Bastards. So on 9/11, effectively, I waved my flag with every other good patriot. But then a friend mentioned that to him? 9/11 did not make any logical sense at all. He shared his un-answered questions. Why did our entire military, NORAD, the FAA, and the Pentagon's own defense fail us for the first time in history not once but with four separate planes? Why did three skyscrapers fall in nearly free-fall and look just like films of controlled demolitions? And how come no skyscrapers had ever exploded like that due to fires alone (and never mind one building, but 3 of them, and WTC7 was not even hit by a plane)! How come so many of the hijackers are still actually alive? Why did the Pres. stop caring about Bin Laden and told us that basically it's not even important that we find him? Why was Marvin Bush in charge of security for the WTC towers on 9/11? Why was there no 757 wreckage found at the Pentagon? Why didn't the Pentagon ever release the footage of any plane hitting the Pentagon? Why wasn't the hole in the side of the Pentagon anywhere near as big as the wingspan for the jetliner, neither in terms of width nor height? Why did the plane "know" to pick the part of the Pentagon where there were relatively few employees working (and none of the highest brass) and the section that had just recently been bomb-proofed? Why did Larry Silverstein, Leaseholder for Bldg. 7, tell the firefighters to "pull" that building? (You can't just pull a building - you need to place explosives in it in advance). Why did Rumsfeld tell CNN that Flight 93 was shot down over Shanksville? My friend had so many questions that I had to read for myself. So I did my research - month after month I kept saying NO WAY that our own government had anything to do with it! I REFUSED to believe it, for months! That would be evil, after all, for a government to harm nearly 3,000 people in order to get into some wars! Denial is not a place in Egypt. It is where we go when we don't want to face up to something that might be too painful to bear. Well, long story short, many, many articles, countless photographs and several books later I learned the real truth. 9/11 was done with the full cooperation of some insiders in our government in high levels. Please know that those who have questions are not insane. They are merely individuals who think for themselves. And admittedly, it is extremely painful to realize that one's own government would do such a thing - and actually has done many covert operations and false flag attacks for many years. Please do not take my word for it - nor Greg Nixon's word for it, either. Trust your own brain. Do the research like I did. Think for yourself. Read read read with the brain you've been given and think critically. Here are some places to get more info. Just look at the evidence as if you were a detective or a scientist. Our government has been lying about many things - and 9/11 is just but one. Here are some websites to learn more for yourself. Please don't dismiss this until you have done your own research. Don't you owe it to yourself not to simply listen to everything you hear out of the oval office, and to read the research and use your own good mind to mull over all of these things that just do not add up? http://georgewashington.blogspot.com/ http://www.911proof.com/ http://911research.wtc7.net/ http://www.reopen911.org/

Posted by: formerbushlover at January 25, 2006 07:59 PM (JuLkv)

32 formerbushlover, I can sum up your well-researched data by adding 3 words to the very beginning of your post: "Once a liberal," I am renewing your prescription and increasing your dosage to 20mg. DO NOT TAKE WITH KOOL-AID!!! Please stay away from all windows and sharp objects. Asshat.

Posted by: Son Of The Godfather at January 26, 2006 04:21 AM (maXzk)

33 I find it funny how 'critics' of the 9/11 attack say stuff like this: And how come no skyscrapers had ever exploded like that due to fires alone Hello? fires alone? did you miss the rather large plane impacts that went through the building floors, pillars and structure in general at high velocity? Why is it you idiots continue to separate the Fire, from the impact of a Jet liner as if one or the other wasn't a factor? Hey heres a free clue for you moron, perhaps you can tell us when the last time a commercial jet hit a building deliberately, and it survived?

Posted by: dave at January 26, 2006 07:41 PM (CcXvt)

34 1943 a b17 bomber hit the empire state bldg . at almost 300 miles an hour and did minimal damage you pathetic troglydite morons!

Posted by: None of your idiotic business at January 26, 2006 11:32 PM (skZky)

35 I guess you liberal FAGGOTS will also call the firefighters and police that were THERE that are saying that it was an inside job and that THEY HEARD the BOMBS going off a bunch of nuts too?

Posted by: nunyabiznes at January 26, 2006 11:38 PM (skZky)

36 Why the fear of people who ask questions? Is it easier to find someone that has a great sound byte and then just keep repeating that? Since when has a patriot become someone that just repeats what he hears others say? Being a ditto head is not patriotic nor is it a defense of your countries Constitution. If there is naught to fear, but fear itself, then maybe you should keep running in circles and screaming and shouting that Â‘moonbats and tin foil hatsÂ’ are out to get you and destroy the world. On 9/11 or the first time in 20 years Norad didnÂ’t have a plane in the air for less than 10 minutes. Why? Why did it take 1 Hour and 43 minutes to respond? Do you feel safe now? The original articles of impeachment on Clinton included that a passenger plane had made it into NYC airspace and it had taken 10 minutes for Norad to respond. Only one other time has Norad taken longer, that was 12 minutes. New worl Record for the defence of the Eastern Fainancial district seaboard, 1 hour and 43 minutes. Well Done! When are they going to beat that record? Of course now someone is going to talk about the Mid West and a golfer instead of staying on subject, which includes that NoradÂ’s prime responsibility is to protect the East Coast from attack. In the 1980Â’s, before there was an Al Quaeda, captured terrorists said that they had considered using airplanes in retaliation for the attack in Lebanon. Before the 3 TV Stations footage of the Air Force Colonel in charge of the Virginia Norad Air base was confiscated, I heard him say, live on TV, when only one plane ahd made its target, that when he called his superior, he was told to ground the plane he had in the air and to not fuel or arm either of his places until he received further orders. Over 2 hours later some northern Norad base was allowed to send a jetÂ… way to late. This Colonel knew more than 40 minutes before the first plane hit. What terrible things would happen to American citizens if we were allowed to see more than 5 frames of a video camera as the Â‘planeÂ’ that hit the Pentagon passed behind some object. Of the 5 Video cameras that had a clear view of the incoming plane, none of them are allowed to be seen as that would compromise national Security. Well, I suppose it might, if that wasnÂ’t a 757. Are you afraid to view a 757 hitting the side of the pentagon, hitting an area that was just reinforced to stop exactallly what just occurred? Something that penetrated 5 walls, then exploded? Would that footage permanently harm your psyche? Please donÂ’t ask any questions yourself, it would make it hard to be a faithful lapdog ditto head. Find someone who has nice neat short statements that you can remember, and repeat after them, the moonbats and the tin foil hats are going to get you if you donÂ’t protect yourself by calling them the names you learned to use in 7th grade.

Posted by: questionier at January 27, 2006 12:53 AM (95gWQ)

37 questionier, You have an incredible grasp of the idiotic. Here's an Occam's razor for your birthday. Stew in your moonbat doubts and conspiracy laden existence... The drama will kill you. SOTG

Posted by: Son Of The Godfather at January 27, 2006 07:54 AM (maXzk)

38 the only "conspiracy theory" that exists surrounding 9/11 is the official version. read through the PDF file at http://911truthemergence.com/911fairytale.pdf and then see if you still believe the official version. or just ask yourself: "why do i believe what i do about 9/11?" is it because you've researched, read, and thought about it, or because a t.v. told you what to think? the official version of 9/11 has no more validity than any other lie of the bush administration. please see: http://benjaminpritchard.name/transparency.html

Posted by: benjamin pritchard at January 27, 2006 09:44 AM (J4sZB)

39 so everybody who disagrees with bush is a fucking liberal. OKC bombing was an inside job, WTC 93 the motherfucking FBI's John Anticef (spelling?) gave ahmed salim a million dollars, explosives and along with detonators to park against the main support column to make one WTC collapse onto the other and bring about martial law. THANK GOD that didn't happen because the arabs hired to do this were IDIOTS!! This was in the NYT for a little while but quickly went down the memory hole! BENTON K PARTIN's material (now part of congressional record) he said according to his analysis of the OKC explosive signiture the support columns had shaped charges placed on them and no way a "truck" bomb could have done that damage. BTW he was the former head of an Air Force Weapons Lab, so He must be a tin foil hatter too huh? you FUCKING pricks need to pull your head out of your asses and realize america is being dismantled right before your very eyes and you're cheerleading the efforts of the globalists!!!! We are on the verge of going into iran because of their NOOKULAR weapons.....the real reason they want to go to iran is because iran come this march is going to sell oil in EUROS. SAME FUCKING REASON WHY WE ARE STUCK IN IRAQ!!! ONLY ELEMENT MISSING IS ANOTHER FALSE FLAG ATTACK TO RALLY THE IDIOTS SUCH AS YOURSELVES BEHIND ANOTHER MidEAST FOLLY against a very powerful country. IRAQ and afghanistan were relative cake walks!!!

Posted by: Corporal! at January 27, 2006 11:06 AM (BHHsV)

40 Well, it is obvious who it is that doesnÂ’t want anyone to ask questions about obvious irregularities. Those folks are supporting the destruction of the constitution, wrapping themselves in the Flag that true patriots are sworn to defend, not use as a shield. If they could get past the 7th grade puberty level of potty mouthed name calling, they enter 8th, 9th and more high school curriculum and maybe get some algebra, learning to do some deductive thinking instead of gonad exercises. What really amazes me is their use of Liberal as a dirty word. It comes from Liberty. What else confuses me is that they sort of claim to be conservative (yeah right, and GW has the best pResidential ratings in the last 200 years) yet they donÂ’t reflect that either. At the best, they would be nationalists, but further study of definitions (as printed in the dictionary, it is a big book, hard for some to open and read, yes, yes I know) but more likely we have Neo Cons (no better or safer than Neo Libs I might add) and the slimiest crawling outta the wood work, the Fascists, claiming they are spreading Democracy while destroying it here at home. Here, have an exercise in seeing if your labels match what the rest of the world uses as a reference for the English language. http://www.onelook.com/ http://dictionary.reference.com/ http://www.m-w.com/dictionary.htm The fortunate thing in these links is that there are itty bitty little sound bytes, the problem is they require independent thought to be able to understand and use as something other than a ditto head, who has no freaking idea what he is talking about. So, back to 9/11? What is so damned dangerous about asking about the irregularities, all the things that the government just refuses to cover? Like? Why did GW say that there would never be an investigation and that no one would ever be held responsible for the security failures that day? Who is in whose pocket here? That is the question....

Posted by: Questioner at January 27, 2006 01:47 PM (95gWQ)

41 formerbushlover: For someone to claim that he has done a lot of research, the only research you obviously did was on debunked 9/11 conspiracy websites. It is incredible that after 4 years, your long paragraph lists nothing but long-since debunked nonsense. Can you explain rationally to us why you did not do the necessary research that would tell you conclusively that what you have written is wrong, debunked, irrational, and just plain silly? It's rather amazing how gullible people can be.

Posted by: S. King at January 27, 2006 05:32 PM (7b4mH)

42 S. King, well, so former Bush lover's web sites are pretty much showing wht has been disproved, as if they are Gov plant jobs, but, where would you recommned people to get data that wasn't fed to us by people from outerspace? Q.

Posted by: questioner at January 28, 2006 02:04 AM (95gWQ)

43 questioner: Show me the websites in which physical laws have been disproved and why you believe them. Show me the websites which would lead you to believe that evidence does not matter.

Posted by: S. King at January 28, 2006 07:18 AM (7b4mH)

44 Look, anyone who has spent a few minutes looking at the evidence can see something was not right on 9/11. You really have to be blind to not question the government's involvement in 9/11. From hijackings done with boxcutters to pilots not alerting ground control of a hijack to the lack of air defenses to the strange collapses of WTC1, 2 and 7 to the bizarre plane crashes at the pentagon and in Shanksville, it is all to clear the official story is a joke. I can understand not wanting to admit the government was behind it, it is an ugly truth, and it is hard to bear. But wake up. This is the truth of our country, and 9/11 was just the most extreme example of many other similar hoaxes over the years. If you want to live in denial fine, but you're being used, and you should realize it.

Posted by: Spooked at January 28, 2006 09:23 AM (wPOBL)

45 S. King The question was, "what web sites would you recommend, those not carrying Government disinformation, those that aren't trying to sell easily disproved idiot theories so as to discredit those that have serious scientific queries which the governments story needs to suspend the laws of physics to make their story work". The fact as stated by you was that Bush Lovers shared sites are disinformation. I can't be convinced of anything just because someone says something isn't good, I need to see the information they have used to reach their conclusion that something else is the right conclusion. I watched 2 TV sets from 8 minutes after the first plane hit. I saw the colonel in charge of the AFB interviewed, I heard reporters state that Bush was aware of the attack and was going to a press opportunity at an elementary BEFORE he read my pet goat and was caught on film being told the second plane hit another tower. I have about a dozen questions that the government wonÂ’t answer or their answers suspend the laws of physics, the only answers I have is that Bush and his cronies have dodged an investigation, downright said that 9/11 will never be investigated, then when it was investigated, those I saw live on TV were on the Â‘hand offÂ’ list for National Security and the list goes on. If you have ever raised a mess of teens, going through puberty, you know when something is up. YouÂ’d think these boys were able to lie to us better than a bunch of 6th/7th graders, after all, the are OUR REPRESENTATIVES, not the Big Corporations, which they act like. Questioner

Posted by: questioner at January 28, 2006 11:16 AM (95gWQ)

46 Spooked, Quite the contrary, Spooked. I've spent four years consistently debunking the 9/11 Denial Movement. When you make such idiotic statements as you just did, it is quite obvious you haven't even spent one minute evaluating the evidence whatsoever. Pardon me for laughing but you are awfully naive and gullible.

Posted by: S. King at January 28, 2006 12:25 PM (Rdl8p)

47 Questionner wrote: "The fact as stated by you was that Bush Lovers shared sites are disinformation." You are confused. You forgot that you stated that, to wit: "so former Bush lover's web sites are pretty much showing what has been disproved." Those are your words, not mine, but you are unwilling to identify what web sites those are. Then your write: "I have about a dozen questions that the government wonÂ’t answer or their answers suspend the laws of physics, the only answers I have is that Bush and his cronies have dodged an investigation, downright said that 9/11 will never be investigated, then when it was investigated, those I saw live on TV were on the Â‘hand offÂ’ list for National Security and the list goes on." To make the incredulous statement that "their answers suspend the laws of physics", you must be getting that information from somewhere. Why are you unwiling to tell us?

Posted by: S. King at January 28, 2006 12:45 PM (Rdl8p)

48 Questionner wrote: "The fact as stated by you was that Bush Lovers shared sites are disinformation." You are confused. You forgot that you stated that, to wit: "so former Bush lover's web sites are pretty much showing what has been disproved." Those are your words, not mine, but you are unwilling to identify what web sites those are. Then your write: "I have about a dozen questions that the government wonÂ’t answer or their answers suspend the laws of physics, the only answers I have is that Bush and his cronies have dodged an investigation, downright said that 9/11 will never be investigated, then when it was investigated, those I saw live on TV were on the Â‘hand offÂ’ list for National Security and the list goes on." To make the incredulous statement that "their answers suspend the laws of physics", you must be getting that information from somewhere. Why are you unwilling to tell us?

Posted by: S. King at January 28, 2006 12:46 PM (Rdl8p)

49 Ignore S. King he is a troll that only hopes to waste your time in endless "debate"

Posted by: Greg Nixon at January 28, 2006 09:54 PM (wT6sE)

50 It is amazing to see the number of complete nuts we have in this country.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 28, 2006 11:29 PM (rUyw4)

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Council of Europe: US Media Being 'Pressured' To Cover Up Torture

It's not surprising that the France-based Council of Europe would issue a press release bashing the Bush administration and European governments that cooperate with the US. What is surprising is that the release would contain such blatant hogwash [emphasis added]: more...

Posted by: Bluto at 09:38 AM | Comments (4) | Add Comment
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Carnival of Liberty XXIX

Carnival of Liberty #29 is up at Combs Spouts Off.

And what a carnival it is! Where else can you find drug warrior fisking, enviro bashing, a heartfelt thank you to a soldier, a whole gaggle of Kelo rants and eminent domain updates, and a retired police officer rubbing shoulders with an anarchist?

Not as cool as Roman Numeral XL but it does have IX, many machines on IX.

Posted by: Howie at 08:30 AM | Comments (2) | Add Comment
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Two More Germans Taken Hostage in Iraq

Two German engineers have been taken hostage in Iraq. Their names are Thomas Wischke and Rebiti Drata.

Let me reiterate why hostage taking has become so common in Iraq: because it works. Worse, when you find out that a particular country is willing to pay ransom then the obvious lesson to be learned is take more hostages from that country. Among the two latest hostages to be released in Iraq, one was freed by Coalition troops and the other, Sussane Osthoff, was freed after Germany paid ransom.

Hat tip to reader George who sends this CNN link:

Gunmen wearing Iraqi army uniforms kidnapped two German engineers outside their workplace in the Iraqi industrial town of Baiji on Tuesday, police said, the latest in a surge of abductions of foreigners in Iraq.
At least six gunmen, in two unmarked cars, grabbed the two men just outside a detergent plant in an industrial complex around Iraq's biggest oil refinery, police Lieutenant Colonel Kadhem Abbas said.
German Foreign Minister Frank-Walter Steinmeier said: "We have indications that two Germans could have been kidnapped."
He told reporters in Berlin the ministry had set up a crisis team and was seeking further information from companies. A government official said the two men appeared to be from the eastern city of Leipzig and were working for an Iraqi firm.
The two were seized at around 8:30 a.m. (0530 GMT), said Abbas, who speaks for the Joint Coordination Center for Iraqi security forces and the U.S. military in the province....
An official at the factory, declining to give his name, said the two men were only on their third day of work there, setting up a new plant, and were grabbed as they arrived for work by car. Their driver was left unharmed by the kidnappers.

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January 23, 2006

Saddam Torture Videos (Images)

From time to time, we at The Jawa Report bring you information on graphic and violent videos. The reason we link to these videos is so that you will have a more complete understanding of the monsters that we fight. While we aknowledge that war--all war--leaves misery and death in its wake, there is something particularly evil about those who intentionally torture and murder.

And when we mention torture, we mean real torture. And when we say murder, we mean it in its literal sense--intentionally killing another human being.

More often than not, when the Left speaks of torture, they mean a practice which they find disdainful. What they deem torture is often an act of abuse. While both may be immoral, torture and abuse are a far cry from one another.

Further, when the extreme Left (which certainly does not include most American liberals or Democrats) characterizes the unintended killing of civilians by American military actions murder, they are really describing a type of homicide which is not murder.

While losing a child (God forbid) to any act of negligience is terrible, it is far more terrible to lose a child to an intentional act of homicide--a murder. For example, one might find forgiveness for the police officer who accidentally runs into your car, killing your loved one, while in hot pursuit of a serial murderer. However, it would be far harder to make peace with the serial murderer who the officer is pursuing if your child was one of his victims.

Further, whenever real examples of murder or torture by an American soldier is brought out, it is always discovered after the military has instituted its own investigation into the matter or only after the military has brought criminal charges against the responsible party.

Compare that to the very real acts of torture and murder by the Saddam Hussein regime. These acts of torture were not random acts by soldiers out of control. Murder and torture were the policy of the Baathist state. It was institutionalized torture. It was systematic murder.

In the spirit of previous posts done at this site, we bring you a series of graphic images captured from home movies taken by Fedayeen Saddam soldiers. From time to time we need to be reminded why we fight, and these horrible and gruesome images serve that purpose.

The videos they were captured from can be downloaded at the Foundation for the Defense of Democracy's website here. Hat tip to Pajamas Media who quote the FDD President as saying:

These images are brutal and disturbing Â– they are not intended for all audiences. But for those who want to understand the evils of the Saddam regime, and especially for anyone inclined to excuse or minimize the crimes committed, these videos demonstrate that Saddam was a ruthless mass murderer and a threat to all humanity.

Indeed.

Graphic images follow.

More background can be found in the following posts:
Kos Says U.S. Torture 'Equal' To that of Saddam Hussein (A comparison)
'Torture' vs. 'Torture'
The Gulag Archipelego vs. Amnesty International's 'Gulags'
Iraq Wins, Players Not Tortured
More Mass Graves Found in Kurdish Iraq
Abu Ghraib Guards Plea Guilty, Sentenced
Al Jazeera Cartoon Calls Jihadis to Arms
Giuliana Sgrena's Blood Libel Against the US
Church Report: Torture and Abuse Not U.S. Policy, Clears Top Officials
Ivy League Student: I Support the Iraqi Resistance 'Unconditionally'
Man Lies: Claims He is Hooded Figure in Famous Abu Ghraib Photo, Says He was Electrocuted
Pfc. Lynndie England to Plead Guilty for Pointing at Tiny Penises
Al Qaeda Handbook: "Claim the Americans are torturing you."
Chutzpah: Torturers at U.N. Accuse U.S. of Torture?
"I was tortured", Saddam Whimpers in Court

WARNING: GRAPHIC IMAGES BELOW SHOWING THE BRUTAL CRIMES OF SADDAM HUSSEIN.

DO NOT PROCEED IF YOU ARE UNDER 18 OR WISH TO REMAIN IMMERSED IN THE ILLUSION THAT THEIR IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE AMERICANS IN IRAQ AND THE MASS MURDERERS OF THE SADDAM HUSSEIN REGIME more...

Posted by: Rusty at 06:22 PM | Comments (19) | Add Comment
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1 you call these pictures torture?, these pictures are missing vital elements of torture: a man standing on box, with hood and fake wires, naked pyramids, pretend fellatio, Quran flushing and air conditioning torture.

Posted by: dave at January 23, 2006 08:28 PM (CcXvt)

2 Rusty, you and I understand the reason we're there. No question in our minds. But I'm telling you right now, the idiots out there are going to brush these aside, just like they've done with everything else, and make like we're the bad guys. They'll never get it, they're just not bright enough. I'm sorry, but that's the truth.

Posted by: dick at January 23, 2006 08:55 PM (HZr/3)

3 Further, when the extreme Left (which certainly does not include most American liberals or Democrats)... Rusty, I have a lot of respect for you, but I have to take you to task for you willingness to give them a pass like this. The extreme left is perfectly representative of the average liberal I meet, it just isn't apparent until you get into their heads. I don't care if it's Osama or just someone willing to carry his water, an enemy is an enemy.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 09:35 PM (0yYS2)

4 Maxi, it's pretty apparent to me that the average liberal is out there in left field, so I wholly agree with what you say. I don't know if it's BDS or if the average liberal has gotten more, well, leftist, for lack of a better word. But I have noticed the rhetoric of the left has become more and more radical. Perhaps it has to do with the lefty blogs being more radical, or perhaps it's the GWOT, but the left has become more radical, whatever the reason.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 09:44 PM (rUyw4)

5 But there were never any beheadings in Iraq until after the US invaded in it's illegal war of oppression and slavery against Islam to steal oil to fill the wallets of Halliburton and Cheney! /diahrrea of the mouth mode off

Posted by: Ariya at January 23, 2006 10:32 PM (uxW3N)

6 What I want to see is pictures of some female GI interrogator given a lap dance in her skivies to a muslim prisoner! I'll pay for that!

Posted by: hondo at January 23, 2006 10:34 PM (3aakz)

7 Ariya Now that's funny! And sooooooo retro!

Posted by: hondo at January 23, 2006 10:36 PM (3aakz)

8 Pretty Brutal stuff... www.savethesoldiers.com

Posted by: Noodlehead at January 23, 2006 11:10 PM (EHsSh)

9 Just to bump some of the previous posts: this attitude of giving the Left the benefit of doubt is getting old. At this point there's no need to portray a fairness and objectivity which increasingly has no basis in reality. In the end it only allows for further consideration of legitimacy for present day liberals utterly perverting the original principals and intent of liberalism.

Posted by: Jawapuke at January 24, 2006 03:08 AM (FJhWm)

10 Those images are very graphic, but they don't constitute torture since they show brown people using violence against other brown people. Thus they lack the 'whitey-colonial-oil-empire' element that's needed to get the left upset.

Posted by: Graeme at January 24, 2006 04:04 AM (svnaF)

11 Damn Graeme, how do you get so much point with so little making?

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 09:03 AM (0yYS2)

12 Graeme, Rhodesia was a case in point, and still is. As long as it is Mugabe murdering black Africans, well, hell, that's ok. Great point, Graeme. It applies in so many places in the world today, including the UN.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 24, 2006 10:06 AM (rUyw4)

13 Good point JJ, Rhodesia was the most prosperous nation in Africa on a per capita basis, for both blacks and whites, even after averageing for each group seperately to account for the income differences between them. Russia and China targeted it for revolution, and the Western nations went along obediently. There should be sooooo many people lined up and shot for the sins of the last century.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 11:17 AM (0yYS2)

14 IM: Do you realize that the sissy assed, liberal, muslim loving, America hating punks have been sprewing their stupidity less and less these days? The Jawas on the run? Are they giving up? Has the force been too tough on them? I will pray to Yoda to give them the balls to continue the fight before the forces of good become bored.

Posted by: greyrooster at January 25, 2006 08:25 PM (YjVDY)

15 I guess whining constantly gets old, or maybe their moms all kicked them out of their basements and made them get jobs or something horrible like that.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 26, 2006 02:53 AM (0yYS2)

16 It is no coincidence that these pictures 'emerge' on the coattails of the cartoons, now is it?

Posted by: goesh at February 15, 2006 01:35 PM (vX0fY)

17 Ya right, justify complete disregard for human dignity and morals. Yes, justify your obscene comparison of anything close to this an all other proof of Abu Ghraib being obscurded or doctored by anyone but who, the guy who took these and was there??? For these very photos and all others from the original DISC of pictures are proof that this is a war of culture and some sick comparision of who is superior in this human race, and us proving them inferior, which is something we as Americans NOW will not suceed in if this is what WE?? represent. This subculture of that hides behind Ultra-Conservative views that really in reality are as sick and deviant as what they protray is the enemy of our American MOrales are being used on a rountine basis by the military INTELLIGENCE?? These higher ups, Ultra-Conservs running the BUSH Administration that run this show (our military operations) seemed to dwell in mad undercurrent of emotionless psychological terrorism (ie. Fake Terrorism-911, phony iconisms Ossama, and blatant propaganda WMD'S, germ warfare via bird flu) that resembles some Apocalypse NOW...drug induced moral neuroses they have sunk into, in which they feel they can manipulate our world's views into what THEY THINK is just and right, not the actual needs of a Government running a country, but a Govenrment runn by big oil, money, pharmaceuticals to numb and anything to make personal profit for the Coporate INdustries that run OUR GOVERNMENT....God Save Us....please ....are you there???!!

Posted by: Joe Schmo at February 15, 2006 06:06 PM (oaqtF)

18 It's sad that we are losing white people lives to keep all these brownies from cutting each other up.

Posted by: Ron at February 16, 2006 10:29 PM (cX13h)

19 That shit is awesome and I wish I could do that to some people w/o being thrown in jail or even risking being thrown in jail because people suck and lots of them deserve to be mutilated and killed.

Posted by: I H8 U at March 22, 2006 04:07 PM (lzB0A)

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NSC Wiretapping Likely to get Congressional Approval

File under: it's not fascism if we give you the green light. Remember that Senate hearing that the partisan Left is chomping at the bits to expose McChimpy's inate fascism in? Well it looks like the Dems are going to take the opportunity to:

a) expose Bush as a fascist for wiretapping international phone calls without a warrant
b) call him the fascist that he is
c) authorize him to do the very thing he was doing that made him a fascist.

Via James Joyner this from WaPo:

U.S. surveillance laws should be reviewed and possibly rewritten to allow the type of eavesdropping that U.S. President George W. Bush has been criticized for authorizing, lawmakers from both parties said on Sunday....
"What he's (Rove) trying to pretend is somehow Democrats don't want to eavesdrop appropriately to protect the country. That's a lie," Kerry said. "We're prepared to eavesdrop wherever and whenever necessary in order to make America safer."
'THERE IS A WAY'
But Kerry said the spying has to be legal and constitutional and if Bush needs the law to be changed, "then come to us and tell us... There is a way to protect the Constitution and not go off on your own and violate it."
Other prominent Democratic senators including Dick Durbin of Illinois, Charles Schumer of New York and Joseph Lieberman of Connecticut made similar comments about reexamining the breadth and modernity of FISA in television interviews a few days after Rove urged Republicans to campaign on national security and the war on terror.
Arizona Republican Sen. John McCain, who has also questioned the legality of the eavesdropping, also urged the administration to work with Congress on modernizing the 1978 FISA law to take into account technological changes in communications.
"I know of no member of Congress, frankly, who, if the administration came and said here's why we need this capability, that they wouldn't get it. And so let's have the hearings," McCain said on Fox News Sunday.

I guess that moots Jeff Goldstein's argument.

Posted by: Rusty at 06:01 PM | Comments (14) | Add Comment
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1 Like I suspected from the start - this particular NSA program is in all likehood - PRIMARILY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE TOTAL SUCCESS IN PREVENTING FURTHER AQ TERROR ATTACKS WITHIN THE US ... PLUS THE GREAT POSSIBLITY IN FOILING SOME OF THEIR ACTIONS OVERSEAS. Congress can get access to the success stories - its up to the DEMs if they go public - think they wanna? Lib/Left is interested in only a legal LAW arguement and how it conceiveably affects them (they've always been paranoid about things like this anyway - and that hysteria will remain long after). To them, this is just a vehicle to GET BUSH - but the wheels are falling off and its just about out of gas. Please Left! - bombard me with tons of references to FISA - interesting to note your data confirms FISA adhered to vast majority of time! - these ARE THE EXCEPTIONS - please explain not to me - but the American public - why exceptions are bad and not allowed.

Posted by: hondo at January 23, 2006 06:23 PM (3aakz)

2 I'm not as convinced as McCain that players like Kerry, and a few others wouldn't have mucked it up, dragged it out and argued semantics for ever just to hear their own voices drone on and flex their muscles and pretend to be important. And it's real easy to say "why didn't you just ask?" after finding out nearly two thirds of the country is against you. Funny how we went from - Thousands and thousands of people's rights being trampled, nay STOMPED! - to a wimpering "Why didn't you just ask?" The melodrama shifting to condescension and back makes me seasick. We haven't even determined if any laws were broken to begin with.

Posted by: Oyster at January 23, 2006 06:25 PM (YudAC)

3 Oh, boy. 'But Kerry said the spying has to be legal and constitutional and if Bush needs the law to be changed, "then come to us and tell us... There is a way to protect the Constitution and not go off on your own and violate it."'? This guy was running for President and thinks passing a law makes something constitutional? Ignoring, of course, whether or not what is in the law is desirable. But the ignorance of the basics regarding the relationship of law and Constitution in someone who has been a Congressman for (how many years?) is staggering.

Posted by: Phillep at January 23, 2006 06:26 PM (Xg00m)

4 The Democrats put their finger up in the air, saw which way the wind was blowing, and decided to support spying on people who are talking to al-Queda. The Rovian Mind Ray has struck again. I advise investment in tin mines and tin foil manufacturing plants.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 06:55 PM (rUyw4)

5 Oyster Its called backpedaling. Overall FISA was adhered to - this aspect was the exceptions - and the exceptions appear to be successes too. Dems can't find proof exceptions were "the rule" nor any proof of going off intended target (AQ). Without anything substantial evidence contrary - Dems run hugh risk of EXPOSING BUSH ADMINISTRATION SUCCESS STORIES ON WAR ON TERROR. See why the backpedaling.

Posted by: hondo at January 23, 2006 06:56 PM (3aakz)

6 Now you have to ask, is the damage done to the program now it's all out in the open? So they would have authorized it, but it's been leaked to the press and is now probably worthless?

Posted by: dave at January 23, 2006 08:11 PM (CcXvt)

7 Sure makes you wonder just whose side they are on, Dave? Actually, I don't have to wonder, I know.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 08:14 PM (rUyw4)

8 How it my argument mooted?

Posted by: Jeff G at January 23, 2006 08:17 PM (YAOAH)

9 >>it looks like the Dems are going to take the opportunity to: authorize him to do the very thing he was doing that made him a fascist." bwahaha! You Lefties are such dopes!!!!

Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at January 23, 2006 08:45 PM (paKD6)

10 That makes two of us JJ. The likes of bin Kerry, bin Kennedy, et al, are nothing but enemies of America and should be treated as such.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 09:37 PM (0yYS2)

11 Maxi, I honestly believe a time is coming very soon when everyone is going to have to make a stand, and tell whether they support the US or terrorists. The fence-sitters will be forced to jump on one side or the other, and it will be apparent to everyone which side you are on. I look forward to that day, although I know it will signal a difficult time for our nation. But we have made it through difficult times before, so I have no doubt we will prevail against these Islamists and their allies in the US.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 09:56 PM (rUyw4)

12 dave Did ya notice this aspect of the program began immediately after 9/11/01? Did ya notice that Risen & the NYT (who broken this "story" 'bout 2 months ago ?) sat on it for a year? (pushin' this back to say 10/04) - You do realize putting the story together also takes time - pushing it back even further. You do realize the "info" they were getting was already old. fighting a war requires staying adept and flexible - and constanting changing and adapting to the circumstances at hand. I firmly suspect what is "available" now to know is "looking" for a way to get known.

Posted by: hondo at January 23, 2006 10:17 PM (3aakz)

13 What kills me too is that when the NYT broke the story, Nancy Pelosi instantly released a letter she wrote to Bush in '01 (or was it early '02?) expressing her "concerns" - a letter she wrote AFTER she gave it a thumbs up. And BEFORE she signed off on it numerous times more as each review was done. These guys are committing a slow and methodical political suicide.

Posted by: Oyster at January 24, 2006 05:25 AM (YudAC)

14 "These guys are committing a slow and methodical political suicide." You're right Oyster, but I would much prefer the real thing. Of course then we'd have to forego the pleasure of possibly seeing them hang for treason one day.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 09:09 AM (0yYS2)

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Sharia Porn

Do not follow this link. I'm warning you. It could get you fired.

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All Your Jihadis Are Belongs to Us (and Murtha is a Traitor)

A British jihadi left this wonderful message earlier today. He is an MCI DSL user from London. Notice how the ignorant jihadi cites Rep. Murtha as 'proof' that the U.S. is all but defeated in Iraq. And no jihadi message would be complete without a reference to the evil Jew bankers who are really behind this whole war thing.

You'd expect such a message out of Pakistan or Saudi Arabia, but London? Scary. more...

Posted by: Rusty at 05:04 PM | Comments (11) | Add Comment
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1 Wait, isn't Bin-ladin asking for a puase in the war. Ineffective? evidentally this guy hasn't taken a trip to his home land. His mentor is stuck in a cave and Forces from all over the globe (except France....heh hem..) are taking down terrorists left and right. (!!GO RUSTY!!) This guy is definately sniffing camel dung. someone please remind this moron about the last time someone tried to kill off the jews and what America did to him and his clan. What the hell, don't they watch the History channel over there?

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 23, 2006 05:26 PM (MOKXn)

2 And as soon as you stop occupying Japan and S. Korea you'll see what those people really want. How many trillions of dollars have been wasted occupying those countries? /tin foil

Posted by: Rusty at January 23, 2006 06:03 PM (JQjhA)

3 British Jahidai you say? When I first read his post I assumed he was just some Broke back Mountain loving democrat typing his hate America post at a Starbucks while sipping a Latte with extra whipped cream. After all he did hit most of the democrat talking points. God, I almost replied Â“DonÂ’t just parrot Ted Kennedy you asshole, think up something newÂ”. Hmmmmm British Jahidai, you donÂ’t say?

Posted by: Brad at January 23, 2006 06:39 PM (3OPZt)

4 You mean the evil Jew bankers aren't behind the whole thing??? Man do I need to go back to school.

Posted by: Quintapalus at January 23, 2006 07:10 PM (Rw/bh)

5 Are none of these imbeciles familiar with the black knight from Monty Python and the Holy Grail?

Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at January 23, 2006 07:14 PM (RHG+K)

6 What a douchebag. Please, if there's anybody in need of some high quality wall to wall counseling, it's this bonehead.

Posted by: dick at January 23, 2006 07:20 PM (HZr/3)

7 even funnier is the fact he thinks asymmetric, Guerilla warface causing problems for militaries is a new thing, it's a part of just about every insurgency: attack resupply lines, food supplies and soft targets like civilian authorities, and people aiding the military. It has a limited effect, and timespan, and does not show the weakness of any military, maybe just some of the techniques.

Posted by: dave at January 23, 2006 08:17 PM (CcXvt)

8 LOL! Just goes to show you that propoganda is the only weapon the hajis have left. 15 kills for every death and our soldiers sure are taking a beating, damn!

Posted by: Jack's Smirking Revenge at January 24, 2006 04:26 AM (CtVG6)

9 Actually Jack, it's closer to 20:1 losses they're suffering. I consider it to be kinda like natural selection on fast forward, with those stupid enough to face our forces getting skimmed from the gene pool before they can breed, thus removing the craziest of crazy genes from the muslim bloodlines, so that perhaps in twenty years or so, jihadis will be pretty hard to come by. Of course a few megatons would have much the same effect, but we can' do that for some reason.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 09:13 AM (0yYS2)

10 Murtha is a reptile he must crawl around in a wagon rut under the bellies of the snakes

Posted by: sandpiper at January 24, 2006 10:58 AM (U+eLg)

11 Murtha is the political equivalent of a dung beetle. Other dhimmicrats spew the crap, and he just rolls it up and pretends it's worth something.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 11:19 AM (0yYS2)

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The New Know-Nothings

Ed Morrissey at Captain's Quarters exposes the antics of Leftist virtual bookburners afflicting Amazon.com. Conservative titles have been systematically targeted for "egraffiti" including phony cover pictures and scurrilous "reviews". Captain Ed sums it up in his own inimitable fashion:

That's not the actions of people who have confidence in themselves. Those are the actions of a fearful, small-minded, vulgar group of Neanderthals who have suddenly seen Homo sapiens and realized that their days are numbered. These mouthbreathers cannot offer any new ideas, so instead of trying to compete with conservatives, they're busy with the electronic equivalent of sticking their fingers into their ears and shouting, "LA-LA-LA-LA, NO ONE CAN HEAR YOU!!" as loudly as possible.

Michelle Malkin is on the case, as well.

Also posted at The Dread Pundit Bluto.

Posted by: Bluto at 03:37 PM | Comments (15) | Add Comment
Post contains 135 words, total size 1 kb.

1 Give it time - we will soon here of conservative books and publications being defaced, destroyed and supressed at your local Barnes & Noble and Mall book stores. They are losing - and they are losing it. Stunts like these may turn them on for a few moments - but backfiring is inevitable - and I'm loving it.

Posted by: hondo at January 23, 2006 03:53 PM (3aakz)

2 I wish I could at least feign surprise, but I am genuinely amused.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 03:56 PM (0yYS2)

3 I love a wordsmith. My hat is off to you for this succinct, blistering traducement of 'mouthbreathers'. "....who have suddenly seen Homo sapiens and realized their days are numbered." Bravo. Your sentiments are right on, and your words hit the bullseye.

Posted by: Phoenix at January 23, 2006 04:13 PM (ksj+Z)

4 The liberals just never waste an opportunity to make themselves look stupid. They so generously make it easy for the rest of us.

Posted by: Graeme at January 23, 2006 04:20 PM (j0Fnw)

5 Pitiful and laughable describe these little people. They also do such infantile things as steal political signs and key automobiles that have "Dubya" stickers on them. I'm beginning to agree with some who say "liberalism is a mental disorder".

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 04:57 PM (rUyw4)

6 These are the "tolerant" and "open-minded" ones who care about "freedom of speech"...... except when you don't agree with them. The evidence does indeed continue to mount-- Liberalism is a mental disorder.

Posted by: Jesusland Carlos at January 23, 2006 05:26 PM (paKD6)

7 And these people are worried about being wiretapped? Why would we need wiretapping for them when all one has to do is stand on any street corner with a bag of popcorn and take in the show? Only an insecure, small-minded twat would treat a book review forum as their own political blog.

Posted by: Oyster at January 23, 2006 05:40 PM (YudAC)

8 Oh I've got one you guys will love. I had a client go into a furious rage at me, (over the phone, of course, they never seem to have the nerve to do these things face to face), because I had told someone I wasn't a democrat when they asked, and he heard about it. I wasn't proselytizing, I just said "No, I'm not a Democrat.", and left it at that, but he got all stupid about it. Go figure. These people are sick in the head and should all be lock up or shot or sent to a leper colony or something.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 09:47 PM (0yYS2)

9 These NAZIS want to burn all conservative books what a bunch of rotten rats take them all out and hang them all

Posted by: sandpiper at January 24, 2006 11:00 AM (U+eLg)

10 That's the spirit Sandpiper! You're coming around nicely.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 11:23 AM (0yYS2)

11 Is this type of book review/politically blogging on Amazon only done by the left ? If so I guess that we should all pat ourselves on the back for being above that sort of behavior.

Posted by: john Ryan at January 24, 2006 12:38 PM (TcoRJ)

12 When I went over to Bluto's site to check I FOUND THAT AMAZON is one of his sponsors. This is like seeing the quote from the gay socialist at the top of this page !

Posted by: john Ryan at January 24, 2006 02:24 PM (TcoRJ)

13 John Amazon is everybody's sponsor! - time for you to get out of that cocoon!

Posted by: hondo at January 24, 2006 04:40 PM (3aakz)

14 John, Amazon is one of the victims in this. They are not the ones vandalizing their own ads.

Posted by: The Dread Pundit Bluto at January 24, 2006 05:01 PM (RHG+K)

15 eoioeux oxxirb

Posted by: Miles at March 02, 2006 11:31 PM (sY+Gn)

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I'll Take a Bucket of Original Recipe and a Suicide Belt to Go

Hate America, love Colonel Sanders. It's not so much the food as the secret additive that makes Syrians crave it fortnightly.

Posted by: Rusty at 01:56 PM | Comments (25) | Add Comment
Post contains 47 words, total size 1 kb.

1 I think Mike Meyers sums it up nicely: "It's a sign of the Pentaburate, which consists of the Queen. The Vatican. The Getty's. The Rothschilds. AND Colonel Sanders before he went heads up! Oh, I hated the Colonel with his wee BEADY eyes! and that smug look on his face, 'Oh! You're gonna buy my chicken, OHHH!"

Posted by: Newslinker at January 23, 2006 02:11 PM (Gi7oA)

2 It's actually "tets up". Damn I love that movie.

Posted by: caltechgirl at January 23, 2006 02:54 PM (/vgMZ)

3 All your chicken are belong to us! Col. Sanders akhbar!

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 03:19 PM (0yYS2)

4 I believe it's Col. Momar Sanders, no relation.

Posted by: Brass at January 23, 2006 04:18 PM (6TLEO)

5 notice that this news came out immediately after teh South Park episode was rebroadcasted this week where Cartman eats all the skin off the Kentucky Fried Chicken and then thinks he dies from it....I see a direct connection here.

Posted by: Steve Sharon at January 23, 2006 04:42 PM (LY1nq)

6 notice that this news came out immediately after the South Park episode was rebroadcasted this week where Cartman eats all the skin off the Kentucky Fried Chicken and then thinks he dies from it....I see a direct connection here.

Posted by: Steve Sharon at January 23, 2006 04:42 PM (LY1nq)

7 Steve, Do you think Butters might act as a medium to relay messages from Cartman to the Syrian dictator in chief?

Posted by: Rusty at January 23, 2006 04:53 PM (JQjhA)

8 Forget the kentucky fried shite, this is much more interesting: 'American military power is completely unrivalled in world today' America wasted it resources and is not fighting a different type of war that it is designed to fight. American can sustain itself for 3-weeks of aerial bombings, shock and awe nonsense and then its military is useless as Iraq has shown. The US will not invade another country as Iraq has shown how low-cost IEDs can neutralize America's high tech military junk. IN order to invade to steal oil, you need boots on the ground which would mean a perpetual draft of US citizens (oil protection workers), a major economic lesson the US is learning in Iraq. America military supremacy has been exposed as nothing but a myth created in hollywood. Look what the Iraq war has done. The US was only able to invade Iraq after 14 years of genocidal sanctions, daily no fly zone bombings and after the UN had disarmed Iraq. The US has NEVER won a political battle following military intervention, as soon as US troops leave Iraq and Afghanistan everything the built will be dismantled. Even with all that the US still cannot control Iraq, much less the road from the airport to their heavily fortfied Green Zone prison. American troops can't freely walk around anywhere in Iraq and are confined to fortified bases, not exactly the way you would expect from a super power. Even in Vietnam, US troops were able walk around Saigon. NOT IN IRAQ. The Iraq war has turned into a $ 2 trillion debacle that the US cannot sustain and clearly the Iraq war has been economically (and militarily) self-defeating for the US. Look how higher oil prices have destroyed the US transport industry with GM and Ford about to file for bankruptcy and Delphi already in bankruptcy. Before the US even thinks about attacking Iran it should tabulate the economic damage that the Iraq war has already done. The US doesn't have 14 years to wait for Iran sanctions to work and doesnt have the resources to take on Iran. How is the US going to fund another $6 trillion war with Iran: by borrowing from China or printing up more worthless dollars? The Iraqi Resistance has shown how to defeat a stupid superpower who believe the US military (bloated, ineffective and inefficient) can used to reverse US economic decline. First, you let the dumb Super Imperial Army in your gates, then you cut off their exit routes leaving them trapped in a long, costly and bloody guerilla war that they can never win. The US generals are so desperate in Iraq that they have to speak through congressman Murtha about their plight. The US generals in Iraq dare not tell their political leadership that they have been defeated, they have to hide their failure behind Murtha, bying time to find so face-saving way to hide the defeat. The entire world is bored with America and its nuclear arsenal, the only thing they have left after sqaundering their resources on one war too many and useless military bases around the globe. "If China or Russia choose to veto UN sanctions than the US may choose to weld the big stick against these countries" What bigstick is this? What exactly does the US have that Chinese and Russian can't find elsewhere? China is America's banker and China would hardly fund the US so that the US can attack China. Russia has a ton of oil and is nuclear power that the US can do nothing about. America's once military dominance was based on it economic power, now that the ecoomic power has dwindled, the military is useless. The US military cannot be used to reverse America's economic decline, despite what the ignorant jews believe.

Posted by: mypetpig at January 23, 2006 05:00 PM (h6T16)

9 Another stupid jihadist with another stupid screed. And they are not supposed to consume alcohol. Hey, pig, come back when you can speak English, and quit going to Kos for all your info, you dumb ass.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 05:07 PM (rUyw4)

10 Geez Jesusland joe, Do you believe the mouth on that guy? And to think, he frenched his mom with those lips.You see, that's what happens with inbreeding. What moron didn't realize is that while he is safe (for now)in some far off land, America and Allies have just fortified a new bunker, Iraq. We gave property to a president which in turn will be our friend. If jerk weed thinks he can return safely home to pick up some ammo, he has another thing coming. It played off nicely. Why run around chasing bombers when we can go after the factory? It was one of those, "look, see my right hand, good! As long as you don't see my left". And as usual,America does have one thing left. we can all join the military and show them we are not as lazy as they think we are. I'm always ready to defend this land. "HooraH" "grrr"

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 23, 2006 05:48 PM (MOKXn)

11 Dream on trailer trash! lol

Posted by: mypetpig at January 23, 2006 06:17 PM (qbjMV)

12 Taco Bandit, What do you expect from a person who had a goat as an ancestor? And a pedophile for a prophet.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 07:05 PM (rUyw4)

13 You trailer trashers are rather presumptious that i am muslim...i do admitedly have infinate respect for Islam compared to your satanic cespit usa!

Posted by: mypetpig at January 23, 2006 07:08 PM (qbjMV)

14 That's interesting, because I read the other day Mohammed used to give hand-jobs to other tribe members for pennies to substain his lust for young men.

Posted by: dave at January 23, 2006 08:23 PM (CcXvt)

15 Pigboy, where did you learn to spell? You are nothing more than a dumb shit. Begone, you troll! No one here is interested in your drivel.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 08:28 PM (rUyw4)

16 Thank you for that link. Made my day. Oh yeah ... ATTN 'mypetpig' Have you ever heard the term 'luau'? It's finger lickin' good.

Posted by: Steel Turman at January 23, 2006 08:48 PM (rDIIu)

17 Of all the ingorant, fever-swamp inspired leftard rants I've read, that one's a real beauty! I think I'll copy it and print it off in a nice font on good paper, frame it, and give myself a titter evert day by reading it.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 09:42 PM (0yYS2)

18 Old pigboy is just trying to stir something up since his hero Osama is asking for a truce. We got Osama's son-in-law and a bunch of other al-queda shits last week and pigboy is upset. Pigboy better warn his buddies, we may get them next.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 10:05 PM (rUyw4)

19 I don't even think he's a muslim. What he says and how he uses it, something is different. I call his bluff. But, for safety sake, he sux billy goat titty. Sincerely, Trailer Trash Taco Bandit

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 24, 2006 07:49 AM (MOKXn)

20 Damn, I wish I had a trailer!

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 24, 2006 10:37 AM (rUyw4)

21 Good day to everyone, Sorry for the bad English, I'm French Canadian. I've discovered this site not too long ago. It's very interesting and informative. But when I see comments (or should I say delirium) like the one posted by mypetpig, I wonder how a person like that can even breathe without assistance. How can he be so stupid? Amazing... Keep that blog rolling guys, you make my day! Sincerely, Max

Posted by: Max at January 24, 2006 11:30 AM (WM45z)

22 Your only defense so far is calling piggy stupid. Perhaps adopting a broader view of history and the world at large would do some good. Money may grow on trees, afterall, the dollar is just a piece of paper printed up by the private organization known as The Federal Reserve. It's no longer backed by silver or gold, just good faith. When that good faith runs out, so does the value of the paper.

Posted by: mono at January 24, 2006 01:23 PM (7JM/1)

23 And how many other currencies in the world are backed by silver or gold, mono? Just curious?

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 24, 2006 04:14 PM (rUyw4)

24 Mono, We weren't calling piggy stupid. No, we were saying that his lack of intelligence dripped through his vocal chords in an abhorrence manner. OKAY, yeah, we called him stupid. BUT HE STARTED IT!

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 25, 2006 08:37 AM (MOKXn)

25 I just heard that Miss Chokesondick is teaching her students that Muslims like Kentucky Fried Chicken because taking the skin off the chicken is like removing the veils from their women, except the chicken look more appetizing.

Posted by: Steve Sharon at January 25, 2006 11:55 AM (ZqQAl)

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Stuff to Read

This week's RINO sightings is up, and hosted by our webdesigner Phin.

Posted by: Rusty at 11:05 AM | No Comments | Add Comment
Post contains 18 words, total size 1 kb.

Amnesty International Workers Detained in (of all places) Sudan

This can't be the same Sudan that is on the United Nation's High Commission on Human Rights? That's some other Sudan, right? Because the savior of the world, the U.N., would never allow one of the worst violators of human rights in the world to help police human rights violations. That's simply not possible.Amnesty International:

At 5:55 pm local time yesterday, security forces in plain clothes entered the building where the NGO Forum was being held. The security forces -- their number varying from six to 15 during the occurrence -- ordered all delegates to switch off their mobile phones. They said that the meeting was "unauthorized" and demanded the names of all participants. Participants, numbering approximately forty, were ordered to hand over all documents and laptops. Some resisted; the security forces forced upon their bags. Some small scuffles broke out. At this point more security forces entered and surrounded the room. Still and digital photographs, along with recorded video, were taken of all the participants. Some participants were pushed, threatened, and told "you better do what we say or you will face problems later". There were repeated demands to participants to hand over their belongings.
Security forces attempted to divide the participants into international and national groups. Attempts were also made to separate women from men. Many refused both requests.

Charming. Before we begin oppressing you, you will be happy to know that you will be gender segregated.

Posted by: Rusty at 11:02 AM | Comments (15) | Add Comment
Post contains 255 words, total size 2 kb.

1 Damn George Bush, damn Karl Rove, and damn Halliburton too! Seriously, I can't wait to see how the leftards pin this on everyone from Ronald Regan to Pat Robertson.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 11:08 AM (0yYS2)

2 Don't forget, treatment at Guantanamo is far, far worse.

Posted by: Graeme at January 23, 2006 11:18 AM (j0Fnw)

3 True, Graeme.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 12:07 PM (0yYS2)

4 I have no idea why any sane person would go willingly to the Sudan.

Posted by: tee bee at January 23, 2006 12:17 PM (q1JHF)

5 Sudan is a "valuable member in the War on Terror". The oft sited offer of handing over Osama bin Laden was an early example of their cooperation. Certainly on that basis alone some alleged mistreatment of Amnesty International and the long standing ummm unpleasantness in Darfur should be overlooked.

Posted by: john Ryan at January 23, 2006 12:38 PM (TcoRJ)

6 And you're surprised that Sudan is chairing the Human Rights Commission? What's funny (okay - not funny) is that when the war started in Iraq, Lybia was slated to take the human rights chair and Iraq was to chair the disarmament committee.

Posted by: Oyster at January 23, 2006 03:42 PM (osKlJ)

7 Ya know, at times like this I would trot out the old chestnut about foxes and henhouses, but it would just be trite.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 04:00 PM (0yYS2)

8 I've no desire or interest in getting involved with anything Sudan - Im pulling an actus on this one. If the Lib/Left or any human rights group wants to involve themselves - then form up your own "Lincoln Brigades" like the '30s and march off to righteous glory. They can start recruiting at their local Universities - I might even donate 20 bucks and some old Army Training Manuals. Suspect big problem would be that any leftists interested, will all want to be Colonels and Generals and argue over the color of their berets. Biggest problem however is that none would be interested in getting their hands dirty - when there is a perfectly good rally nearby with a cute cafe available across the street for later gatherings of righteous indignation and lattes.

Posted by: hondo at January 23, 2006 04:06 PM (3aakz)

9 Yep, hondo, I can see it now, the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King brigade. Volunteers are needed from the Left to go to the Sudan and clean the mess up. I can just imagine the number of volunteers. None.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 05:25 PM (rUyw4)

10 JJ Be honest! They will probably get a few naive fools probably believing THEIR PRESENSE as human shields between the Sudanese and the oppressed with ALTER THE COURSE OF HUMAN HISTORY. Once the Sudanese stop laughing, it may dawn on them that their target practice.

Posted by: hondo at January 23, 2006 05:41 PM (3aakz)

11 Inquiry to Lead at Headliner Search just moments ago re: Sudan, "Jeopardy@Iraq"

Posted by: Cheryl@StateInterests at January 23, 2006 05:50 PM (zta0g)

12 Inquiry to Lead at Headliner Search just moments ago re: Sudan, "Jeopardy@Iraq"

Posted by: Cheryl@StateInterests at January 23, 2006 05:51 PM (zta0g)

13 Inquiry to Lead at Headliner Search just moments ago re: Sudan, "Jeopardy@Iraq"

Posted by: Cheryl@StateInterests at January 23, 2006 05:51 PM (zta0g)

14 Uh, Cheryl... What? What? and, What?

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 09:49 PM (0yYS2)

15 I just can't understand why Karl Rove would dare say that some people around here are still thinking in a pre-September 11th fashion. I just don't get it. Why can't I go to Sudan and everything be happy, fuzzy, and warm?

Posted by: Dr. Zubov at January 24, 2006 12:46 PM (zrSt3)

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Osama Tape Forces Dems Into Tactical Retreat

It's just bad political karma for your political philosophy to be linked to the world's most notorious and evil terrorist.

This story in the Washington Post explains how and why anti-Bush politicos are changing tactics: more...

Posted by: Bluto at 10:30 AM | Comments (6) | Add Comment
Post contains 284 words, total size 2 kb.

E-mail a Terrorist

Here is the e-mail for the webmaster of The Political Committee Mujahideen Central Command website. The website is a propaganda outlet for terrorists in Iraq. I bet he'd like to be signed up for a gay singles website? Or how about the pork of the month e-mail? Better yet, why not find out how you can join or contribute the mujahidin?

albasrah2003@yahoo.com

If you receive an answer to your e-mail, please FORWARD it to me.

And where do you think this pro-jihad site comes from? Why, the new center of terrorism in the world: Gaza, of course.

But the physical server is not in Gaza. Come on, do you think they have the technology to do that? No, it's actually in The Netherlands run by your friendly neighborhood jihadi friendly webservice, 357Hosting.

Posted by: Rusty at 10:23 AM | Comments (18) | Add Comment
Post contains 138 words, total size 1 kb.

1 I did a little googling. I managed to get his e-mail out there somewhat. So far he should be receiving emails on a daily basis from the following: - The New Bible - Misourri Pork Association - ESPN Pork and Plastic - Daily Dating (Gay Men) I will continue my quest

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 23, 2006 12:30 PM (MOKXn)

2 'American military power is completely unrivalled in world today' America wasted it resources and is not fighting a different type of war that it is designed to fight. American can sustain itself for 3-weeks of aerial bombings, shock and awe nonsense and then its military is useless as Iraq has shown. The US will not invade another country as Iraq has shown how low-cost IEDs can neutralize America's high tech military junk. IN order to invade to steal oil, you need boots on the ground which would mean a perpetual draft of US citizens (oil protection workers), a major economic lesson the US is learning in Iraq. America military supremacy has been exposed as nothing but a myth created in hollywood. Look what the Iraq war has done. The US was only able to invade Iraq after 14 years of genocidal sanctions, daily no fly zone bombings and after the UN had disarmed Iraq. The US has NEVER won a political battle following military intervention, as soon as US troops leave Iraq and Afghanistan everything the built will be dismantled. Even with all that the US still cannot control Iraq, much less the road from the airport to their heavily fortfied Green Zone prison. American troops can't freely walk around anywhere in Iraq and are confined to fortified bases, not exactly the way you would expect from a super power. Even in Vietnam, US troops were able walk around Saigon. NOT IN IRAQ. The Iraq war has turned into a $ 2 trillion debacle that the US cannot sustain and clearly the Iraq war has been economically (and militarily) self-defeating for the US. Look how higher oil prices have destroyed the US transport industry with GM and Ford about to file for bankruptcy and Delphi already in bankruptcy. Before the US even thinks about attacking Iran it should tabulate the economic damage that the Iraq war has already done. The US doesn't have 14 years to wait for Iran sanctions to work and doesnt have the resources to take on Iran. How is the US going to fund another $6 trillion war with Iran: by borrowing from China or printing up more worthless dollars? The Iraqi Resistance has shown how to defeat a stupid superpower who believe the US military (bloated, ineffective and inefficient) can used to reverse US economic decline. First, you let the dumb Super Imperial Army in your gates, then you cut off their exit routes leaving them trapped in a long, costly and bloody guerilla war that they can never win. The US generals are so desperate in Iraq that they have to speak through congressman Murtha about their plight. The US generals in Iraq dare not tell their political leadership that they have been defeated, they have to hide their failure behind Murtha, bying time to find so face-saving way to hide the defeat. The entire world is bored with America and its nuclear arsenal, the only thing they have left after sqaundering their resources on one war too many and useless military bases around the globe. "If China or Russia choose to veto UN sanctions than the US may choose to weld the big stick against these countries" What bigstick is this? What exactly does the US have that Chinese and Russian can't find elsewhere? China is America's banker and China would hardly fund the US so that the US can attack China. Russia has a ton of oil and is nuclear power that the US can do nothing about. America's once military dominance was based on it economic power, now that the ecoomic power has dwindled, the military is useless. The US military cannot be used to reverse America's economic decline, despite what the ignorant jews believe

Posted by: mypetpig at January 23, 2006 04:47 PM (h6T16)

3 O Geez, Not you again. Still sippin camel piss I see. No, don't say anything....I Know....you hate american and jews and all infedels of the world. its ok, we hate you too. ALLAH SUX!

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 23, 2006 06:02 PM (MOKXn)

4 lol..Hoorah...OOYAHHH!!! http://icasualties.org/oif/prdDetails.aspx?hndRef=1-2006

Posted by: mypetpig at January 23, 2006 06:27 PM (qbjMV)

5 Hey, pigboy, surely your goat awaits your gentle touch. LOL! Or perhaps you're a pedophile just like your prophet! Either way, have a nice day, goat fucker!

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 07:17 PM (rUyw4)

6 Whats with you americans very predictable useof filthy language? Whether i am online playing computer games or on a political forum and of course here on this low brow site of nazi fucks I allways find that americans resort to foul abusive language. I s this a typical insight into the mind of an american?

Posted by: mypetpig at January 23, 2006 07:24 PM (qbjMV)

7 Oh by the way, what weight are you guys?

Posted by: mypetpig at January 23, 2006 07:30 PM (qbjMV)

8 I notice a propensity americans to say "Ill rape you!" etc... Whats that all baout?

Posted by: mypetpig at January 23, 2006 07:32 PM (qbjMV)

9 " I s this a typical insight into the mind of an american?" Yes. We're foul-mouthed, arrogant, and violent. Though I can't speak for all of us, I personally enjoy slaughtering Mahdi Army "fighters" by the dozen in Sadr City with the M242 Bushmaster 25mm chain gun equipped in my M2A3 Bradley IFV. I also enjoy golf on the weekends. Any other questions you'd like answered?

Posted by: Supernaut at January 23, 2006 07:34 PM (RS0bT)

10 "I notice a propensity americans to say "Ill rape you!" etc... Whats that all baout?" I've lived in the US for 33 years, and I've never heard anyone say that. Then again, I've not spent any time in a maximum security prison

Posted by: File Closer at January 23, 2006 07:37 PM (RS0bT)

11 Keep telling yourself that you hatemonger. The nerve of this guy calling us Nazis--and also accusing us of being Jews!!

Posted by: Rusty at January 23, 2006 07:58 PM (JQjhA)

12 Pigboy, When you learn to spell and conduct yourself with more aplomb, come back. Meanwhile, write yourself a memo about Islam being a peaceful religion. Oh, and if you want my recipe for ham cassarole, just let me know. I have a cat named Snowball.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 08:44 PM (rUyw4)

13 Oh this fucker's funny, we have to keep him around.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 09:50 PM (0yYS2)

14 Maxi, old Pigboy is pissed that we deep-sixed a bunch of al-queda shits last week.

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 23, 2006 10:12 PM (rUyw4)

15 Pork eating clueless islamotard human garbage living in Scotland, Hey, whatÂ’s a tard like you doing in Scotland? You and your kind have been abusing freedom for long enough, it's time to stop abusing the privileges and time for to go back to whatever mudhole you and all your useless ancestors crawled up from and live the simple life of a real islamotard. Go back to the Arab streets, you do not belong and you are not welcome in the free world. Scum like you are reason why the GWOT has to go on.

Posted by: V at January 24, 2006 04:31 AM (BeTNH)

16 Pig, You should stick around jawa, you raise an argument every time. I still say your not a muslim. You are just trying to raise arguments. Also, that whole "i'll rape you" question. Are you inquiring for yourself, if so, check out your local gay bar. I'm sure they are willing to show you the actual meaning of the term. Jesusland Joe, you silly guy. Don't you know cats are not made of pork.

Posted by: Taco Bandit at January 24, 2006 08:05 AM (MOKXn)

17 I needed a new paragraph for my cat, didn't I? Damn that English teacher!

Posted by: jesusland joe at January 24, 2006 10:18 AM (rUyw4)

18 Yo pigman, We have not yet begun to fight. I'm amazed how they think America is on it's last leg. Not missed a meal yet, Not drafted a man yet. We've even been Careful. If you are interested in seeing what the US can really do just keep it up.

Posted by: Howie at January 24, 2006 04:16 PM (D3+20)

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Not Dhimmis, but not Right

The talk over the Dutch move to the Right is hype, says Peaktalk. Agreed, but at least they are becoming less dhimmified.

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If Michael Moore, Osama bin Laden, and Shamoo the Whale Were in the Same Room....

...could you tell them apart? Answer.

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Tin Foil Amplifies Karl Rove's Mind Rays

Loyal readers keep reminding me that experiments show that tin foil actually amplifies mind rays. If so, how do you keep Karl Rove out of your head?

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Election '08 Top Nominees

FYI I picked John McCain as my most desirable nominee for 2008. Why? Because he is solidly pro-war and has been the President's most articulate defender in that policy. All the other issues that I disagree with McCain over are a secondary concern. Plus, if the media keeps hounding the "corruption" non-story, then McCain is ultimately the most electable of the bunch.

Right-Of-Center Bloggers Select The Most & Least Desired 2008 Republican Nominee

Posted by: Rusty at 08:03 AM | Comments (10) | Add Comment
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1 Hillary still scares the crap out of me and there's only one person in that group who has what it takes to beat her.

Posted by: dick at January 23, 2006 09:00 AM (XlQVK)

2 I predict you're likely to get your wish. I've been saying for over a year now that the choices will be Hillary and McCain. I will vote for McCain in that instance, but I will hold my nose somewhat while doing it.

Posted by: Oyster at January 23, 2006 10:19 AM (osKlJ)

3 My pick (Ken Blackwell, Ohio) isn't even on Hawkins radar, which is a shame. Unlike McCain, he's a solid small government social conservative that draws both strongly on both sides of the aisle , and he's currently leading in the polls for the gubernatorial race in Ohio. I'd love to see him run in '08 will Condi as his running mate. I think he's clean house, and I go out on a limb far enough to say that a Blackwell/Rice ticket would destroy any Democratic challenger by margin of 6%-8% or more.

Posted by: Confederate Yankee at January 23, 2006 11:48 AM (g5Nba)

4 I've been linking McCain for a while now but he is schmoozing a bit much with Dems lately. Still I like him but I was a bit dissapointed he did not go after DICK on FNS yesterday. It would have been better if Wallace would have had a head to head format alough DICK was being all nice yesterday. Don't Worry DICK I go by our vote and your push against a qualified judge for political reasons pre empted any progress you hoped to make with me.

Posted by: Howie at January 23, 2006 11:54 AM (D3+20)

5 If Stockholm John gets the GOP nomination, I will officially disavow any connection with the party, because he is just a slimy piece of shit traitor who cannot be trusted.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 23, 2006 03:25 PM (0yYS2)

6 I, too, would vote for McCain for his stance on the war and defense in general. He will definitely need to polish himself up a bit. He comes across as a bit of a hothead, IMO. I also believe he was a bit too chummy with Kerry and may have cost Bush a few votes in states that were close and so he'll have to prove himself worthy of a lot of people's vote. If McCain gets the nomination, he'll have more scrutiny of his war record by the MSM than they bothered to look into of Kerry's. You can bet that they'll dig up somebody with an axe to grind and you can bet they'll make sure he has an old manual typewriter. Of course, he will also have to move more towards the right on issues that have gotten Reagan, Bush, and Bush elected. None of them necessarily agree/agreed with everything in the party platform, but they had to come out in favor of most of those things in order to get the votes of the base. The problem with Hillary or whoever they trot out there is that the most vocal part of their base has moved so far to the left, that they'll have a very hard time winning any state in the south or in the middle part of the country. I think she only has a small handful of definites outside of New York and California. That won't cut it. The same diehard liberals that voted for Kerry, will still go vote for her but you'll see a lot of people getting up out of their death beds to vote against her. That just goes to show you that even though many liberals that don't usually vote went out not to vote for Kerry but to vote against Bush, he still won. Even though he's more to the left of most Republicans, I think if Giuliani were to run against Hillary, he could win it all. He would be strong on defense and go after terrorists maybe even harder than Bush, and he's got a favorable opinion by most of the country because of his actions after 9/11. He might have a harder time with the base but not so much if Hillary is the opponent. I'm putting my money on some combination of McCain/Giuliani/Rice. Would really like to see Rice on the ticket. Because they falsely believe that all the women will vote for Hillary, Rice is only one they're scared of because of her a) cutting into the women vote, b) cutting into the black vote, and c)superior intellect and likeability. Regardless, I think liberals are delusional about a landslide win for Hillary.

Posted by: slug at January 23, 2006 04:22 PM (wcNc2)

7 This is a media game for a slow newsday. At least another year to go for real interest - and 2 years for serious talk. Do note - this media game keeps Hillary's name out there. That is the purpose of stupid polls at this time - to run advance for her.

Posted by: hondo at January 23, 2006 04:44 PM (3aakz)

8 My brother is one of those die-hard libs. For one intance, his idea of being a lib is being FOR higher taxes because he just cheats on them anyway and honest people will pick up the slack. He lived in NYC for 20 years and hates Guiliani with a passion. I asked why because Guiliani really did a lot to clean up crime in NY and his response was, "Well yeah, you're right. I just hate him anyway." Huh? You see, libs don't NEED a valid reason to hate someone. All they have to do is be Republican.

Posted by: Oyster at January 24, 2006 05:43 AM (YudAC)

9 Oyster, my mom was the same way. She was born during FDR, first voted for Kennedy, and drank the Kool-Aid with great gusto.

Posted by: Improbulus Maximus at January 24, 2006 11:25 AM (0yYS2)

10 McCain also wants to doubel our troop presence in Iraq the idea being that once and area is cleared it needs to be secured and held. Now bush would have Iraq do that. McCain may be even more pro war than Bush as far as the number of boots he is willing to put on the ground.

Posted by: Howie at January 24, 2006 04:22 PM (D3+20)

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