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November 17, 2004

Jawapalooza in Los Angeles & Call for Help

Dr. Rusty Shackleford will be making his annual migration to his place of birth this Christmas. Any bloggers and/or readers in the LA area who would like to get together for some jawa food between Christmas and New Years should drop me an e-mail. Paparazzi need not apply.

Also, Mrs. Shackleford is dragging me off to a cruise shortly before Christmas. I hate cruises. To me, a cruise is like being held hostage at a Vegas casino. Any readers and/or bloggers interested in guest blogging should drop me a line. No talent necessary.

Posted by: Rusty at 02:47 PM | Comments (13) | Add Comment
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1 Rusty, look on the bright side of life in regards to the cruise - Abu Abbas has already been apprehended.

Posted by: Editor at November 17, 2004 03:10 PM (adpJH)

2 Unless you're too far away for my poor little car, I'm in.'

Posted by: ccwbass at November 17, 2004 05:27 PM (CONoB)

3 I'd be happy to guest blog.

Posted by: The Maximum Leader at November 17, 2004 06:17 PM (zHoql)

4 The Maximum leader stole his whole "Minister" thing from us, but aside from that, he'd be a good choice. We like him anyway. But if you want the original article, I'm unemployed and could probably support a doubled up blogging habit. This message from the Ministry of Minor Perfidy Thank you for your cooperation

Posted by: buckethead at November 17, 2004 08:26 PM (2c+XF)

5 You did specifically say no talent required. And I have very little talent, so I qualify. And I very nearly blogrolled you! I think I need a nap.

Posted by: buckethead at November 17, 2004 08:48 PM (2c+XF)

6 Is that THE Buckethead? OMG!

Posted by: Editor at November 17, 2004 09:20 PM (uurD1)

7 btw, buckethead, this is where you're supposed to come in with your best Mel Brooks impersonation and say: "You hoid of me?"

Posted by: Editor at November 17, 2004 09:21 PM (uurD1)

8 Although unknown, I do fit the "no talent necessary" qualification. I humbly submit myself as a potential guest blogger. To my credit, my site ranks fairly well on Google searches for the phrase "Islamist bastard."

Posted by: Gunner at November 17, 2004 11:40 PM (F5Vin)

9 I agree, I hate cruises as well.

But I love the beach, my bikini and a great margarita in hand! (Hopefully on my honeymoon!) To all of you writing me, wishing my soldier good thoughts and prayers, thank you very much. I'm sending Donald emails daily, cards and packages and your emails so he can share with his platoon. I've not heard from him in a couple days, I continue to go nuts, but family, friends and fellow bloggers help me through. Your all very kind! My last email from Donald said: Your my girl and I'm fighting this mess so we can have our future, I love you, keep the coffee hot! I know its silly, but its meaningful - the coffee part I mean. Anyway, this probably was not the place to write this, but I had to let you all know what your thoughfulness means. Thanks ! Sue

Posted by: Susan at November 18, 2004 07:58 AM (3pOYP)

10 Thanks for all the offers to guest blog, I'll be in touch with you guys in the next few days I think (depending on time constraints).

Posted by: Rusty Shackleford at November 18, 2004 08:14 AM (JQjhA)

11 I'd like that opportunity. Cindy

Posted by: firstbrokenangel at November 18, 2004 02:18 PM (D39Vm)

12 UGH!!! Forget the bloggin jes take me with you.. I have been thinkin about it. Me burn.. oops I mean cook turkey and all the trimmins or have all of it served to me by a waiter in a thong!!!! OMG whata thought.... hahaha Andrea

Posted by: Andrea at November 18, 2004 02:53 PM (+7VNs)

13 [belatedly] You hoid of me? If your thinking of the buckethead the weird musician guy, that's a different, other Buckethead. Although I get tons of fan mail and google searches on Perfidy thanks to the coincidence.

Posted by: buckethead at November 20, 2004 01:09 AM (2c+XF)

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Religion of Peace Roundup

Little time, mucho headlines.

Dutch intelligence officer arrested, suspected links to Van Gogh murder.
High explosives found on Bangladeshi train linked to jihadis.
Pics of that Sarin nerve gas found in Iraq that we reported here.
Hassan's husband begs terrorists for her body.
more...

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Zarqawi Claims Control Over Sunni Triangle

Evan Kohlman's Global Terror Alert brings the news that Abu Musab al-Zarqawi's al Qaeda in Iraq (formerly Tawhid and Jihad) claims it controls the Sunni triangle. Yes folks, there are no Marines in Fallujah! You are not seeing what you think you are seeing. According to Evan Kohlnman's translation of the Zarqawi communique found here: The US only controls parts of Fallujah and Baqubah; Ramadi and Mosul are completely under the control of jihadi forces; the jihadis continue to thwart Coalition efforts in the rest of the Sunni triangle, including Baghdad.

To what extent the terrorists control the streets is unknown to me. Certainly yesterdays PR nightmare will not help.

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List of Hostages Killed in Iraq

As many of my long-time readers know, I had been keeping what I think was the most accurate accounting of hostages murdered in the name of Islam. The reason I stopped updating that list was because the terrorist scumbags began to murder en masse and I just couldn't keep up. Further, I wanted the names of each hostage to be included in that list. As groups such as Ansar al-Sunnah began to kill dozens of hostages at a time this became impossible.

Below you will find a list of foreign hostages killed in Iraq from AFP as reported in Turkish Press. I do not believe the list is complete, but it is a start. Let us never forget the victims of an ideology that justifies the calculated murder of innocents. more...

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November 16, 2004

Meet the next Washingtonienne (Ellen Simonetti) and the next Wonkette (Ace of Spades HQ)

***Ace of Spades Exclusive***Must Cite Ace of Spades HQ***

Ace of Spades HQ can reveal that another blogger has posted sexy pics of herself on the internet, and then was fired. He has the exclusive story* on the Diary of a Flight Attendant. Just like Jessica Cutler the Washingtonienne, are we now going to see a Playboy pictoral? And enquiring minds want to know if Ace is a natural redhead or if the carpet doesn't match the drapes?

UPDATE: Jeff Quinton informs me that Queen of Sky's server is slammed. I guess that will happen when the NY Times runs a story on you. Luckily, he found the Google cached page here.

*super-insider blogger jokes

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Iran and the Clash of Civilizations

Bill at INDC has an excellent analysis of the threat that is Iran. I agree, Iran declared war on the US 25 years ago. The problem with treating Iran like any other nation-state is that to do so assumes that rational actors are in control. The mad mullahs of Iran are clearly not rational. The people of Iran have tasted the bitter fruits of their Islamist utopianism. Let's only hope the Persian people can take back the reigns of government before the Mullahs take that nation to the brink of nuclera armegeddon.

Posted by: Rusty at 03:51 PM | Comments (10) | Add Comment
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1 The people brought the mullahs by their own hand and can only take them down by their OWN hand ... not some Angola style botched abortion run by over zealous spook's. Its time we kept our noses out of other countries and rebuilt our own: Cripped health care, failing social services, porous borders. Its time we the people put the "not the people" washington inhabiting creatures in line to tow their end of the line and work FOR THE PEOPLE and not OFF THE PEOPLE!

Posted by: Salamander at November 16, 2004 05:19 PM (F26eZ)

2 Oh please. That's a load of bull. The US declared war on the Iranian people well before any of this when they blatantly supported a murderous and corrupt Shaw. It's so typical of American bullshit to assume that you're just the innocent little victim. The above comments are right, keep your nose out of other people's business, and your stupidity won't get you into trouble.

Posted by: d at November 17, 2004 02:07 PM (pbI+T)

3 Better a murderous Shah who was forward looking, secular, and a lot less murderous than all the other regimes in the region than the jihadi theocracy that murders by the thousands and exports it's irrational zealotry and support of terrorism around the world.

Posted by: Rusty at November 17, 2004 02:37 PM (JQjhA)

4 "a murderous Shah who was forward looking, secular, and a lot less muderous..." ...wait, are you talking about the Shah or Saddam? Sounds eerily familiar. You're arguing after the fact. The person the Americans actually fucked over for the Shah (because he was giving them easy access to Iranian oil) was supported by the Iranian people and was in fact not murderous, secular, and very forward looking. You think they took over the American embassy for fun? What lead them down the road to islamic fundamentalism, what started it? Your nose in their business fucking it up. Same for Saddam. Who funded saddam in the 80's to fight Iran, and thus creating their own worst nightmare? The idiot americans. Who funded the mujahadeen and gave directly to osama to fight the russians in afghanistan and again created their worst nightmare. stupid americans. Again, typical american stupidity.

Posted by: d at November 17, 2004 02:52 PM (pbI+T)

5 Thats was good ... I mean very bad! Somewhere I did here it said the truth hurts.

Posted by: Salamander at November 17, 2004 03:27 PM (D4mP3)

6 Anyone who believes Iran is better off being run by Fanatical religious zealots than by the Shaw is sick. Little dog syndrone?

Posted by: greyrooster at November 18, 2004 08:13 AM (ZqKhy)

7 Crippled health care my ass. Just democratic retoric. I don't know about where you live but where I live no one is turned down for medical care. Even if they could afford it but decided to spend their money on beer. Failing social services my ass. More democratic retoric. Half community I live in is on the dole in one way or another. It is so rampant that teen aged unwed girls are having babies just to get on welfare. You're not totally wrong. Neither are you totally right. Have a solution for this? I'm going to tell you about Gilbert and Marilyn who live about a 1 1/2 miles from me. Gibert and Marilyn are not married. They have 4 children ages 18 to 30. 3 boys, 1 girl. Gilbert is a diesel mechanic and owns his own mobile truck. He claims to make in access of $1000.00 per week. He usually leaves for work about 9:00 AM and returns between 3 and 4 PM. 5 days only. Rainy days he doesn't work at all. I know this because he drives past my farm on his way. Gilbert's daughter lives in a Getto somewhere in New Orleans. Gilbert brags that he hasn't filed an income tax form, state or federal in years. He teach's his boys that all cops, judges etc: are crooks. All 3 of his boys are now in prison. Cost to taxpayer $30,000 ea. per year. They will no doubt spend the majority of their lives in prison. His daughter has 4 kids she lives on welfare. All his chilren were born at Charity hospital and payed for by the tax payers. Gilbert doesn't pay for his own insurance. Gilbert hurt his leg last year. Since he doesn't have insurance guess who payed. He drinks a case of beer every evening. Double on weekends. Gilbert has a new boat and motor. 4 cars, a dump truck, 2- 4 wheelers, a back hoe and house boat. All surrounded by beer cans I might add. I figure this one individual costs the tax payers $200,000 per year, every year. And I'm not even counting the cost of trials and insurance claims his boys cost. SALAMANDER: I'm not going to worry about social services and health care until the system gets rid of the Gilbert's. We are too loose on who gets into it. This is liberal democratic policy. Health care and social services should be for those truly in need. Figure a system that will eleminate the frauds and I will get on your bandwagon. Ever been in line at a supermarket and seen a person separate their beer, wine and cigarettes from their rib-eye steaks? I have. They must pay for the cigarettes, beer and wine in cash. The rib-eyes they use their food stamps. Many successful people may be uncaring and greedy. However, so are the so-called poor. This social services, health care bandwagon you're on just don't fit without getting rid of the cheats. The threat from middle east fanatical religious terrorists is real and we must deal with it. The treat from health care/social services frauds are real and we must deal with it. The question is which one should be taken care of 1st? Until the liberal democratic welfare types admit to the need to rid the system of welfare/health care/social services fraud. I'll say take care of the terrorists 1st.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 18, 2004 09:16 AM (ZqKhy)

8 Good God greyrooster. Next time please run your stuff through a spellcheck! Shaw = SHAH. make in access = make in EXCESS! d: If we funded Saddam...then where the fuck they get their goddamned weaponry? Do we make T-54s, and Mirage jets? and AK-47s? HELL NO! Wake your fucking ass up and study your fucking HISTORY! Saddam's arms came from the CCCP and FRANCE! Small wonder why Saddam returned the favor in UNSCAM? Rusty: Please excuse my French! These little upstart bastards piss me off!

Posted by: Macker at November 21, 2004 12:28 AM (pwS0P)

9 "You're arguing after the fact. The person the Americans actually fucked over for the Shah (because he was giving them easy access to Iranian oil) was supported by the Iranian people and was in fact not murderous, secular, and very forward looking. You think they took over the American embassy for fun? What lead them down the road to islamic fundamentalism, what started it? Your nose in their business fucking it up. Same for Saddam. Who funded saddam in the 80's to fight Iran, and thus creating their own worst nightmare? The idiot americans. Who funded the mujahadeen and gave directly to osama to fight the russians in afghanistan and again created their worst nightmare. stupid americans. Again, typical american stupidity." --> American stupidity....Yawwnnn. It's always America's fault -- what an old, tired and trite remark. Your logic -- if you want to call it that -- it so full of tautology that you needn't bother to shoot off your mouth further. The US served it needs at the time -- simply because we were involved in the Cold War against the Russians. Recall, Einstein, that the US also allied itself with Stalin during WW II...Stalin is arguably the most ruthless man (along with Hitler) to ever rule -- killing millions and curbing the civil rights and liberties of hundreds of millions more. But, when it was prudent, the US and Soviet troops fought on the same side. Guess you'd blame FDR for the rise of Soviet Communism/Iron Curtain, etc... What served in the US interest in the 70s and 80s doesn't entitle Muslims to do whatever it is they like, nor does it curb the US authority to crush Islam wherever it makes noise. Islam is no better than Nazism or communism -- both of which the US had a major role in containing and eradicating. Regarding Iran, the Shah and his relations with the US doesn't excuse taking an embassy on behalf of a country (by a bunch of lunatic students) -- tantamount to invading a country. If Jimmy Carter had had one shred of sense, Iran would have been decimated -- for the better of the world. Meanwhile, I expect that to eventually happen. Iran cannot and should not be trusted. If Iran has the right to develop nukes, the US has a right to eradicate that God-foresaken land. We needn't loose one man -- just give'em a dose of nuclear medicine -- a technology they so badly desire.

Posted by: Melissa Arsana at December 02, 2004 11:29 PM (KfgQE)

10 http://bestpoet.com

Posted by: bestpoet at September 28, 2005 04:31 PM (Yq3yA)

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Zarqawi Website Shut Down For Good!!

Several websites linked to Abu Musab al-Zarqawi have been shut down by the Texas based company that hosted them. Hosting Anime has shut down all terrorist related sites on their servers. Apparently the new owners are less tolerant of pro-al Qaeda sites that justify the beheadings of hostages. I have one word for them: itsaboutfreakingtimeyouamoralterroristsupportingscumbags!!

Correction-Hosting Anime is not a Texas based company. The physical servers they leased belonged to EV1, a Texas based company. Thanks to Chad who brought this to my attention.

The website had been previously hacked on several occasions by a group calling itself Teamz USA. The story was first reported here (and then ripped off by MSNBC) and a second hacking was reported by Chad Evans (also ripped by MSM). Might I just add that a certain Star Wars themed website gave out the URL for Zarqawi to well over a hundred people promising to take down the site again....Perhaps the new owners just got sick of all the hackers?

Below is an image I captured from one of Zarqawi's websites. The same message can be found at other terrorist websites previously hosted by Hosting Anime. Click to enlarge.

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Margaret Hassan Murdered on Video (UPDATED)

The terrorists have murdered Margaret Hassan, a woman who spent the majority of her life trying to help innocent Iraqis. Although I believe the organization she worked for was politically misguided, no one can question Margaret Hassan's motives. Rest In Peace. I will post images from the video when available. Why? You think you are outraged at the terrorists now, wait until you see the utter depravity of their actions. Watch one of these videos or see images from them and then try to equivocate between us and them. Developing....

Reuturs:

The British embassy in Baghdad confirmed on Tuesday that a video tape had surfaced appearing to show the killing of kidnapped British-Iraqi aid worker Margaret Hassan, and said it was probably genuine.
"We can confirm there is a tape that appears to show Margaret's murder," an embassy official told Reuters. "We believe it is probably genuine."

UPDATE: The terrorists have taken to dressing their victims in the garb of Abu Ghraib prisoners. While Mrs. Hassan was probably murdered some days ago, I no longer think the appearence of the video and the announcement of another Abu Ghraib like scandal coming on the same day is a coincidence. The terrorists wish to convince the Muslim world that what they are doing is an eye for an eye. The repurcussions from Kevin Sikes' video showing an American Marine killing an unarmed man have already begun. Fox News:

The video shows a militant firing a pistol into the head of a blindfolded woman wearing an orange jumpsuit

UPDATE II: Lady Bird drops a comment letting us know that Margaret Hassan was her teacher. She has an amazing post of her own. It's a fitting tribute to Mrs. Hassan.

UPDATE III: You may donate to CARE International in Margaret Hassan's name here.

I should have knocked on wood after that earlier post. Thanks to Chad, Straight Banana, and others who notified me. more...

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1 If reports comming out of Iraq are correct that Margaret Hassan was shot in the head on video and then as a final insult to her memory mutilated and quartered, it takes these ragheads acts of depravity to new heights. It is indeed a sad day when one so dedicated to the care of the suffering is met with such an appalling end.

Posted by: sopotamia at November 16, 2004 12:41 PM (KdJpi)

2 Dear Jesus, you don't think the video's going to show all that? What was the reasoning for not showing the other one, deemed too graphic because they had to throw water on her because she fainted? Does not make any sense. RIP Margaret, I hope your death is not in vain. What a horrible ending to someone who was so dedicated to the Iraqi people. How senseless.

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 12:43 PM (ptOpl)

3 Poor, poor Margaret, you were such a good woman, Iraq is now a much a much sadder place without your love and many years of support. May your killers die slowly, in screaming agony, videoed for all the world to repeatedly gloat over.

Posted by: Dotty at November 16, 2004 01:28 PM (siFAl)

4 The brave Marine that sent the Islamofascist cocksucker to his well deserved death in a mosque in Fallujah gets us on our way to being close to even for this newest act by the incarnations of Satan here on Earth. I mean really, is there any doubt that these animals need to be put out of our misery? I am not a fundamentalist religious nut, but America needs to wake up, especially the "Blue State" Americans that think it is ok to show US Marines in combat on TV (cause we are bad), but not this video (cause it's too graphic). The people that think that we are dealing with people that can be talked to or hugged into submission are living on another planet. We need to start killing more of these animals. That brave Marine was doing what he needed to do; putting down one of these animals. Glad I am in the military. Glad to be one of the ones getting the opportunity to kill these animals. God Bless you Margaret. May you rest in peace. We will be visiting a vile, painful, well deserved death upon your killers very soon.

Posted by: David at November 16, 2004 01:29 PM (xfI1/)

5 Sapotamia, If the reports are correct, the body found in Fallujah that was mutilated was not Hassan. The body found in Fallujah had her throat cut. Hassan was shot in the back of her head. Of course both of these are bad, but I fear there may be yet another video coming out soon with the death of the Polish woman.

Posted by: Chad Evans at November 16, 2004 01:40 PM (O8//2)

6 Behaviour breeds behaviour. Don't you American burgermunchin' lard-asses realise that blatant force will be met with whatever low-life tactics the islamic fundamentalists can think of in their sick warped minds? Do you really expect these people to accept the bombing of their mosques, children & cities...my guess is they feel just the same as you all felt after 9/11! if American foreign policy wasnt so blatantly pro-israeli, and was more balanced, none of this shit would be going on. Blair hinted this week in a speech that he is trying to make Bush realise that force is not always the best option. Blair is standing "shoulder to shoulder" with Bush as he has the weight of the historical ties between the UK & US to consider: it would "look bad" if we (the UK) didnt do what we have done throughout recent history. The reality is that the majority of people in the UK do not support the action in Iraq, a lot of people in the world don't agree with America's unilateral approach to the war on terror: America may well be the world's most powerful nation, but the way in which it forces its influence throughout the world (frequently against the judgement & will of people more closely involved) is not always appeciated, and sometimes resented, hence we have people being beheaded in iraq. If the islamic fundamentalists had a comparably trained and equipped army, i'm sure we would see a war in iraq being fought along more conventional lines, as it is, the militants are adopting horrific shock tactics, as they feel they have no other options. I really hope Bush listens to Blair on the Israel/Palestine issue - it's the key - and this whole sorry mess will only be eventually sorted out via diplomacy, not rockets & guns. RIP Margaret.

Posted by: Brad loveburger III at November 16, 2004 02:08 PM (SgQqe)

7 Possibly Chad, or it might have been an Iraqi woman who had dyed her hair. If you look at what the terrorists were doing in Fallujah they were trying to institute a Taliban like regime. A regime that would kill you if you appeared too Western. Either way, very sad.

Posted by: Rusty at November 16, 2004 02:08 PM (JQjhA)

8 David...I have just read your comment, you are totally out of order with your views on these people being animals. Please give animals some respect. You cannot compare this filth with animals.

Posted by: Rodders at November 16, 2004 02:25 PM (L2A8m)

9 Rodders: I apologize to animals. I just apologized to my 2 dogs. They took it the way I thought that they would. Fuck Osama and all that align with them.

Posted by: David at November 16, 2004 02:36 PM (xfI1/)

10 She was my teacher

Posted by: LadyBird at November 16, 2004 02:46 PM (5kitr)

11 Chad my reasoning is with yours. First of all, I don't think the mutilated body they found was Hassan's either. Where I disagree, is that the body found had blonde hair. It could have also been possible that had it not, they still could've shot her then quartered the body and dumped it in the street. Horrible, either way. Now, I see that a video released has her dressed in the typical orange jumpsuit, blindfolded, with a gun to her head. Hopefully, if the video is shown here, that is all we will see. RIP, Margaret, your death will be avenged. Talk on the radio is about the Marine, who killed the unarmed man. Hopefully, this will all be over with in a few days. Why are they so quick to play up the actions of a US soldier and not the actions of these fucking bugs (I will not call them animals either).

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 02:47 PM (ptOpl)

12 Brad Loveburger III: Why don't you see if you can't talk to Osama or Zarquawi and get them to stop acting unilaterally by killing 3,000 Americans in New York or beheading innocent people who are trying to help them. Maybe we can get them to come to a summit so we can discuss our issues and work them out. Maybe the UK understand that these Islamofascist cocksuckers want us, not just me, but you, everyone you know (whether you hate them or not) you dog, everyone that owes you money DEAD!!!! They don't care and the fact that you are fail to grasp the nature of the threat truly frightens me. We don't have to get permission to act in our own self defense. Have you ever been in a fight? When the person you faced off against made their move and hit you, did you ask a friend what to do? Did you have a meeting with some friends and relatives to make up a plan of action? If your friends didn't want to come along, did you continue to let your adversary beat on you because you didn't want to make your friends not like you? President Bush acted. He decided he didn't want to debate the fate or our country in a committee.

Posted by: David at November 16, 2004 02:56 PM (xfI1/)

13 That's right, Brad. It's Bush's fault, it's Blair's fault. Why? For wanting to defend a country that was horribly attacked on 9/11, and before that? How long must we sit back and think about it before acting on it? And don't tell me that there was NO connection bet. 9/1 and Iraq. Zarqawi trained under Al Qaeda. If it wasn't beheadings in Iraq, it would've been something else. Zarqawi has admitted allegiance to Osam and Al Qaeda. Maybe Bush's initial reasons for going into Iraq may not have been clear, but it was justified, none the less. Burger eating, my ass! Fuck off and stay out of it, your terrorist loving piece of foreign shit.

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 03:15 PM (ptOpl)

14 And then when a wounded Marine kill a man who is either one of them or is fully suportive of them we are up in arms?!

Posted by: Rod Stanton at November 16, 2004 03:27 PM (a2hGw)

15 My heart goes out to Margaret Hassans family and all that knew her. My deepest sympathy to all. To "Brad loveBOOGER III in the UK: Curse you trying to lay the blame on all "American burgermunchin lard-asses" for the beheadings in the Arab nations. Your QUOTE: "hence we have people being beheaded in iraq." The idiot ZarCOWARDwi, and others, are not from Iraq-FROM-Lebanon, Saudi and other places.THEY ARE INVADERS.... If you want to get down to it, your ancestry is right here with us "lard-asses". Some of that shame-shit runs thru my viens. It's a damn good thing that I am of a "hienz57" breed.

Posted by: owoju at November 16, 2004 03:30 PM (N4SKL)

16 I want to express my deepest sympathies to the family of Margaret Hassan. From what IÂ’ve heard on T.V. and read about in the papers, she seemed like a good woman who had devoted her life to helping the poor in Iraq. She definitely did not deserve to die the way she did. May she sleep in eternal peace forever. On the other hand, I wish nothing less then eternal damnation on those who destroyed this woman. May they and all those fighting to promote their atrocious views, die a horrible, painful, disgusting, bloody death at the hands of our Â“infidelÂ” Marines, soldiers, airmen and naval personnel. May God spit on your souls as he casts you to hell and may your wives, mothers, fathers, children, brothers and sisters rot in festering piles of their own filth gnashing their teeth and weeping for your souls until they too burn in hell with you.

Posted by: John at November 16, 2004 03:30 PM (AEjRy)

17 I want to express my deepest sympathies to the family of Margaret Hassan. From what IÂ’ve heard on T.V. and read about in the papers, she seemed like a good woman who had devoted her life to helping the poor in Iraq. She definitely did not deserve to die the way she did. May she sleep in eternal peace forever. On the other hand, I wish nothing less then eternal damnation on those who destroyed this woman. May they and all those fighting to promote their atrocious views, die a horrible, painful, disgusting, bloody death at the hands of our Â“infidelÂ” Marines, soldiers, airmen and naval personnel. May God spit on your souls as he casts you to hell and may your wives, mothers, fathers, children, brothers and sisters rot in festering piles of their own filth gnashing their teeth and weeping for your souls until they too burn in hell with you.

Posted by: John at November 16, 2004 03:31 PM (AEjRy)

18 David, I understand your points, but even you must realise that Bush got his pound of flesh by invading Afghanistan & overthrowing the Taliban on the basis of their links with Al-Queda...was that enough? NO! Bush's (& Blair's) governments then go on to wage war with Iraq on the premise that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction ready to fire "within 45 minutes" (!!!) - they also maintained that links with Al-Queda were established. To date this has not been proved. What next ? IRAN? NORTH KOREA? WORLD WAR 3? Technically, Blair & Bush are war criminals. If the US had been invaded by a superior power on the basis that the superior power didnt like what the US was doing, and in the process killed a lot of innocent US civilians, dont you think that in a fair world the leaders of the misguided superior nation should be held accountable? It's probably a question you wouldnt be able to answer truthfully unless it was YOUR mother, YOUR wife or YOUR children dying in vain by a misguided enemy's weapons of blind fury. The same so-called US intelligence didnt see 9/11 coming.... But it's ok....I know what the US & UK should do! ...every time the intelligence agencies make a mistake and thousands of innocent civilians have been killed in the crossfire, our governments will just say sorry and everything will be ok then, won't it? What would YOU say to an innocent iraqi civilian who's just had his wife killed through no fault of his own except the unfortunate fact that they lived in the path of a machine gun bullet? "sorry, but we did it in the name of freedom????" Bullshit! the intelligence was way off the mark - you know it & the rest of the world knows it, which is why the international community (in the VAST majority) does not condone the very dangerous road Bush is going down...I will maintain that Bush's strong arm tactics will not dampen down arab fundamentalism...they will only fan the flames of hatred. A more balanced US foreign policy view on the Israeli/palestinian question might just do more to calm the whole situation down in my opinion.

Posted by: brad loveburger III at November 16, 2004 03:52 PM (SgQqe)

19 The Marines and soldiers I see in the videos and on the news don't look like burger muching lard asses to me.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 16, 2004 03:59 PM (UkXdy)

20 A Jordanian is not an Iraqi citizen....

Posted by: owoju at November 16, 2004 04:19 PM (N4SKL)

21 Brad C'Mon man. Really, I am a soldier who has had to do this for a living, and I have some of my soldiers overseas right now. I can without a doubt guarantee you that we are NOT killing civilians, period. These murdering cocksuckers that the MSM are calling "freedom fighters" are. When they hide in mosques and shoot at us, what should we do? Ignore them, let them kill us until they run out of bullets and then surrender? When they shield themselves behind women and children, what should we do Brad? Give me the benefit of your insight. You are saying that now that we kicked the ass of the Taliban that we should have said "well, we wil just trust that Saddam won't give weapons that he may or may not have to people who want to kill us." This isn't about one man, one country, or one group. It is about the fact that Wahabbism is seeking the destruction of anyone that does not convert or is from the West. Saddam's minions and Zarquawi's pals needed killing, and if the people could have rose up themselves then they would have. Would you like to have Saddam killing his own people again? Some Children's prisons? How about secret police making midnight visits? Hindsight is 20/20 Brad. IRAN, NORTH KOREA, WORLD WAR 3? If you haven't noticed, these filthy bastards killed 3,000 people in a BLUE STATE!!!! Do you believe that people that do this need killed? I say we go to North Korea and kill those true believing freedom hating communists so that the people of North Korea can have FOOD!!!! If not that, how about we just ignore Iran and let them give a nuke to and Arab terrorist so they can come to a town near you and light that sucker off near your friends and family. Bad intel? Hell yes that happens. The Psychic Friends network isn't in the same building as the CIA or MI5. The "slam dunk" on WMD assessment came from George Tenet, the director appointed by Clinton. Seems he may have believed some of the reports that he got from EVERY MAJOR INTELLIGENCE SERVICE in the Western World. The reason that the rest of the world (ie France and Germany) didn't want to come along was that they were not or friend and were stabbing us in the back. The "balance" that the Arabs are seeking on Middle East peace is the destruction of Israel and the genocide of the jews. Is that the balance you seek? We can't put ourselves in their shoes because we have lived in freedom for over 200 years and we don't allow tyrants to rule here. We threw out the tyrants about 200 years ago.

Posted by: David at November 16, 2004 04:48 PM (xfI1/)

22 In spite of the reports that fallujah is for the most part secured the email I got within the last hour suggests the town is still pretty damned hellish.Ragheads are still popping up out of knowwhere.What they havent quite sussed out yet is that shouting Allah U Achbar gets you an immediate bullet between your eyes no questions asked.For some unknown reason these ragheads just keep repeating this behavior, they seem too dumb to understand the sooner they shout those words the soonern they'l undrstand that right now theres only one messenger of god and hes wearing a U.S. Marine Corps badge. Go marines,your time is nigh!!!

Posted by: wekno at November 16, 2004 05:07 PM (I7lx1)

23 Blame Bush for the invasion of Iraq, yet lib's blame him for 9/11 too, because he failed to listen to warnings. And what if he did listen and invaded Afghanistan in the hopes of finding Osama, without the twin towers being attacked? Then what? Then the lib's would've said we illegally invaded THAT country! The blame never fucking ends! I can't stand it!

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 05:07 PM (ptOpl)

24 Blame Bush for the invasion of Iraq, yet lib's blame him for 9/11 too, because he failed to listen to warnings. And what if he did listen and invaded Afghanistan in the hopes of finding Osama, without the twin towers being attacked? Then what? Then the lib's would've said we illegally invaded THAT country! The blame never fucking ends! I can't stand it!

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 05:07 PM (ptOpl)

25 Sorry website was slow, I posted that twice. I heard the video can be seen at www.silentscream.org or .com, not sure which one.

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 05:10 PM (ptOpl)

26 In spite of the reports that fallujah is for the most part secured the email I got within the last hour suggests the town is still pretty damned hellish.Ragheads are still popping up out of nowhere.What they havent quite sussed out yet is that shouting Allah U Achbar gets you an immediate bullet between your eyes no questions asked.For some unknown reason these ragheads just keep repeating this behavior, they seem too dumb to understand the sooner they shout those words the soonern they'l get to the understanding that right now theres only one messenger of god and hes wearing a U.S. Marine Corps badge. Go marines, get some,your time is nigh!!!

Posted by: wekno at November 16, 2004 05:11 PM (I7lx1)

27 REPORT THAT YOU WILL NOT GET FROM CNN Special forces are tracking these sons of bitches not just on the roads out of Fallujah but in the dirt planes between.Mossads intelligence is proving invaluable,remember lots of Iraqi Jewry were thrown out of Iraq, though you wont here that on CNN,it would not be politicaly correct nor appreciated,political correcters dont tend to like dynamite, nor does King Saud,tends to give them swetty palms and sleepless nights,we wouldnt want that now would we.

Posted by: wekno at November 16, 2004 05:31 PM (I7lx1)

28 Quote Burger Brad [[ >> What next? IRAN? NORTH KOREA? WORLD WAR 3?<< ]] You base your above preamble on what exactly? ...Exactly my friend, because they are dangerwiss. Anyway, next it should be the Faroe Islands, Papa New Guniea and Manchester. These places are a threat to the world because they play shit football (soccer)... You patronise yourself and should stand by your convictions by moving to Iran or N.Korea. They do great Taekwondo lessons there. Ask for master Rhee, tell him QPR Jon sent you. Peace.

Posted by: qpr Jon at November 16, 2004 05:47 PM (0LopU)

29 Perhaps the palestinians should throw out their tyrants too.

Posted by: skippy at November 16, 2004 05:56 PM (ye2RC)

30 David, Firstly, I would like to say that I wish you and your men well in the perilious ongoing situation in Iraq. Taking your points, firstly, I have no doubt that despite some aspects of the media trying to persuade us to think otherwise, I have no doubt that the current US/UK force in Iraq are not killing Iraqi civilians deliberately. But it remains a fact that thousands of Iraqis (more than the fatalities of 9/11) have died needlessly. Through absolutely no fault of their own. I understand your point about the "underhand" tactics that the insurgents are using, i.e. hiding in mosques, but they are outnumbered by a vastly superior fighting force, fighting on whilst knowing if they are captured alive it means deportation to Guantanamo Bay for some (ethically questionable) interrogation techniques....so, whilst not condoning their -some would say cowardly- fighting tactics , I can understand them, when faced with such a stark choice. What would I do in your position? Not be in Iraq in the first place. Hans Blix asked for more time, he should have got it & as for hindsight, I can say that hand on heart, that was my opinion 18 months ago, before the shit hit the fan. No war should have been waged without HARD evidence. Don't tell me the justification for the war was to stop Hussein killing his own people....The US would have intervened well before now if that was the case. Like after the liberation of Kuwait in '91. Also, I didn't see the US intervening in Rwanda (in the 90's) & or Zimbabwe (now) on that basis.... Let me make it quite clear here that I'm no Saddam fan, but you cannot go invading countries on the off chance that they "may" have WMD, only to find out after a LOT of innocent deaths that the mandate for war was incorrect. Like I say, on this basis where will it end? , are you gonna invade Iran next?!!! more innocent deaths, more moderate muslims turning into fundamentalists, creating more potential Al-zarquawi's and Bin-ladens !!! Do I seek a middle east solution that involves the eradication of the jewish state ? No, but I believe the Palestinians have the right to a neighbouring homeland. Is that so wrong? Sort that out through DIPLOMACY, not aggression, and you help disinguish the fuel & the hatred that the fundamentalists need to survive.

Posted by: Brad Loveburger III at November 16, 2004 06:13 PM (SgQqe)

31 "These places are a threat to the world because they play shit football (soccer)..." Are you people whacked or what? Margaret Hassan was shot in the head as retaliation for killing a poor unarmed soul by these marines. Put yourself in their shoes.

Posted by: skippy at November 16, 2004 06:24 PM (ye2RC)

32 BRAD LOVEBURGER 111 IS A FAKE. Can't believe some people falling for it again.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 16, 2004 06:32 PM (UkXdy)

33 Brad Burger...here we go again! he's not even a burger...where's the beef? Fuck all you people who are against the "illegal invasion" of Iraq. NO HARD EVIDENCE. Holy Shit, what is this, the Scot Peterson case?! If the President and Congress had reason to believe that iraq, or any other country for that matter, was a threat to the US, then as Americans, we have to stand by our leader. That's why we VOTED for him. And that's why we VOTED for him AGAIN. Seems most of the anti-war assholes are foreign jobbers, maybe their country's there too, but they just love bashing the American president. Fuck you and stick your thoughts where the sun don't shine. I'm sick of you fakes.

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 06:51 PM (ptOpl)

34 Falling for what? A hyperbolic comment? The US not intervening in Rwanda (in the 90's) & or Zimbabwe (now) It will never happen as there is no oil interests. I think you will find that unless there is a high profile American hostage or crude oil involved- Bush will keep his dick in his pants from now on. His knuckle dragging, chest thumping is quite predictable. Fallujah is a grandstand joke.

Posted by: skippy at November 16, 2004 07:02 PM (ye2RC)

35 I don't know the citizenship of this lady. If I remember she was a Brit married to an Iraqi? She helped feed their hungry. She helped cure their sick. She was against American led invasion of Iraq. She stayed in a danger zone to help the wounded. Her reward was days of horrible fear during captivity. Finally slaughtering and dismembering her. What she had to do with America I don't know. After her death some mental midget says she was killed because a Marine killed an insurgent fighting against his own government. But she was taken hostage long before. Oh sure. They were just fucking with her to have fun. There's a lesson here. It doesn't matter who you are or what religion you are. ISLAMOFACISTS will kill anyone for the sake of killing. This is their chosen occupation. Beats working for a living. If the war stopped now and all troops left Iraq they still would not stop the killing. They would have to find or create another battle field. They do it in the name of religion and people listen to this shit. If a Sunni muslim had a brain he would beg for US occupation when the Shia take over. That is really why they are fighting this battle. To prevent a Shia government that will treat them like they were treated. These people are like rabid dogs. Put them to sleep for the safety of the rest of the world. Instead of crying when a soldier kills one he should get a bonus.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 16, 2004 07:22 PM (UkXdy)

36 Hoohah (A.Pacino)

Posted by: qpr jon at November 16, 2004 07:28 PM (0LopU)

37 Equally ludicrous to blame the "illegal invasion" of Iraq for Hassan's death as well. She was against the invasion, therefore, she should have been depicted as an ally. She helped their people. She lived there for over 30 years. She had absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with any of this. In conclusion, the terrorists are killing for the sake of killing. Don't blame Bush.

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 07:37 PM (ptOpl)

38 After reading this whole thread, I can't but express my agreement with Brad. We non-americans truly are on the other side of the fence. Many of us cannot understand what we perceive as American self-righteousness. I try to, but it's hard, and I believe they find it just as hard to understand us. It's sad, but I think this is where the limits of human communication show most clearly. No amount of evidence of the terrible wrongdoings of US foreign policy in the world will ever convince them, just as no amount of well-doing (which also exists) by the US will convince us. Never mind the fact that we too hate terrorism. Never mind the fact that we also cringe in disgust and sadness when we see people beheaded. This is not enough for them: we also have to accept the US's killing frenzy as some sort of salvation. Sad... I'm really depressed by both pieces of news today. The world is going to hell and we can't trust ANY of our governments to save us.

Posted by: brunilda at November 16, 2004 08:22 PM (v21yJ)

39 brunilda: Geez I wish I could stand in the middle and blame the government. We are the government. Just who started the killing. Killing frenzy? We're not even pissed off yet. You say you hate terrorism. You say you cringe in disgust and sadness at the beheadings. Then do something about it. America is. Terrorists will not stop because of your whineing. They feed on fear. Show your fear, show your mistrust for your government. When you do there are fanatics looking and your post nodding and saying to each other IT'S WORKING!! Problem with democratic way. Brave people 1 vote. Others 1 vote. America: The country that pays the bills. America: The country that does the fighting. Not excluding our wonderful allies. After victory, I only hope America remembers who counts. Those without the courage to stand up. Should shut up.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 16, 2004 10:42 PM (YpcV2)

40 How short our memories are. While seeking diplomatic solutions, the USA has endured the bombing of the Marine barracks in Lebannon, the bombing of the USS Cole, not to mention the embassy hostage situation of the 70's. All these and many more acts against the USA were at the hands of the radical Muslims. This has been going on for nearly 40 years. I don't understand how many attacks we have to withstand before the world understands that we are sick and tired of it. 9/11 was the biggest attack and it was an attack on our homeland. All these attacks were attacks on everything we believe in, which is exactly what they were intended to be. Much like how Hitler hated Jews, Muslims hate Americans. We have learned that but much of the rest of the world hasn't. I guess it's been long enough since Europe was under attack in WWII for you to remember how it feels. We have been enduring this for almost 40 years. We have only thrown a punch now and then during that time and 9/11 showed us things were out of control. When Japan bombed Pearl Harbor, we could have taken your attitude and said, we'll take care of the Japs but Europe and England will have to fight their own fight. We didn't do that. We came to the defense of Europe and put Hitler where he belonged. You can blame whoever you want for all of it, but there is no way any one man could have stopped it. So blaming Bush or Blair or whoever might make you feel better, but it's not more their fault than it is yours or mine. It is time that the rest of the world understand that the USA will not continue to give and give and give freely to all who need it all over the world, and then turn the other cheek every time an Osma Bin Laden or any other religious fanatic throws a bomb at us. Peace is a wonderful thing. It's a shame the religious fanatics that hate us so much don't realize that. We'd be the first to welcome an end to all fighting. But we will no longer turn and walk away from this bully who will not leave us alone. Sadam was a real threat to the US. Anyone who doesn't believe that evidently never saw how badly he hated the USA for kicking his butt out of Kuwait. He even tried to have our president assasinated. Any person with that much hate in them is beyond negotiating or talking. They are evil and there is only one way to deal with them. Just think, you might be next on their list. Conforting thought isn't it???????

Posted by: Mona at November 16, 2004 11:01 PM (5aJBY)

41 Greyrooster and Mona, We don't seem to be talking about the same country. I am from Latin America. Your memories are short of the atrocities commited in that continent in the name of democracy and -yes- free market. The US is not doing anything against "terrorism" in Iraq. It is only defending its interests. Terrorism is also when your country imposes its will on weaker ones. I will never forget Terence Todman in the 90's who was your ambassador in my home country, Argentina. Your government was pushing for us to pass a law that would benefit your pharmaceutical corporations. The House balked - for once. Your ambassador had the nerve to come out on TV and say "if you don't pass this law, we'll take economic measures against you." How do you think that makes people from other countries feel? You certainly are spreading democracy that way, sure. Do I have to mention Chile, where a perfectly democratically elected government was overthrown (9/11/1973) by a CIA-backed and funded coup that left thousands of people missing? Do I have to remind you of the US involvement in Cambodia, for instance? What about the latest US support for "regime change" in Venezuela? Isn't that a democratic government and should be respected as such? Have you even stopped for a second to think why anti-Americanism is so rife? Or have you bought wholesale that bullshit about how other countries envy you? We don't envy Norway, and believe me, there is a lot of freedom and economic viability to be envied there... The truth is, citizens of other countries cannot trust the US to defend them. You have a great democracy... within your frontiers. Yet a lot of the time you spread misery and violence to other parts of the world, and that is WHY people don't like the US. You talk about your government as if it was this beacon of light and liberty... for you Americans. The rest of the world can go to hell. Mona mentions how much the US has endured while diplomatic solutions were sought. How much have our brothers in Latin America endured? How destructive have the US' economic policies been for our countries? Are you not counting that, Mona? Is that not suffering? Greyrooster: >America: The country that pays the bills. >America: The country that does the fighting. Your country never paid the bills for its incursions in Latin American politics. Nor have they paid the bill for the oil they plunder in the Middle East, taking up where the Brits and French left. The "something about it" that you need to do is being part of the solution, not part of the problem as you currently are. Why don't you get a little more informed about the history of US foreign policy? Are you going to tell me that you treat other countries fairly? Give me a break. And I don't whine, it's just that the whole rationale for this war is so twisted. Despite Laura's not wanting to hear this, Iraq - Al Qaida, sorry didn't happen. And people from both parties came to that conclusion, so that doesn't really qualify as an instance of "liberal spin". My strongest fear is that through this, Americans will only become more and more convinced that their way is THE way, never taking a step back to even try to understand the causes for things that happen. My stance against terrorism is first refraining from committing it myself, something that the US should certainly get better at. As for the Middle East, most if not all of the regimes there are tyrannical and corrupt, so I have no sympathy for them. But some of them are friends with the US, so they are detested by their own people, but greeted as "moderate leaders" by the Americans. And the wheel keeps spinning. I think my main point of contention is that you have a roseate view of your country and of your country's motivations, and that certainly does not stand the test of history. I argue with you, and take pains to discuss and understand you and your positions because we are the government (as you Greyrooster so rightly say). We are responsible for being informed. We are responsible for not buying spin (like "everyone thought Iraq had WMD before the war, including the Europeans - yes, except that Colin Powell spoke at the UN on 2/21/2001 to say exactly the opposite and to convince everyone that the sanctions were working - you can see this at http://www.thememoryhole.org/war/powell-no-wmd.htm). We are responsible for understanding, even in the face of such inhumane acts as beheadings. How good an idea do we have of what Al-Qaeda members really want? I suppose not much, given the filtering of information that the government and the media carry out. Or do you think that all governments use propaganda except yours? So for all those reasons, I think scepticism and protest are very much needed. And Americans should also do a mea culpa from time to time. Cheers, guys, great discussion

Posted by: brunilda at November 16, 2004 11:42 PM (v21yJ)

42 Margaret Hussain is dead because of the invation of Iraq. FACT. As are all the other hostages beheaded. In "liberating" a country the coalition forces have blood of innocents on their hands. If anyone thinks Saddam Hussain was going to attack America or had links with Al-queda they are sadly mistaken at best, totally deluded at worst. Laura, I am beginning to think someone else is typing for you because you don't seem to have the intelligence to actually manage it yourself.

Posted by: Matt Bing at November 17, 2004 03:53 AM (ccz95)

43 i just want to see the video of death of margaret hassan

Posted by: dei at November 17, 2004 03:57 AM (5JzcY)

44 MATT BING: What towel head bugged you? And why did you like it so much? Matt Bing, another Sikes.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 05:49 AM (YV75d)

45 Greyrooster, your head is so far up your own ass you can probably see George Bush's dick in your throat. How many times do you have to be told. Margeret Hussan was working perfectly well for a noble cause before this war. Would you like to tell her family that this is all justified? If it was my family I would be having serious words with good ol' G Bush and all his cronies. How is everything so black and white to you - Good V Evil? This isn't some kind of comic where superheroes save mankind. This whole thing is a mess and George Bush has blood on his hands. As for Dei, are you just a sick man or what?

Posted by: Matt Bing at November 17, 2004 06:18 AM (ccz95)

46 Broomhilda: Spin and interpreation is a two way street. I wonder how many Argentines are on the waiting list to come to this horrible place. When you look at the past policies of another country perhaps you should look into the background of your own. As I've said before. Clean up your own act before sticking your nose into the business of others. We have a roseate view of ourselves because we cannot rely on others. We make mistakes. We know it and get on with it. Doer's always make errors. Do nots don't make mistakes. Safer to do nothing and snipe at people/nations that do. Which one are you? Which one is your country? I know, apparently, you don't. What has your country done for the betterment of the world. Nothing. At least we try. Oh excuse me, I forget. You did supply a hiding place for nazis on the run from world justice. As far as America blundering oil. You are a liar. Every nation has people like you. I wonder why they learn the language of those they are so jealous of. Sorry that we backed the Brits when Argentina invaded the Falklands. Sorry you got your asses kicked. But they were right, you were wrong. The falklands had no WMD, no oil, no Ben Laden, no 9/11. At least America has reasons to invade. Argentina obviously doesn't. If your country was a world leader, it would have people like you sniping at it. However, Argentina is not a world leader is it? We are the big dog on the block. You are not. Therefore, you cannot understand the feeling you get when you have small dogs constantly barking at your heels. On occasion, you lose your cool and whip the shit out of one. If you don't wish to walk with the big dog my advice is don't be those barking at his heels. Saddam barked. The Taliban barked. Who's next?

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 06:44 AM (YV75d)

47 OWOJU: That invader thing is a good point. I never thought of it in that context before. Zarquwi the Jordanian and his boys are just as foreign to Iraq as we are. Ben laden was a foreigner in Afghanistan as he is now in Pakistan. I understand there is more than a few french citizens fighting in Iraq. Of course the real reason is what I've known for years. THIS IS A RELIGIOUS WAR. The fact that these fighters jump from country to country is proof of it. The country doesn't matter. Lebanon, Afghanistan, Iraq. doesn't matter. It will continue until ISLAM understands they cannot act this way. What will it take. Should we continue to lose our young men day to day. Or should we get it over with? I'm still undecided.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 06:58 AM (YV75d)

48 Yeah sure. Bush killed the lady. Stupid comments like yours is why you don't count. Another little dog.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 07:15 AM (YV75d)

49 I hate little dogs. They are nastier and sneakier than the big ones.

Posted by: Laura at November 17, 2004 08:07 AM (ptOpl)

50 BRUNILDA: HOW DOES IT FEEL? As I said before, it's like a rolling stone. It will keep rolling until it's flattened. Nice timing on your attack on America. Again, HOW DOES IN FEEL? Sort of gets you in the gut huh!. Don't feel so safe and smug anymore. American's have had that feeling for several years.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 09:12 AM (YV75d)

51 For those that don't understand the revelance of my last post. Assholes have just blown up 3 banks in Argentina. Two citi-banks and another that I don't know name. No matter who they are, no matter what their cause. There is no excuse to behave like animals.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 09:17 AM (YV75d)

52 Greyrooster, Thank you for your comments. I tried not to denigrate your country (or you), and I think I didn't. In my first posting I said that there was good things done by it, but they were also matched by bad things. I don't demonize your country or your government: it's just not the paradise of liberty you depict. And when it makes mistakes it should recognize it. Mind you the invasion of Iraq was no mistake. It was the result of a carefully planned strategy. Well, maybe not so carefully. As for how it feels to be bombed: it's nothing compared with the 30000 who disappeared between 76 and 83, and we had already had two bombings in the 90's. So I think we actually have seen worse. As for the reasons to invade the Falklands vs. the reasons to invade Iraq: the Falklands ARE argentinian. They were occupied in 1833 by Britain. If you take a map, you'll see where they are located and then maybe you can tell me what kind of claim Britain can have over that territory. We should have never gone to war in 82, but we did not lack reasons to do it. So that is a completely irrelevant point As for why I learnt your language: To be able to talk to you, believe it or not. And my wife is American. And I've looked soooo long at my own government's policies, except that was Argentina does or doesn't only affects Argentinians. We give our opinion of your country because your country makes its deeds everyone's business. You can't make the entire world your playground and then expect people to shut up and not criticize you. >If your country was a world leader, it would have people like you sniping at it Absolutely. That is an obvious point. You don't get to play leader unless you step on other people's heads. As for what my country did or didn't do for the betterment of the world, I would like to know how you measure that. My country also didn't do anything to ruin it. Does that count? We simply don't have the power. We're a small country compared to the US, you might as well complain about the several hundred other countries that "don't do anything for the betterment of the world." Believe me, I know that we couldn't be trusted if we were in power (after all, our governments suck big time!), but that's a realization you seem not to have come to yet with respect to your own country. So you didn't address any of my points, really. The US does more damage than it does good (although it does some good) And that is the issue here. That comes as a freebie when you are in power: in order to maintain it, you have to kick butt and take names. And that's what the US does so well. Cheers, bring'em on ;-)

Posted by: brunilda at November 17, 2004 09:53 AM (v21yJ)

53 Sorry, here I go again. I just wanted to go read some more on the bombings. I forgot to ask you, Greyrooster, to comment on how all the points I raised in the posting before the last one (Chile, Cambodia, Venezuela, etc.) help better the world. Thanks

Posted by: brunilda at November 17, 2004 09:55 AM (v21yJ)

54 Greyrooster and Laura, this dog has a reason to want to bark. I'd just like to say that I have had direct exposure to terrorism. In the eighties and nineties I lived and worked in London. I was just one hundred yards away when the Harrrods bombe exploded and suffered glass cuts to my face and head. I also swa bits of victims all over the street. I also fitted a shop in which we slept while we worked there and the day afer we left it was blown up killing several civillians. We were told the bomb was probably planted whilst we were in there. I also, along with millions, suffered the daily disruption at the hands of the IRA and we often walked around in fear. I personally rang the police twice to report suspicious packages - thankfully both were not bombs. Let me get this straight - TERRORISM is not some kind of joke. The IRA are probably not as bad as Al-queda and their ilk but did not baulk at killing soldiers, policemen in front of their families, politicians, royalty, civillians and children. They saw themselves as crusaders, not terrorists, as soldiers who deserved to be treated with the same rules as British Soldiers. Over time their practices grew ever more viscious and murdurous. Once Margaret Thatcher had utterly failed with her "shoot to kill" policy - a policy which saw IRA numbers rise by a 1000%, incidently - British Governments realised that dialogue was the only way forward. Over time dialogue has changed the very face of the Northern Ireland issue and the fanatics among the IRA have been compltely marginalised. Talking with all terrorists is not possible but there must be found a way or we will never be rid of them by simply trying to wipe them out. It doesn't work and never will. Oh, as an aside, the IRA recieved almost all of their funds from supporters from the US.

Posted by: Matt Bing at November 17, 2004 10:07 AM (ccz95)

55 Haha, I caught myself committing the sin of Hyperbole. Instead of several hundred other countries I should've written "several dozen". There are only 193 countries in the world, apparently ;-)

Posted by: brunilda at November 17, 2004 10:11 AM (v21yJ)

56 i like the comparison between northern ireland and the current situation in iraq, there is a lot of truth in that synopsis. As for Laura et al, you are typical of everything that the rest of the world despises in right wing americans, with black and white, good and evil, simplistic arguments. i hope wankers like are in the minority, or the world is turning into a more dangerous place.

Posted by: bigchester at November 17, 2004 11:40 AM (QSFs0)

57 Matt Bing, What would you know about anything? Have you ever served in the military? Have you seen the way these Ultra Islamic morons treat people? Have you ever seen the scars of women beaten for disobeying their husbands? Or the mutilated face of a woman who mistakenly went out without properly covering her face? I don't think so. Therefore you know sh*t and your uninformed, moronic opinions don't count. Go back to thumbing through your J. Crew Catalogue, eating your wiener schnitzel, drinking your French wine and leave the handling of this country's foreign policy up to those who have the best interests of this country AND the world in mind. Radical Islam is a plague that needs to be destroyed. That will only happen when the ruling parties of countries like Syria, Iran, and Lebanon are wiped from this earth and the landscapes of said countries are covered with the blood of all those who resist us. The day is coming when all good Americans will take no more and stop these people in their tracks. And believe me, phony; pinko liberals such as you will not stop us.

Posted by: John at November 17, 2004 12:17 PM (AEjRy)

58 For all those that believe Mrs. Hassan was killed because the Marine in Falluja exterminated that Islamofacist moron, YOU'RE ALL ABUNCH OF IDIOTS!!!!!!! Al-Jazerra said yesterday, it received the tape of Mrs. Hassan's murder days ago, but didn't come forward with it until yesterday because they couldnÂ’t be sure of its authenticity. HummmmmmmÂ…Â….

Posted by: John at November 17, 2004 12:29 PM (AEjRy)

59 Synopsis comparing Iraq and Ireland is shit. There is no comparison. Irish terrorists that kill innocents should be destroyed like any other terrorist. The US had nothing to do with internal squabbles in Britan. If money can from America to support Irish terrorism/freedom (whatever you choose to call it) it came from Irish immigrants. Read my former posts. I am anti immigration for economic reasons. Irish immigrants promoting terror would fall under one of my reasons why. However, it seems to me that England wishes to stay in Ireland on a premanent basis. America has no such desires in Iraq. We hate that awful place. For Argentine: You're not married to an American. An American would be taking her skillet to you by now. As I have said before a piece of paper doesn't make an American. When I lived in Miami, Florida nearly everyone who worked for me was from latin America. Many from Argentina. They told me why they left their families to come here. I never said going to the middle east was a mistake. I merely, mentioned that we have made mistakes in the past. As everyone who gets involved does. One of you says England is wrong. One of you says Irish are wrong. Both of you say that America is wrong. Know anyone who is right? I say both of you are little dogs. Just yapping at what you wish you were. What happened? Did the big dog piss on you? If America is so wrong, so horrible, why would foreigners want to come here? You are obviously in the minority.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 12:45 PM (Id1ho)

60 I hope these Islamic lovers seen the special on TV where doctors were trying to put a afgan woman back together. Her Islamic husband decided that she didn't see things as he did. So he cut here eyes out. He said she wouldn't listen to him so he cut her ears off. She stuck her nose in mens business so he cut her nose off. Islam the religion of peace. (according to Matt Bing). I've got my own ideas. Wonder who brought her poor woman over here and paid for all she needed. Could it be the oil greedy, money grabbing, trouble making ,uncaring, racist Americans?

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 01:18 PM (Id1ho)

61 What is this America for Israel at all costs thing. America protecting Israel? Arabs would wipe out Israel if America didn't protect them. HOW ABOUT THE REAL TRUTH! If the United States didn't hold the Israels on a leash there wouldn't be a PLO. The nasty little shit Arafat would have went to his virgin camels a long time ago. And that goes for their supporters. How many times does Israel have to whip their asses to point this out. Doing what the ISLAMIC asshole huggers accuse us of doing would be the simplest solution. We do care about the descent people. That's why American boys are dying. We could take care of business without losing a man. I hope we can protect ourselves from future Islamic horrors using the present manner. But if the big dog decides to lift his leg it will be because he's frustrated with the little dogs constant yipping.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 01:47 PM (Id1ho)

62 Brunlida, For all of your b*tching about the United States, you forget, or failed to learn, that the reason all of Argentina wasn't taken over by G.B. was because of a little piece of American Legislation called the Monroe Doctrine. You have no problem with us defending your rights for over two centuries, yet you have a problem with Americans defending our own rights and the rights of few million Iraqis? Sounds rather self centered to me. Just like every other Left leaning moron to me.

Posted by: John at November 17, 2004 01:51 PM (AEjRy)

63 Brunilda: Thank you kindly for your post on the hyperbole comment. A true liberal America hater would have never admitted to exaggeration. He would have said thousands and said anyone who disagrees is ignorant. You can be saved.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 01:58 PM (Id1ho)

64 Rooster, "Could it be Oil greedy, money grapping, trouble making, uncaring, racist americans?"... All except the uncaring part.. I resemble that remark!!! Hahaha Good point tho... Andrea

Posted by: Andrea at November 17, 2004 01:58 PM (+7VNs)

65 Kofi needs to go! http://www.opinionjournal.com/columnists/cRosett/?id=110005904 And this piece of sh*t has the nerve to call the war to liberate Iraq illegal!?! HA F*CKING HA!!!!!!! How about letting a brutal dictator get away with murder, LITERALLY, for years, because it lined the pockets of a bunch of lefty U.N. A$$HOLES!?! The U.N. has gone down the path the League of Nations did right before W.W. II.

Posted by: John at November 17, 2004 02:06 PM (AEjRy)

66 BRUNILDA: Looked at the map as you suggested. Tomorrow we are going to invade Bermuda, Bimini and the Bahamas. Hmmmmmm Cuba only 90 miles. Nay, they already moved here. I see in today's news we just got some more. I think the entire Cuban National Dance team. Wonder why they want to move here? I wonder why so many of them join our armed forces. I wonder why so many of them are fanatically pro America. I mean they could have moved to a country that speaks their language. LIKE ARGENTINA. AMERICA: The boat stops here. For damn good reason. Gotta go. They are exposing the UN's oil for food project as just what it was. Oil for fraud. Chief Engineer. None other that France of course.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 17, 2004 02:26 PM (Id1ho)

67 Now the truth is coming out! Now the world will know who the oil mongers really are. France and Russia....Maybe this is why the UN and France were so against taking Saddam out....hmmmmm. Bush busted their pockets....

Posted by: owoju at November 17, 2004 02:33 PM (N4SKL)

68 From Greyrooster:>You're not married to an American. Do I even need to reply to that? Nah. John: You defended our rights for two centuries? First news. Monroe doctrine?? Uhh, bad mistake, John. Read this: http://usinfo.state.gov/usa/infousa/facts/democrac/50.htm Whose interests were you defending?? You obviously considered us your little playground (which we are, of course ;-)) And obviously, all those are red-herrings. My main point of contention with you guys is that, from past experience, we know we can't trust the US. You have intervened whenever you could to satisfy first your interests, toppling perfectly legitimately elected governments if necessary (most of them left-leaning ***I am not allowed to use the word social--ist because it contains c-i-a-l-i-s, but that's what I mean***). Greyrooster: you try to apply the famous divide ut regnas (divide to conquer) again, if you can. You must have noticed that some of the people arguing against you are British and I am Argentinian, so very conveniently yo are trying to pit me against them because of the Falklands. Hence your somewhat mangled comment about the map. Could you repeat, please? I don't get your point. It all boils down to this. You guys think the US always has the good of the world in mind, and we (or at least I) think it is not the case. Particularly given: 1) The US' history, especially in the 20th century. 2) The fact that you didn't start with Saudi Arabia if you were so worried about the way they treat women. Following with all the countries in the Maghreb, that don't have a free press (none of them does). 3) The hand you have had since at least the 30s in the economic affairs of Latin America (not to mention the middle east). I don't hate the US. I just want a little bit of recognition of these things guys. And of our well-meaning scepticism. In your manichean worldview, you present us with a false dilemma: either you accept everything or you hate us. Sad. I am still waiting for you to explain what good could have possibly come from the cases I cited in my earlier posting.

Posted by: Brunilda at November 17, 2004 03:10 PM (v21yJ)

69 Bigchester: Your usage of "wankers" makes me suspicious that you are from the UK...if so, I rest my case. Can't argue with you lib's from over there. And if I'm in the minority, in case you haven't noticed, over 55,000,000 Americans voted for Bush. I don't think those numbers justify a minority. For the terrorist situation, I would say, yes, it IS black and white...no gray areas there...they must all be exterminated, no if's, and's or but's. Do you have a problem with that? Or are you one of the little dogs?

Posted by: Laura at November 17, 2004 03:17 PM (ptOpl)

70 Hey, I need to go back to work. But it was great talking to all of you. I understand quite a lot more now. Keep it coming. I'll be checking it later. Cheers

Posted by: brunilda at November 17, 2004 03:22 PM (v21yJ)

71 HA HA!!!!!!! Brunilda, you crack me up. You have the nerve to question the U.S.!?! You!?! An Argentinean!?! Your country openly supported Hitler and gave refuge to THOUSANDS of former Nazi Party Officials, Gestapo, and high ranking German Army officers after WW II and you question us!?! HA HA!!!!!!! As for the U.S. getting involved in the affairs of Latin America, maybe if you idiots could pick your sh*tty little "nations" up out of the gutter and put an end to all the drug running, guerilla warfare, coups, kidnappings for ransom and other lovely features of your godforsaken land, we wouldn't have to waste our time with you fools. Ask yourself this, why have so many of my country moved to the U.S.? Now take a look around you. I think the reason is clear.

Posted by: John at November 17, 2004 03:30 PM (AEjRy)

72 uuuuuu John ... small note .... we gave refuge to a whole bunch of jack booted Soldiers, operatives, and scientists from Japan, Germany and Italy. Your right on the rest.

Posted by: Salamander at November 17, 2004 04:02 PM (W2YA6)

73 hmmmm...since a few weeks I'm watching this site, as an european I'd say the comments here are very onesided. I don't mean it negative cuz if I'd be american my point of view about this war would probably be the same. I'm european, but I have some friends in USA and I have been there several times so I understand this and the other side. Through my friends I had the pleasure to learn more about the american way of thinking and I don't deny its kinda fascinating for me. However, in the same way I've learnd from my friends I just wish you would understand us. I neither for nor against the war in iraq. I just find it horrible how innocent people like Magret Hassan and all others got treaten there. Its so sensless and, above all, in vain. In my country one of the greatest leader of war was born. His name? Hitler! And I guess thats why we european disagree to every war on this world.

Posted by: MartinMichael at November 17, 2004 04:08 PM (hHuTQ)

74 Thats why we look at it different. We have to clean up the messes of pricks the rest of the world refuse to clean up. I would like to point out Rommel died beieving in the nationalist movement, its in his diaries, but loathing hitler for his leadership. People could have cared less if it was Hitler or anyone else, they dispised Hitler for doing wrong with his power, not the nationalist movement he spear headed.

Posted by: Salamander at November 17, 2004 04:14 PM (W2YA6)

75 Salamnder, You're absolutely right. My argument is Argentina that openly supported Nazi Germany down to the bitter end. They didn't join the Allies until 1945. After the war, while provided asylum to many former Nazis and supporters of the once Imperialist Japanese, Argentina went a step further. If we found out a German living in the U.S. had run a death camp or committed war crimes, we extradited him to stand trial. The Argentineans would extradite war criminals. If anything they hid them.

Posted by: John at November 17, 2004 04:14 PM (AEjRy)

76 YES!!! I can see it all very clearly now....I was wrong all along! I'm gonna sit on my big wide ass munchin a Big Mac(TM) or ten, watchin' CNN and our Blue-eyed boys kick those camel fuckers' asses over in I-RAK! I tell ya, those greasy bastards are gonna PAY!!!!! I say we slit those towelheads' throats, then boil them all in a huge vat of pigs blood....etc...etc...etc...! Because we are the GLORIOUS U.S. OF GODDAM A... and if any of you lettuce-munching custard-spined lefty homo liberal types disagree, then we should round you up, put you in a field and NUKE ALL YOU BASTARDS AS WELL!!!!!! (at this point, Brad Loveburger leaves the message board in a US army jeep to strains of a band playing the "star spangled banner" followed by an large entourage of star & stripes wearing ,pom-pom waving cheerleaders all chanting "yoo-ess-ay!", "yoo-ess-ay!" "yoo-ess-ay!")* * not really....AMERICA, GET A FUCKING LIFE! AGGRESSION BREEDS AGGRESSION....9/11 PISSED YOU OFF, RIGHT? SO WHAT MAKES YOU THINK AGGRESSION TOWARDS OTHERS IS GONNA MAKE THEM FEEL ANY DIFFERENT?! ALL YOU STUPID ULTRA RIGHT WINGERS WHO CANT SEE BEYOND YOUR OWN TWEE PICKET FENCES IN UTAH KEEP YOUR HEAD FIRMLY WHERE IT BELONGS- UP YOUR SEVERLY DELUDED ARSEHOLES! YOU ARE THE REASON ANTI-AMERICANISM IS AT AN ALL TIME HIGH, YOU ARROGANT BASTARDS!!

Posted by: Brad Loveburger III at November 17, 2004 04:55 PM (SgQqe)

77 And you're the reason we can't stand anti-American foreigners sticking up for the ragheads.

Posted by: Laura at November 17, 2004 05:16 PM (ptOpl)

78 I have one question. If the USA is such an awful place, why is it that when 9/11 happened, people from nearly every country in the world were killed? If it's so terrible why do we have immigrants running over our borders at all costs? If it's so horrible, why were all those people from other countries here on 9/11? When any country in the world has any disaster, who is the first there to help? When the US has a disaster, where are all those people we've helped? They are no where to be found. We learned a long time ago that no one else is going to stand up for us, nor will they help us if we need it. The USA has only been in existence for the past 228 years. These religious fanatics in the middle east have been fighting amongst themselves since the beginning of time. Who fault was it before we were here? The USA was basically founded by groups of people who sought to get away from religious persecution. Our ancestors saw just as much of it as anyones did. The only difference between my ancestors and yours is the fact that mine did something about it. Sit back and do nothing and you will never make a mistake. Of course you will have to live with the consequences of your inability to act. The USA is made up of people striving for a better life. If our ancestors hadn't been busy building this country, we might be sitting around griping about our situations that we were not willing to prevent. Yes, we love this country and would not trade it for any other in the world. You are making yourself sound more important than you really are by saying we want you to be jealous or envy us. Basically, we don't care if you do or not. But don't you dare attack us. You attack one of us and you have all of us to deal with. Even though we are from different parts of the world, have very little in common at times, and don't agree on everything, one thing Americans do agree on is we will stand together to defend this country and what it stands for. The religious fanatics don't like our way of life, they don't like anything American. Except our money. So if you want to think that we care if you envy us or are jealous of us, you go right ahead and think that way. I really don't know of anyone who cares if you like us or not. Go ahead and blame us for the worlds ills. Just remember this, at least we didn't sit around doing nothing. We saw a threat in Sadam and rather than wait until he had the chance to sell weapons he was itching to build, to the religious fanatics determined to kill us all, we did something about it. Try telling the women of Iraq how horrible we are.

Posted by: Mona at November 17, 2004 08:20 PM (5aJBY)

79 Way to go Mona! You get 'em! I think many people, especially the cat in Latin America, can't tell the difference between government and big business. The American way of life opens all kinds of doors to big business. Big businesses will cut the throat of anyone that will allow it. I'm curious...did the pharm company win in your country? If not, good for your people for standing up to them. If they did win, it wasn't the American's doing that to you. It was the pharm company. Big difference. Do you honestly think the American people would stand for economic restraints to be put on any country for the benefit of a huge corporation? If so, you don't know us very well. Another thing many in other countries don't realize is that the President of the US does not wield the power you seem to think he does. Congress and the senate are where the power lies. We can impeach the President, but we have to rely on the democratic process to take care of ones we'd prefer to rid ourselves of. So while our way of live breeds successful businesses, but we are not intimidated by them and don't allow them to take over our lives. We do not want soci (that word the poster won't let us use!) or communism or terrorism here. If you want that, go elsewhere. If I wanted my kids to grow up in the middle of bombings and such, I'd have moved to Iran, Iraq, Israel, etc. We don't want it and will do whatever is necessary to make sure our children don't have to endure it. I have ancestors who signed the Declaration of Independence, have fought in every war in American history, and who made this country into the best place in the world to live. I will not dishonor the sacrifice made by all those generations of my family and will not allow anyone to tear down all they fought to build up. If you don't like us, that's fine. Stay where you are and don't give us another thought. Next time you need us, we'll do the same thing.

Posted by: Nellie at November 17, 2004 09:20 PM (5aJBY)

80 My, my.....is Mr. Burgerlover one of the lard asses discussed earlier?? How did Utah get dragged into this discussion. Do you have a secret loathing of Mormans? Or are you trying to impress us with your knowledge of American geography? Either way, here is what Utah thinks of you. You are a not worth the lint in any American navel.

Posted by: Tomato Head at November 17, 2004 09:33 PM (5aJBY)

81 You are right, Mr. Buggerass or whatever your name is...aggression breeds aggression. 9/11 isn't seen by you as aggression though. What was it other than aggression? You show me one raghead willing to sit down and talk to an American and I'll show you the wires sticking out of the bombs taped to his body. Get real! These people only know one language...killing. That is their purpose in life. To kill as many people as possible. And in the name of religion, at that! They are very warped to think killing buys them a ticket to heaven. And how many American dollars are in your pocket right now??????????????????????????

Posted by: Mona at November 17, 2004 09:47 PM (5aJBY)

82 Right on, Mona and Nellie. It's about time some other broads besides myself are fending for themselves against these assholes. I don't care who believes it or not, I know that there was a connection bet. Iraq and Al Qaeda, that the beheadings would have happened anyway, and if they didn't, and we didn't get Saddam, he would surely have done the job in his own ways. He'd been doing that since before we got him. I must admit I don't like the reasons Bush stated for entering Iraq, like WMD's, to free Iraq, etc. I do agree with his invasion of Iraq, just not his reasons for doing so. And that's what got me into the ongoing debate of the UK people and other foreigners and anti-Americans believing it was an "illegal invasion". What the fuck was 9/11...an invitation? What was USS Cole? The African Embassy attack? The bombing of the trade towers in '93? Mid East has been a hemmoroid since the Iran hostage situation 25 yrs. ago during Carter's reign. They have been coming in droves to the US since then. I've never seen so many uncouth, stinky, dark skinned ragheads as I have during the past 20 + years! I don't believe they want to be Americanized anymore than we want them here. To think that Atta and those other terrorists who flew those planes lived right among us, shopping at the same stores, working out at the same gyms, living in the same houses and apt. buildings!!!!! Your next store neighbors, folks! And we let 'em in. I hope that Marine that killed the so called "unarmed" Iraqi fighter gets a slap on the hand and goes back to fighting, however, I doubt it. The trauma of this ordeal surely will get him dismissed and sent home. Hopefully, he will not have charges brought against him. This is WAR, Goddamn it, and we can't let trust the soldiers to do the right thing in a snap judgement, then why bother fighting over there? Fuck Iraq in that case. Bring our men home and carpet bomb the rest of them. End of story. That was my bicentennial minute.

Posted by: Laura at November 17, 2004 10:11 PM (ptOpl)

83 Hi everyone, I'm back, OK, Argentina is not relevant to this discussion. That trick is so old that it even has a name in logic: it is called a tu quoque fallacy (http://www.adamsmith.org/logicalfallacies/000661.php) But, John, do you really think I am gonna be all up in arms because you rightly pointed out that the military (dictatorial, not democratically elected) government during WWII harbored the nazis??? Are you kidding me??? Me stand up for those SOBs??? If you think I am going to put my nation before my principles you can forget about it. What they did was criminal, period. And when it's taught in our high-schools it is taught as a moment we should all be ashamed of. Of course that's of zero relevance to the matter at stake here, but I thought I might as well point it out. Second: Mona read my postings. I never said all those things you attribute to me. Like your country being horrible. That's what some of your buddies said about mine. I pointed out that you were wrong in invading Iraq and that you are wrong in being self-righteous and using the world as your playground. And all you could do was compare yourselves to a banana republic like my country of origin. Wow! There are great things and great people in the US, that's absolutely not in question. But that you are so benevolent that you stand for liberty and always do good and you're disinterested, err, learn some history. It'll help you. And finally (I need to go to bed), this is the page I was looking for, to remind you to also see the beam in your own eye: http://archive.salon.com/books/feature/2004/10/11/crouch/index_np.html Cheers everyone. Make your country even better than it is.

Posted by: brunilda at November 17, 2004 10:37 PM (v21yJ)

84 BRUNILDA: The point is we don't agree with you that we were wrong to invade Iraq. In addition, you seem to emit an attitude that you know better. You don't. We have learned to detect that smug liberal attitude that says I am right and you are ignorant if you don't agree. Then, I will prove it by posting a slanted view coming from somewhere else. There are just as many articles slanted to our way of thinking. America is becoming a nation that doesn't trust others. For good reason I might add. Much of the world wishes to feed here, while bringing little to the table. Educate us, feed us, give us your inventions, your money, your culture, your music, your sports, your technology. Protect us when we are attacked. Even by our own. And by the way, we hate you. You are wrong.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 18, 2004 12:26 AM (7yovg)

85 Dear;Mr. Bush I thank God so very much,that you now,our president one again.

))My precious President!!! I Love Mr.& Mrs President Bush. Please taking all the bads guy, so we can live on this dreamland,that GOD said SO... Mr. President Bush..May GOD be on Your side all throught the coming year. Mr. President Bush; this coming Sunday, I'm going to Pasadena to see Bill Graham,and I will save my prayer for this nation safe and sound Plus ..I will praying for you too. I Love you Mr.President Bush

Posted by: me at November 18, 2004 02:48 AM (DmPDQ)

86 "America is becoming a nation that doesn't trust others"... Yep, so carry on being paranoid within your own borders then & stop interfering in hotspots throughout the world and frequently fucking things up...& don't go travelling around the world then, stay at home watching on TV the consequences of your foreign "tours" on your young servicemen, when they arrive home in bodybags...you'll probably not feel safe travelling abroad to certain locations in the current climate anyway, so, yeah, stay at home! I'll repeat that if your foreign policy hadnt been so aggressive, so pro-israeli, and on occasions, so needlessly interfering, then the arab fundamentalists might not have committed 9/11. Nothing said on this whole thread has convinced me otherwise. SO, YEAH! just you carry on thinking the American way is the best way.....that's why the rest of the world looks "very favorably" (NOT) at your downright refusal to sign the Kyoto treaty....fuck the rest of the world & the future of the world, as long as we Americans in our cars with engines the size of tanks carry on living our "freedom lovin'" lifestyle, lets fuck the fact that Nike (one example of many)spend millions on advertising and marketing, but people in the Phillipines are stitching basketball vests on their (and subsequently your) behalf for mere cents per hour....YEAH! WOOOOOOOO! "Much of the world wishes to feed here"......Oh Yeah?! not with you greedy overweight bastards, thank you. "while bringing little to the table"....mmm....let me see...is that the fault of the people of other countries who have suffered as a result of America's manipulation of the economic world (see Nike example above) ?! Thats right, you engineer things to preserve your priviliged lifestyle at the expense of your fellow humans, then complain when they want to cross the divide to the land of plenty....hardly surprising, is it?! "America Educate us"..... in what, exactly? ...paranoia? ...xenophobia? ...aggressive military tactics? ...being eco-unfriendly? ...the economic manipulation of more unfortunate countries? Because you are past-masters at all of these... "feed us"...HINT: Stick your burgers down the toilet and learn to WALK again, before the combined weight of the US population sends you sinking into the sea.... give us your inventions, your money....see above as to why you are so wealthy in the first place. We all pay for YOU in some ways. your culture, your music, your sports....granted, some aspects of american culture are ok...though, i'm struggling to think of a single example at present....though your sports are crap! who has a WORLD series involving a grand total of TWO nations!?! "your technology"....I have a theory here....More anti- western nations, whilst not having nuclear weapons at present, will have them at some point in the future! Why? because the likes of Iran (for example) are progessive nations who arent still fighting with shields & spears. Nuclear tecnology is over 50 years old, the rest of the world is catching up fast (and with NO technological help from you, I might add!) "Protect us when we are attacked"...I'm a brit and you know what? if a 747 flies straight into Big Ben, it wont be my fault, it will be Blair's fault for insisiting on fighting this fucking unnecessary war, alongside you paranoid trigger-happy freaks. Besides, no, I wouldn't want America to do anything if we (the UK) were invaded or attacked...we've not been successfully invaded for a 1,000 years, so I think we'll be ok thank you very much & before you go on about World War II, Hitler was never gonna invade us seriously, the english channel saw to that.

Posted by: Brad Loveburger III at November 18, 2004 03:27 AM (SgQqe)

87 So passivity is a quaility you think will save you from terrorist acts. You are disillusioned my English friend. People like you will be the first to get beheaded by the terrorists for being so damn ignorant.

Posted by: Chuck at November 18, 2004 06:47 AM (ZK4JW)

88 Hi all,I'm from England and this is my 1st post so bear with me thanks. Firstly God Bless and God speed to Margaret who at least is now in a safe place hopefully being rewarded for her good deeds. Secondly well done to the American soldier who shot the "unarmed" Iraqi, he may have been boobytrapped or had a grenade ready anyhow.He should have shot your journalist as well for being so willing to air this and hang the soldier out to dry.How do you decide who are insurgents or civillians. Are the Iraqi's we see dancing on blown up tanks or cheering at dead soldiers civillians ? Thirdly I think that whatever is wrong with your Country (and ours) the majority of people in the UK would rather stand side by side with you than our weak-kneed "friends" in Europe. If its time to stand up and pick a side then ... God Save the Queen and God Bless America !

Posted by: Stuart at November 18, 2004 07:29 AM (f1dYS)

89 Being passive Chuck? read my first paragraph....the American mistake has been not supporting the creation of a Palestinian state enough, until last week, when Bush starts making big belated positive noises about the palestinian question (no doubt after persuasion from Blair). So, is seeking solutions to problems through progressive diplomacy being passive? I rather think not...and what's more, in exactly WHAT way can real determined diplomatic effort incite the terrorists to commit another 9/11?!? the answer is, we know for definite, it won't. Rockets, Bombs, thousands of innocent civilian deaths & the ILLEGAL invasion of a muslim state might just piss them off again though, don't you think?

Posted by: Brad Loveburger III at November 18, 2004 08:30 AM (SgQqe)

90 BradBurger: "I'm a Brit"...that says it all. Forgive me, Stuart, you are one of the rarer ones on this blog from the UK that actually support Blair and Bush. People like Brad, CooqarUK, and others from the UK give your country a bad name. Whining, pissing and moaning that it's Bush's fault, Blair's fault...oh, I'm getting so tired of these cry baby libs! Two words for Brad: Fuck off.

Posted by: Laura at November 18, 2004 09:03 AM (ptOpl)

91 Laura, go book a one-way flight to Fallujah a.s.a.p. because your inarticulate, ultra right wing "bomb the bastards" small minded rants are VERY FUCKING TEDIOUS. I know a guy called Al-Zarquwi who will take you in for a few days (though maybe in your case he'd be chopping your head off after only a few minutes, not days...because I know that I wouldn't spare you for a few days if I lived in your house & had to listen to the shit coming out of your mouth)...anyway, I've heard that he's very hospitable with American right wingers....

Posted by: Brad Loveburger III at November 18, 2004 02:57 PM (SgQqe)

92 Truth hurts, eh, Bradburger? Why is it that all of the bloggers on here disagree with you? Maybe because you're a fake.

Posted by: Laura at November 18, 2004 03:18 PM (ptOpl)

93 Careful Laura .... I think Brad has the "hots" for you.. LOL

Posted by: Stuart at November 18, 2004 04:11 PM (Qlk2S)

94 Oh yeah right. Like CooqarUK on the Bigley blog?

Posted by: Laura at November 18, 2004 04:22 PM (ptOpl)

95 Sorry Laura, Just English sense of humour.

Posted by: Stuart at November 18, 2004 04:28 PM (Qlk2S)

96 S'ok, Stuart, no harm done. Others have said worse. ;-)

Posted by: Laura at November 18, 2004 04:36 PM (ptOpl)

97 QUOTE from Brad,"I know a guy called Al-Zarquwi.." A little disturbing, or disturbed?

Posted by: owoju at November 18, 2004 04:45 PM (N4SKL)

98 Brunilda has some points to her arguement but doesn't she wonder why a self absorbed country like the U.S. would Build the Panama Canal then give it back to Panama? Even tho it's such a huge money maker? Why the U.S. would accept Japan's surrender in WW II then help rebuild it into one of the worlds leader economic powers that in more than a few ways rivels that of the U.S.? I don't think those are moves of a country bent on world domination? But because we are so successful people will always say what they want to, OOps, well atleast in the U.S. Brunilda. Try demonstrating against your own goverments where you live and see how far it gets you.

Posted by: K G at November 18, 2004 05:42 PM (xXUWq)

99 I actually promised my self I wouldn't read this thread anymore (life goes on) but... On the Panama Canal: http://www.smplanet.com/imperialism/joining.html And K.G. you may want to read the next page too: http://www.smplanet.com/imperialism/teddy.html There's the answer to your question on why the US build the canal. Cheers,

Posted by: brunilda at November 18, 2004 07:57 PM (v21yJ)

100 I apologize, I forgot to mention that the reconstruction of Japan was, in my opinion, one of the best decisions in US policy in the 20th century. It showed the world that it had actually learnt the lessons of the Versailles treaty, and therefore, it has to be properly recognized and admired. Kudos.

Posted by: brunilda at November 18, 2004 09:01 PM (v21yJ)

101 Hi are you Brits out there Hi Lara LONG LIVE ENGLAND! I love the Brits. Im an American vietnam vet......"been there done that" Thank god for that marine who shot the terroist armed or unarmed he saved another colaition soldier from dying. Next time Marines use a granade and take out the whole bunch of them! As for Brad eat camel shit!

Posted by: sue at November 19, 2004 07:05 PM (rL0Tr)

102 I find it abhoring that while the Arab media plays the marine video 24/7, they won't show Hassan's. Better to depict Americans as savages rather than admit the truth that their own are the true bastards of depravity.

Posted by: Laura at November 19, 2004 07:35 PM (ptOpl)

103 Brunilda, If you read my post, I didn't 'attribute' anything to you. I read all the earlier posts and replied to them all. I just asked simple questions. As for BurgerAss or whoever it is, you really have your head up your ass. I don't think you know much at all about WWII. Why did Churchill beg the USA to come help England? Certainly wasn't because all was well there. It was because bombs were dropping all over London with no end in sight. Hitler would have loved nothing more than taking up your precious Queen's residence. Which by the way, that whole concept is a bit 'head up the ass', but that's another topic. The thing you people do not understand is that in a democracy, the PEOPLE elect the officials. If you don't like them, don't vote for them. That's how we do it here. If you aren't voted for, you don't become President. I think the fact that Bush was re-elected has really chapped the hide of lots of other countries. HE is who we wanted or he wouldn't have received more than 3.5 million more votes. You can say what you want about him or the USA, but you just don't get it. All you want to do is criticize us when every one of your posts attacking us is so green with envy it's funny. Yes, we drive cars - whatever kind we want. As far as the Nike comment, I have one response. How would all those people be making a living if Nike weren't there? When all the crap about the Mexican sweatshops working for USA companies came out, the USA companies pulled out. Do you know how those women that had worked there fed their children after that? Prostitution is how. I was there and saw that with my own eyes, so I know that is true. Why do your countries make it so inviting for American companies to come there and open factories? I know everyone here wishes the jobs remained here. This is another example of government being mistaken for big business and free enterprise. The government cannot control what these large corporations do around the world anymore than you can. So you can shove your Nike comments straight up your already full ass.

Posted by: mona at November 19, 2004 10:03 PM (J7nZh)

104 Brunidla, Forgot one comment. I have a master's degree in history. I don't think you can even come close to that. Fact of the matter...how now owns the Panama Canal? Isn't the USA. Don't think we've ever invaded our closest neighbors, who would be fairly easy pickings if we were hellbent on doing that. And my dear, even if you won't admit it, you'd be living in a far different world now that you are if the USA had not pulled England out of Hitler's fist.

Posted by: Mona at November 19, 2004 10:15 PM (J7nZh)

105 why don't they keep showing or atleast show once on all the news stations the killing of margaret? We see killings all the time on movies and our local news, read about them in our papers etc.....and now they want to push in the ground this poor marine who did what he should have done considering his circumstances.........for all we know the raghead could have been doing what many have did before, waiting for a moment to of course fake and hide (what their trained to do) and then blow himself and everyone to bits,,,,,,,,give me a break,,,,,,this makes me sick,,,,,,,,the news media needs to be charged the war crimes!!!!!!!!!!!!!! all they do is downgrade and belittle our country, military and our president......... Rest In Peace Margaret......where were all your Iraqi friends.........when will the country and its people.get balls to stand on their own????????/ I want my babysitting husband home!!!to protect our country for a change...

Posted by: madarmywife at November 20, 2004 02:04 PM (llyRQ)

106 Bradloveburger or booger #3 you make me sick!!!!!!!!! Why didn't your never been invaded tea drinking winers save the jews in the holocaust???? God Bless Tony Blair and lord help him for having creeps like you in his country!!!!!!!!!! you must really be coogar or live next door to him, or your dropped off at the same daycare! Go back to your looking for something in the paper to sound intelligent game!!!!!!!!!!!!! we have seen your kind too many on here.......we don't like your ideas and negativity.......why don't you try standing up for something that serves a purpose............besides just using the bathroom...................You Brits, are as arrogant as your queen,,,,,,,,,I mean what does she do for a living? exactly?

Posted by: madarmywife at November 20, 2004 02:12 PM (llyRQ)

107 Brunilda, You don't even make sense.......... You don't trust America, but any of you Foreign asses will take our money wont you!!!!!!!!!! why don't you try listing all the help our tax dollars from each individual in America goes to help,,,,,,,,,about Women in Saudi Arabia, they were in no way as abused as the Iraqi women,,,,,,,,,,sure they can't vote....so what!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you need to get you act together girl!!!!!!!!!!! What grade are you in by the way, are you in High School, Do you have a high School? I am right with Mona on this one, don't even know her,slight difference my BA is in English, Hey Laura, are you stealing the brits hearts again...he he I bet coogs jealous,,,,,,,,,come on coogar we know you are on here, who are you? are you the booger #3

Posted by: madarmywife at November 20, 2004 02:22 PM (llyRQ)

108 one more thing Brunilda, stop posting web addresses please, we can find those all we want, this is a blog sight, to state your own personal ideas and known facts this is not a contest on intellectual ability

Posted by: madarmywife at November 20, 2004 02:26 PM (llyRQ)

109 Oh jesus!...here we go again... you right wingers will never convince me on Iraq & vice versa, but....just for Mona, I can assure you that I am not jealous of the USA - whether you believe that or not, I don't really care... you have a History degree do you!? Do you want a round of applause for that, do you?! No? How about a gold star then? Well... as for Churchill "begging" the USA for help in WWII, granted, he recognised that at that early point of WWII we were the last remaining major force in Europe opposing Nazism & yes, you are right to point out that London was being pummelled by bombing during 1940...so, he went to the US for help to avoid a PROLONGED conflict - not because we were "losing" the war & at real threat from invasion. As I pointed out in an earlier post, although Hitler had made sketchy plans for "Operation Sealion" the reality was that it was never going to happen, Hitler's main objective was the proposed expansion of the Nazi empire into Soviet Russia, because of his loathing of the Slavs... So, because of the sea & the Slavs, Britain was realitvely safe from invasion & arguably, with the Russians,we would have defeated the Nazis anyway, admittedly in a longer war. So, go & read more history books. Or look at the facts, without bias. OH another thing.... did we not help YOU in south east Asia during WWII?? What a selective memory you have.... As for your criticism of our Queen, I AGREE WITH YOU!!!! So, no quarrel there.... The "car" comment? - you didnt really answer my point about your countries' enormous energy consumption & the Kyoto treaty did you? - one issue on which almost every other industrialised country on earth doesn't agree with you. Just remember, 100 years from now, your kids & grandkids will have to breathe the same air as mine. So, naturally, the rest of the leading nations don't agree with, or respect the US short-sighted stance on Kyoto . I accept that the actions of big western businesses are not officially US government policy, and indeed the UK is not blameless on this, but the point I was making here was in response to previous posts on this thread stating "if the USA is so bad, how come everybody wants to come here?!?" I was merely suggesting that it is because it is better to be in the position of the EXPLOITEE (big business & the consumers living in the affluent countries with thriving economies who conduct this big business) rather than the EXPLOITED (the countries in which cheap labour is used for greater profit margins by the afore-mentioned big business in rich countries)....don't try to convince me that Nike start making running shoes in Greece because the "poor women" would be selling sex otherwise....it's about PROFIT & PROFIT alone. AND YOU KNOW IT. mardammywife...an English degree, eh? Ok, whatever... Why didnt we save the Jews??? We didnt know about the scale of the fucking holocaust till we entered deep into Nazi territory to liberate the camps - you retard!!! On that basis, it's America's fault just as much as the UK's because as Mona said, we apparently "BEGGED" you to enter WW2, so it follows that it must be YOUR fault six million Jews died because you didnt help us kill all the Nazi's quickly enough...YOU IDIOT!!! Pearl Harbour had nothing do do with the US entering WW2 though, did it?!

Posted by: Brad the trim-waisted slad-muncher at November 20, 2004 04:49 PM (SgQqe)

110 Hey, all, this Brad guy sure is starting to sound like COOqarUK, doesn't he? Me thinks they're one and the same. Like the rest of the whining lib's from the UK.

Posted by: Laura at November 20, 2004 06:56 PM (ptOpl)

111 Madarmywife: I couldn't resist: "BLOG SIGHT". Define please? You must mean "blog site"... BA in ENGLISH... oh my God. Good night ladies and gentlemen. You are surreal to argue with. And don't even bother keeping up with your insults... I'm gone for good (I can hear cheers -and relief- on your side).

Posted by: brunilda at November 20, 2004 07:19 PM (v21yJ)

112 brunhilda the great goddess of spelling, well I did say this wasn't an intellect contest....no comparison to all your mis-spellings and confusion in run ons....atleast sight was spelt right he ha he ha... all I can say is good bye and don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out,,,miss argentina

Posted by: madarmywife at November 20, 2004 11:13 PM (rLlU1)

113 where was it you "learnt" to spell anyway brunhilda girl

Posted by: madarmywife at November 20, 2004 11:16 PM (rLlU1)

114 Brad what ever size waist you have.. you are coogar aren't you??? your the idiot, pearl harbor on these blogs is old news, we've all been there over that one, go back to bigley's blog if you want to go there, save us some time.... you didn't know about the scale because you are retarded!!!!why did you wait for the usa to cover you coward back , why didn't you take care of it sooner you creep!!!!!!!!!well we didn't make the same mistake this time, were gonna "get-r-done" with no help or whinning from assholes like you!!!!

Posted by: madarmywife at November 20, 2004 11:22 PM (rLlU1)

115 one more thing brad the waist muncher we could care less if you belived in this fight for terrorism or why we are there, no one is trying to change your mind....so stop feeling sorry for yourself and stop all the blah blah crap we have already heard from the brits before...most people will skip such long repeated paragraphs on here about who's country does what and did what...blah blah,,,, if this is coogar, glad to see you back old friend, missed you

Posted by: madarmywife at November 20, 2004 11:28 PM (rLlU1)

116 believed...sorry for the mis-spelling he he heh e

Posted by: madarmywife at November 20, 2004 11:30 PM (rLlU1)

117 I have just one comment to Broom Hilda's, and all the other wonderfully wise Brits' remarks.....Does everyone who ever had a doubt, now understand why our ancestors beat the shit out of England and sent them back across the water during the Revolutionary War???????? Now...twist that fact.....

Posted by: Mona at November 21, 2004 01:29 AM (J7nZh)

118 Oh well Burger Muncher or Thin Waist, or whatever you want to be called now....think you have effectively had your ass kicked. Just like your sorry assed king got the last time England tried to tell us what to do. You are pathetic. When anyone points out facts that you don't want to acknowledge, you start personal attacks. The nerve of you tea drinking arrogant assholes! I knew you were all crazy when I received my letter from one of your newspapers telling me not to vote for George Bush. I'll tell you the same thing I told your newspaper......kiss my ass.

Posted by: hilda at November 21, 2004 01:33 AM (J7nZh)

119 Way to go!! I think Hitler would have looked cute sitting on the Queen's throne. He might not have looked quite as much like a starched old fart as she does. Speaking of old farts, Prince Charles will fit in her shoes nicely. He and his sister about the ugliest things I've ever seen. Are you people sure they didn't crawl out from under a rock? Mr Muncher....you need to go find something else to chew, as it's obvious this discussion is over your head. Brundila....give it up...you are just plain and simply WRONG. As far as Nike...I'm sure it is profitable for them to go to other countries to make their shoes or they wouldn't do it. My question to you on that is the same as Mona's....is it better to have nowhere to work, or to have a job making comparable wages to everyone else in the country? Whose fault is it that these countries allow companies to pay their workers so little? We have something known as a minimum wage in the USA to protect citizen from that. And when these plants close their doors, where do these people work then? Or do they suddenly stop wanting to eat? Then on to the energy consumption....how many people live in England? How many people live in the USA? Think there is a bit of a difference there. Any country that allows a rotted old fart called the queen to ride around in a car or in a boat or even use enough electricity to light her palace, has no room to say one word to anyone using anything.

Posted by: Tomato Head at November 21, 2004 01:48 AM (J7nZh)

120 I just have to jump in with one comment....To all you wise Brits - take your ideas and opinions and stick them up the Queen's ass. Might give her something to think about other than how she can kill other unwanted family members.

Posted by: mary at November 21, 2004 01:53 AM (J7nZh)

121 Wo! One at a time HaHa! All rising to my bait like the dumb Yanks you are! 1. "getting my ass kicked" what - by you lot?!? mmm...let me see...does the creator of this site hold jingoistic, anti-islamic views, therefore this site naturally attracts people holding those same views? The answer is YES, and that's the ONLY reason I'm outnumbered here....let's take a world poll on the war in Iraq...think the results might be rather different then. Which is why hardly any other nations are fighting with you in Iraq. TWIST THAT FACT, MONA. 2. You will never be convinced that anything other than force will solve this problem & if anyone else tries to argue to the contrary, they are "a whining lib"...which is ok,I can accept other people's points of view but you then are "insular,paranoid trigger happy freaks, who can't see past your own belly buttons" then. So, do not make the accusation that it is solely ME who resorts to personal insults...read the whole thread, and have you not done the same?! HaHa, your hypocrisy makes me sick. Typically, you only see things from one (slanted) point of view - your own. More navel gazing.... 3. No reasonable arguement has been made to defend your countries planet-killing policies or the fact that your immigration is caused by exploiting less fortunate countries...... 4. As has previously been documented, I couldn't give a shit about the queen, if she dropped dead tomorrow, i'd throw a party. 5. The war of Independence? sure you kicked our ass OVER 200 YEARS AGO...YOU ARE RIGHT, MONA!! Now admit the points where i am right, or at least have a valid point. ARE YOU BIG ENOUGH TO DO THAT???!!!! Don't worry, i'll still sleep tonight if you don't, because like the majority of the rest of the world, I don't share your views on the war in iraq. Which says everything about the majority opinion on this board. It's wrong, and out of touch with the REAL majority, out there in the REAL world. TWIST THAT FACT.

Posted by: Brad Boom at November 21, 2004 04:47 AM (SgQqe)

122 Refer: BRUNILA'S post of Nov 18, 9.01PM. Seems to agree with drop the bomb and then rebuild policy. HMMMMM! Myself I'm still in the court of don't drop the bomb until absolutely neccessary. I do agree that we should be using more missles/aircraft to deliver stronger weaponry. The so called innocent civilians should have enough sense to get away from the terrorist/insurgent element. That is if they are not actually supporting them. They know who they are. Is Israel going to let Iran develop nuclear capability that close to home? They didn't allow Iraq to.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 21, 2004 08:55 AM (z15fv)

123 Hey folks: Big mistake here. England, Ireland , Scotland, Wales are great countries. They have a few assholes as we do. Don't attack the countries the assholes are from just because they attack us. The UK is our best friend and they deserve to be. On the question of the world not joining us. The world didn't join us in WW2 either. As a major bully in highschool I learned that very few of the thousands in my school would fight back. Those with the courage to fight back usually joined my group. Not proud. Just saying like it is. In WW2 you had the UK (and it's group) and the United States fighting against injustice. Russia played the same game then as now until attacked. The French layed down, as they do now. Spain hid in the sand same as now. I am surprised at Germany. After we done so much for them. Not much has changed. South America acted the same. THIS TIME LET US REMEMBER

Posted by: greyrooster at November 21, 2004 09:22 AM (z15fv)

124 THANK YOU Hilda, Mona, Tomato, Mary,!!!! LOL This is the first real LOL moment I have ever had since my husband went back to Iraq,,,reading all the comments in a row after my own, then hearing old coogar brad mucher thin wasit respond...now that was some funny stuff!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks again,,,I am still laughing...... Rooster, you are right, I have always had a fondness for Scotland and hope to visit there someday being scot/Irish myself. Hail to the queen..he he heh eh...they are ugly arent' they?????

Posted by: madarmywife at November 21, 2004 01:09 PM (j8wed)

125 planet killing,,,,,,,,,,,,,do you not eat, use the restroom, sleep, throw away garbage , use heat, air, put your pants on like the rest of the world............your the hypocrite coogar aka brad waist broom muncher wish I was american no body loves me I drink too much tea and would rather wait for the terrorist to come to my door etc etc etc..blah blah blah...... Immigration problems?? now your blaming us for immigration problems...they'd be coming there my friend if they didn't have the ocean between them..!!!... come on coog, give us something good!!!!!to jump on you about

Posted by: madarmywife at November 21, 2004 01:23 PM (j8wed)

126 Well, I think my suspicions are confirmed. Brad Burger, waisted, what the fuck he calls himself on each new post IS the infamous Coo Coo COOqaruk....SMELLS LIKE IT ANYWAY. Rooster is right though. We shouldn't start knocking our allies just because a coupla assholes come from there. I don't care who kicked whose ass, it's the here and now I'm concerned about. And it looks like we're gonna be headed to Mosul in the next few days. That's the newest beheadquarters, get it?

Posted by: Laura at November 21, 2004 01:54 PM (ptOpl)

127 Â“It is not a sensible or intelligent response for us in Europe to ridicule American arguments and parody their political leadership. What is entirely sensible is for Europe to say that terrorism wonÂ’t be beaten by toughness alone.Â” Mr Blair said there was an opportunity for Europe. Â“American policy is evolving. Increasingly both Europe and America are coming to realise that lasting security against fanatics and terrorists cannot be provided by conventional military force. Â“It requires a commitment to democracy, freedom and justice. The only stable Afghanistan will be a democratic Afghanistan. Â“Ultimately it is democracy in Iraq that will defeat the insurgents, which is why they are so desperate to stop it. The only viable Palestinian state will not just be based on territory but on democratic values. Â“Likewise, the best help we can give Africa is not just through aid, vital though that is, and opening up trade, but through supporting countries in their desperate and fraught attempts to to build institutions of good governance.Â” Mr Blair said that democracy was the meeting point for Europe and America. Â“I am not Â— repeat not Â— advocating a series of military solutions to achieve it. But I am saying that patiently but plainly Europe and America should be working together to bring democratic, human and political rights we take for granted to the world denied them. Mr Blair also spoke of the need for the UN to take on a greater leadership role in providing for intervention in failed states that injure rather than protect their own citizens. Â“None of this will work, however, unless America too reaches out. Multilateralism that works should be its aim. I have no sympathy with unilateralism for its own sake.Â” Mr Blair also delivered a passionate defence of the alliance. Â“I know of one thing. If we were under direct threat, America would be our ally. If America were to pull up the drawbridge, retreat from its obligations and alliances abroad, the terrorists would attack the rest of us. Â“They are not interested in America as America. They are interested in America as the post powerful actor in pursuit of beliefs they fear as much as we value them.Â” He said of America and Europe: Â“What we share is, in the end, of oceanic depth compared to the shallow water of any present discord.Â” Britain had a unique role to play between Europe and the US. Â“Call it a bridge, a two-lane motorway, a pivot or call it a damn high wire, which is how it often feels, our job is to keep our sights firmly on both sides of the Atlantic, use the good old characteristics of common sense and make the argument. Â“In doing so we are not subverting our country either into an American poodle or a European municipality, we are advancing the British national interest in a changed world in the 21st century.Â” SO, INVADE IRAN, OR ANYWHERE ELSE AND YOU'RE ON YOUR OWN.... BYE BYE, LOVE AND HUGS, BIG BRAD BLAIR.

Posted by: Tony Blair at November 21, 2004 04:36 PM (SgQqe)

128 First off, I never told you anything about an ass being kicked. Think that came in later posts, not mine. So I think you are the one getting a bit upset here. I do want to ask one question though I will likely regret it. How is our 'exploitation' of other countries having cheap labor rates causing our immigration problems? My hat's off to you MadArmyWife. I'm glad someone else found all those postings after mine amusing. Hasn't the royal family hear of plastic surgery? Or would that taint the blue blood? Broom Hilda, one other comment. I would gladly admit you were right about something if I could find anything you are right on.

Posted by: Mona at November 21, 2004 07:04 PM (J7nZh)

129 Glad I made you smile Madarmywife. Sure you need a few smiles these days. As far as the broom chewer, I think I detect a note of hostility in your comments. Mission accomplished!!! Sorry you got blamed for it Mona! I have one more comment to make on the queen. She's a bit like soap-on-a-rope. Fart-on-a-throne.

Posted by: Tomato Head at November 21, 2004 07:10 PM (J7nZh)

130 Mona, i'll spell it out for you....would you rather live in a shit-hole of a country working hard just to keep your head above water with few luxuries to look forward to, or would you rather be in a country whose big business takes advantage of the cheap labour on offer in your country and also offers a much higher standard of living for exactly the same amount of work.....mmm...tough choice, huh? To go back to the original point that brought this all up...That is why "people want to come to the USA". I've done you the courtesy of answering your question, now tell me why the US wont sign the Kyoto Treaty? I know the answer, but would like to hear it from you. Thank you. And I know you probably won't appreciate this, but you have my credit for being the only person on here who has the intelligence to be worthy of replying to...Like i've said, I can handle a different rationally-argued view, just not a blinkered one. Keep the Anti-Queen comments coming by the way, I find them funny myself....

Posted by: Brad Blair's son at November 22, 2004 03:58 AM (SgQqe)

131 To Mona, Laura and the Madarmywife I have just read your comments regarding the British..First of all I would like to say that every decent human being detests terrorism in all forms so let me refresh your memory mona..(as you have a masters degree in History that is)The greatest single act of terror in modern history was in fact committed by your own government...yes..the devastation of Hiroshima in 1945. The peace negotiations were almost over..The Japanese were just holding out to keep their emperor as head of state...Could the Americans wait for just another week? No chance...They dropped the atom bomb that killed over 100,000 people, Men Women and Children..Was that good enough..NO..Three days later they dropped another one...Plutonium this time on Nagasaki..They not only killed another 50,000 but quite a few American prisoners of war..Oh yes and a few more thousand due to the fallout...What did President Harry say to the American people?..They were just military installations No civilians were killed...but we all know different now dont we? so Please Mona go and resit your Masters degree ...Also Ladies could you tell me what language you speak?...Let me guess...English..Right?..If the English had not set sail a few hundred years ago you would still be speaking Apache,Souix or Crow and giving birth in tents...Dont forget girls the British are your closest ally..SO STOP KNOCKING THEM

Posted by: Rodders at November 22, 2004 03:15 PM (0kcTO)

132 Wrong, my ancestors came from ITALY.

Posted by: Laura at November 22, 2004 08:14 PM (ptOpl)

133 Laura....ok, why did your Italian ancestors move to the USA?

Posted by: Bradley Bear at November 23, 2004 02:48 AM (SgQqe)

134 "In a fair world trade system, you would get paid the same per hour for equally onerous work no matter where on earth you did the work. You would get paid more for climbing in sewers, for doing a job that only a few people can do, or for doing a job that takes long preparation, such as being a doctor. How is the world organised now? Americans get paid perhaps over an order of magnitude times more for the same work as people in the poorest countries. Who is ripping off whom? That disparity is only possible when America takes unfair advantage of her economic and military might. People don't voluntarily put up with that degree of disparity. All the countries in the west take unfair advantage of the third world, not just America. It is just that America is most blatant because she is the most powerful". ....Mona, as per my previous answers, previously on this thread, I accept that the UK is not totally blameless itself in this regard.....the difference seems to be that I have a conscience on the issue whereas, you seem to think the ONLY reason people want to emigrate to the USA is because "its such a great place"...you may enjoy freedom & relatively cheap goods and a high standard of living etc etc but on what foundations are some of those things built upon? i'll put it to you again...in no small part, it's due to the exploitation of poorer countries by your big business.

Posted by: Brad the moose at November 23, 2004 03:22 AM (SgQqe)

135 Hello again girls...Laura tell me the answer to this question...What is the smallest book in the world??????....No Idea?..let me tell you..THE ITALIAN BOOK OF WAR HERO'S... I came onto this website to see the the comradeship between two Countries fighting a war side by side...all I have seen is a few British hating American females who dont know what they are talking about...So girls, I dont mind having a laugh with people of limited intelligence but I admit ..I do get a little pissed off with disrespectful people....So if you wish to keep this war of words please understand that for every derogatory comment you make against the British people ..I will have an answer....bye

Posted by: Rodders at November 23, 2004 10:45 AM (3zwMU)

136 One thing is being forgotten in all the talk of the USA taking advantage of cheap third world labor. When those jobs leave the USA, there is no one here doing them anymore. So the people who you claim are making huge wages for the same work being done in the third world are dead wrong. Americans who were doing those jobs before they left our shores have either had to take huge cuts in pay to work in similar jobs, or they've had to go back to school to learn a new trade. A job that leaves here is no longer here, so no one here can be doing that job. Another misconception is that we enjoy a cheap life. That is far from the truth. We pay hefty taxes and quite high prices for goods here. We have homeless people, people being supported by the government, and many problems you don't bother acknowledging. The fact is, even with all these problems, there is opportunity here. Just because you are born poor doesn't mean you will die poor. Now to answer your Kyoto question. I can't say the exact reasons President Bush doesn't accept it, as I have not followed it very closely lately. The reasons I give are pure speculation on my part. First, it appears the reductions expected of each country are likely unattainable. Some countries can reduce that much quickly, but most can't. Even if everyone reaches their goals, the benefit to the atmosphere is minute. From the comments I have heard from the President on this agreement, he is in favor of finding other ways to clean up the world. He isn't saying reduction shouldn't happen, he's only saying why promise something you know you cannot do, plus knowing all along it makes very little difference. Believe it or not, we do have hybrid cars, our cars do have to pass yearly emissions inspections, and fossil fuels are used to heat less and less American homes now. Most factories now have an employee that their only job is to monitor emissions from the plant, and report them to the EPA. Huge fines are leveled against factories that emit more than they are allowed. So it's not like we are doing nothing, even though we haven't signed on with the Kyoto agreement. Next, to the person with the comments on the USA dropping the nuclear bombs on Japan, you need to study your history a bit more. You are living in a fantasy world if you believe what you typed. Believe it or not, we didn't start that one either. From the sounds of it, all of you believe our lives here are right out of a tv show. Just because we love our country and will fight to defend it, you think we live in palaces and attend parties every day. Fact of the matter is, I work over 60 hours per week to support my family. That is the norm here...you work many hours to pay for it all. And lastly, for the Native American comments-suck an egg. I have many ancestors and relatives from the Cherokee Nation. And I haven't lived in a teepee and my kids were born in a hospital. So even Indians can accept progress.

Posted by: Mona at November 23, 2004 11:32 PM (J7nZh)

137 Rodders, if you think this started out as a few females hating England, you need to read all the posts. Make all the comments you want. Personally attacking us will get you the same results. So, go drink some tea or something else productive.

Posted by: Mary at November 23, 2004 11:36 PM (J7nZh)

138 Ok Mona, thanks for replying, looks like we will have to agree to disagree, whilst I accept your points about the US losing jobs to developing countries, in my opinion, people living in the west on welfare are STILL better off than lots of the people big business exploits in third world countries. Would YOU swap places with them??? Or, would you rather stay where you are, only being there through the accident of birth. I certainly consider myself fortunate to be a UK citizen, but I wouldn't deny anybody of any nationality the right to come to the UK. Nobody can dictate the country into which they are born. I know when I spent a short time in my teens on welfare in the UK, even then I wouldn't have gone to any developing country to work hard & long in a sweatshop in return for (probably even then) a lower standard of living. As you say, at least in the west we usually have the option to retrain and find alternative employment...As regards Kyoto, you may well be correct when you speculate that the aims of the treaty are unrealistic & benefits to the environment would be minute, but, at least the rest of the developed world has taken a small step in the right direction...the US doesn't want ot commit itself to even that, as it doesn't want to upset it's own eco-unfriendly companies, for fear of damaging profits. Which, in my own personal point of view is short sighted & irresponsible. The rest of the developed world agrees on this point, as they have all signed the treaty, which leads to a general feeling that america is arrogant & always does what it wants...so, damn everybody else.

Posted by: bradley the crossed eyed bear at November 24, 2004 04:51 AM (SgQqe)

139 I don't hate the British! What I DO hate are the poor representatives of Britian who have come onto this blo and personally attacked me for my views on how I feel this war should be handled. I am NOT against the country as a whole. COOqarUK, on another blog, ended up calling me a "stupid fucking bitch" and was thrown off the blog. He subsequently kept making up different monikers to be able to continue posting his rantings and insults. I got a bad taste in my mouth after that, because of him. He ended up losing everyone's respect and he lost his credibility by turning into nothing more than a blithering idiot making vulgar and sexist remarks against anyone who disagreed with him. THAT is why I am perceived to be a "female hating the British". I support MY leader and Britian's leader wholeheartedly in this war.

Posted by: Laura at November 24, 2004 09:17 AM (ptOpl)

140 ok laura point taken..but please let me reassure you the majority of British people also support Mr Blair ..You will always get the pacifist dickheads that will tell you that war is unnecessary ....dont let them wind you up

Posted by: Rodders at November 24, 2004 12:53 PM (PZir7)

141 Too late, Rodders, they already have, but whether I'm right or wrong, when a person savagely attacks another for their views and resorts to name calling in the vilest sense of the word, then they have lost all respect and whatever credibility their arguments may have held. The only reason I let it get to me, is because I, personally, was affected by the 9/11 attacks. Most others only talk about it, but I lost people there and have friends and family who lost people there. The anger, rage and hatred for a group of people who caused this is still very much present. I cannot apologize for those feelings, even now. I pity no "innocent civilians"...I only care about our soldiers right now. Every war has had casualties of innocents, it's a known fact and cannot be argued. But, to savagely hogtie, blindfold, and behead innocent people for no apparent reason makes no sense to me, and it is for this I wish revenge, in whatever methods it can be attained.

Posted by: Laura at November 24, 2004 06:57 PM (ptOpl)

142 Yo, Laura! If the above post is a thinly-veiled dig towards me, have a look back up the blog...my initial "insults" were generalised towards the US, not personal in nature...it was YOU who resorted to telling me that I was a "terrorist loving piece of foreign shit" (I'm not, by the way...I just don't agree with the official reasons given for the war & STILL don't think the invasion of Iraq will "solve" anything in the long-term) ...and then in another later post you told me to "fuck off" ...it was only then that I went had my rant towards you....YOU started the personal name calling...

Posted by: Big bad brad at November 25, 2004 04:04 AM (SgQqe)

143 Yo, Laura.... If the above post is a thinly-veiled dig at me, let me remind you that firstly any insults delivered by me were not personal in nature, they were directed in general terms towards your country. It was YOU who first called me "a terrorist loving piece of foreign shit" (I'm NOT by the way...I just dont agree with the official reasons given for the war, and also, I don't think this invasion of Iraq will solve anything in the longer term - just my opinion, which obviously differs to your own) ...then in a later post you told me to "fuck off" - it was only then that I responded with some low-life abuse of my own...THOSE ARE THE FACTS.

Posted by: big bad brad at November 25, 2004 04:10 AM (SgQqe)

144 ooops....double-posted!!!....sorry, website was slow...I do believe you also had this problem earlier in the thread, laura....SEE...we DO have something in common, you just don't want to admit it...LOL. :0)

Posted by: double-vision at November 25, 2004 04:18 AM (SgQqe)

145 YO RODDERS! The majority of us brits support what is going on, do we? I'd say it's a pretty close run thing... "Half of British people believe the war in Iraq was unjustified, a survey for the BBC suggests. Almost three quarters of those asked thought the worldwide opinion of Britain had worsened in the light of events in the past two to three years. Some 46% of the 1,001 Britons questioned by ICM for BBC Breakfast said they were now more afraid of terrorism than they were a year ago. However, 48% thought British troops needed to remain in Iraq. Gender split More women - 55% - than men - 36% - said their fear of terrorism had grown. But opinion was divided on whether Tony Blair was right to say that British troops should stay in Iraq until the job there was done. POLL RESULTS 50% thought the Iraq war unjustified 46% were more frightened of terrorism 72% thought view of Britain had worsened 48% thought troops should finish job in Iraq Just under half - 48% - said this was the right thing to do and 41% said it was wrong. Women's views tended to differ from men's, with 58% of men agreeing with the prime minister as opposed to 38% of women. Liberal Democrat foreign affairs spokesman Sir Menzies Campbell said the poll showed the deep division that existed in the UK before the fall of Saddam Hussein continued today. "

Posted by: Bbbbbbbbbbrad..... at November 25, 2004 04:32 AM (SgQqe)

146 Hey Cooq, Brad, whatever name you go by hourly. Why ARE you constantly changing your name? Anyway, the vile and sexist comments you resorted to, towards the end of our debates on the Bigley blog were far worse than anything I called you. Why else would Rusty ban you from the blogs and not me?! Why else have others complained about you as well? Seems to go far beyond any beef with just me. In any event, I'll well past that. I hope you are too. ;-)

Posted by: Laura at November 25, 2004 09:49 AM (ptOpl)

147 Ok Laura 1. why do I keep changing my name? the answer to that is "why not" ? the name "brad" appears in all my posts (with the exception of the last), so it's pretty obvious who I am throughout this thread.... 2. I keep hearing you go on about this "CooquarUK" guy? I genuinely dont know who you are talking about, I can assure you He and I are not one and the same. The first time I visited this site was on this thread. Yes, I overstepped the mark with my remarks about you and Al-zarquawi...but then, you had just told me to fuck off!! So, I'm willing to live and let live on that basis... 3. My summary of the situation is this: you are passionately pro-war, and i'm just as passionately against it on the basis of how & when it started: I can respect your opinion & nobody recieves any personal insults from me, as long as I am not subjected to the same. However, I reserve the right to criticise your country. Likewise, I will listen to & accept criticism of my own country (I proved this by agreeing with various "anti-queen" posts on here) Anyway....rant over....take care!!!

Posted by: brad at November 25, 2004 10:45 AM (SgQqe)

148 I didn't become "pro war" until my hometown was savagely attacked. I have since changed my opinions and views about war since then. I just want justice done to the savages that did that, and for all the other atrocities our boys, your boys, and those of innocent Iraqi people that were slaughtered for no reason.

Posted by: Laura at November 25, 2004 01:19 PM (ptOpl)

149 Hi again... Well, of course I sympathise with anybody who has suffered personally as a direct consequence of war, anybody who has died or been injured needlessly and innocently has my utmost sympathy. As do any relatives or friends of the injured or deceased. For the record, after 9/11,I could fully understand America's need to lash out & I was in favour of the invasion of Afghanistan and the overthrow of the Taliban, who were sub-humans from the dark-ages... It was also most likely to be where Mr. Bin Laden would have been hiding, and I have no quarrel with America's need to bring him to justice. What I have issues with is the reasoning by our leaders for the subsequent invasion of Iraq: there has been NO w.m.d. found to date (even though Bush & Blair assured us they existed already, or this was imminent). I find it unforgivable that we have effectively been LIED to by our leaders...I wonder how many dead marines would still be in favour of the war on solely this basis, if they still had a voice? Another thing...there has been no proven evidence of any Al-queda - Iraq "coalition"... everybody can go on arguing against me to the contrary, but these are the FACTS as they stand, 18 months after the invasion. Our leaders then try to justify the invasion on the basis that Saddam was a tyrant who killed his own people...I agree that he was a despicable tyrant, but an example of misguided US foreign policy was the fact that you SUPPORTED him during the Iraq /Iran war of the 80's, when he was well into his reign. There wasn't much US moaning about human rights abuses against the Iraqi Kurds back then...you certainly didnt feel the need to invade Iraq then? As for the chap who said Margaret Hassan wouldn't be dead if the US/UK hadn't invaded Iraq...well, unpalatable as it may seem - it's true. The lunatics who captured her wouldn't have had any motive to capture her if we hadn't have been in iraq. They didnt feel the need to capture her in the previous 30 years she lived & worked there, did they? I must admit, I cannot see why they felt the need to kill her though, she was a shining example - but that is what we are dealing with here: desperate & mindless barbarians, backed into a corner. On the reasoning for war,a year and a half ago I thought at the time that the U.N. weapons inspectors should have been given more time....and if they had been, we now know of course they still wouldn't have found any W.M.D. and on that basis, a lot of innocent lives (on both sides) would have been spared. Yes, the Iraqi's would still have been living under a despot, but if you are justifying the war solely on that basis, then why didnt you (for example) declare war on China in 1989 after Tiannamen Square? Answer: China have nukes & won't stand for American interference. So, the "make the world a better place" argument being used as the sole reason for the war is a bit weak as well, but that is only my opinion of course... I just fear for the future. Pressure is beginning on Iran now...apparently the intelligence is "rock solid" this time that Iran may be developing nukes....but where have we heard that before?!? If Iran needs checking over, let's get the U.N. inspectors in, let them do their job TO IT'S CONCLUSION & report back...and PLEASE, if we feel the need to invade anymore countries, wait until the U.N. security council agrees a majority & a timetable for action next time?! That way, we get a real coalition, with majority support. Not unilateralism, which is more or less what we have now.

Posted by: Brad at November 25, 2004 02:42 PM (SgQqe)

150 Didn't Sadam keep the extremist groups out of his country? Don't most of those groups come from other countries. Did they return after Sadam was defeated? Or have I got it wrong? I thought women in Iraq had good education and rights to jobs in high places. When you have psychotic groups that cut off innocent people's heads then it's not as if a country can have a soft leader to keep them out. Aren't things worse in Iraq than they were before? A man on a donkey against a super power, Bin laden, is still free and the psychotic extremist groups who aren't fit to be called humans seem to be doing what they like and recruiting more people. What is going on? What was the war about anyway? The Un said Sadam didn't have any WMDs as they checked before Bush declared war. Margaret Hassan seemed happy enough to live in Iraq and wasn't under any threat before the invasion of Iraq. In what way has invading Iraq helped anybody in any way? Suzy, in England.

Posted by: Suzy at November 28, 2004 07:04 PM (SgQqe)

151 While I took the Thanksgiving holidays off from my computer, I now can't resist replying to Brad the Cross Legged Bear or whatever it was. I really don't think anyone would trade places with anyone in a third world country. I really think you are confused though. The majority of jobs, not all mind you, but MOST of the jobs that left the USA have gone to Mexico or China. Neither of those are third world countries. Again I ask the question...if the American companies were not in the places they are, where would these people be making any living at all?? I do not consider it an accident of birth that I was born here. I have ancestors who left Europe, as well as Native American ancestors. It has been quite by choice that my family has stayed in America for over 400 years. My European ancestors helped settle Jamestown and were some of the first settlers to arrive here. My Native American ancestors were here long before any Europeans arrived. There are many problems in the world we live in today. #1 is terrorism. When the USA was attacked, that ended our 'wait and see' approach to anything concerning our safety. Where we perceive a threat, it has to be taken seriously or we could have 9/11 all over again. We know that should anything like that happen again, it will be us to us and us alone to pick up the pieces and go on. Last time proved how much help we'd get from the world. Therefore, since so much of the world is hostile or downright hates the USA, any threat cannot be seen as anything but dangerous. Just because our way of life allows big businesses to exist, that is not anything that our government or our people can control. If we try to control it, we are lead into a Marxist or communist way of life. Everyone claims not to want that type of government in their countries, but you expect us to allow government to control big businesses. That is not the way of life we want any more than anyone else does. The USA is not the only country that has big businesses. One Far Eastern country has quite a few themselves - Japan. Plus, these terrorists we are dealing with are not goat herders who happened to get a gun given to them by a passing stranger. These are people that are very wealthy people. These are people who have plenty of money to fund terrorist activities, and can do so without even having to work. Iraq was seen as a threat, as one of two things was going to happen. It is a known fact that at one time Sadam had WMD's. He was planning to build them again as soon as they convinced everyone they were going to be nice and play fair, and the world turned their backs for just one second. When that happened, either the terrorists were going to become Sadam's best friends, or his worst enemies. Either way, they would have access, or close access to those WMD's. I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to know where those WMD's would first be used. It is easy for all other countries to sit and judge or question our motives. We have no desire to take over other countries for our own gain, nor to take over the world. We have other countries adjoining two borders. When we were attacked, our view of the world changed. No longer could we wait and see about anything. We hate to send our soldiers anywhere there is danger. But when we get up in the morning, go to work, and never come home, because of what 19 wicked men with 4 airplanes did, any threat of that happening again must be stopped. If you don't agree, I'm sorry, but you did not watch on 9/11 as your parents, sisters, brothers, neighbors, children, or best friends died the horrible death those people suffered. All for the sin of going to work to make a living. They went to work in the buildings that terrorists see as a symbol of American business. I can assure you, no one who died that day had any thought of American might on their minds. And it wasn't just a few people that paid that price just for going to work that morning. We had no one backed into a corner on 9/11, so the argument that we are to blame for whose heads the terrorists cut off is about as stupid as any I've heard yet. Which is worse, having your head cut off or burning alive? Or jumping from the 100th floor of a burning building to keep from burning alive? Terrorists are the ones committing these acts, not us.

Posted by: Mona at November 29, 2004 10:11 PM (J7nZh)

152 Way to go Mona! Couldn't have said it better myself. I was afraid you'd been chased away but wanted to reply as soon as I saw your post pop up. I have a question for anyone caring to answer it. Whose fault is it that 9/11 happened? I'm curious to hear how many say the USA just got what it deserved. Do any of you realize that in the Muslim countries of the world, there were celebrations when that happened? Do any of you realize that terrorist supporters right here in the USA threw parties to celebrate 9/11? I know that happened, as a family who lived not too far from me threw a big party. Ragheads arrived from far and wide and partied the night away until someone called the FBI and they went and arrested several of them, as the party was full of men who were already being hunted as a result of terrorist activities. So don't try to tell us the world sympathized. You were just glad it wasn't happening to you. Let America deal with it, it's their problem. We always get that attitude, so why should we expect any less of any of you now??? For my queen comment, I do have one for tonight...I think the sour look on her face comes from smelling herself. Being such a rusty old fart can't be odorless.

Posted by: Mary at November 29, 2004 10:25 PM (J7nZh)

153 The people celebrating in the streets wasn't from 9/11. A blogger said it was a propaganda film shown that was actually filmed during the Gulf War!

Posted by: Laura at November 30, 2004 09:27 AM (ptOpl)

154 Hi all (again) thought this thread had been put to bed, but in response to Mona, I agree with some points you have made, and I still disagree with others (not going to go into details about what and why cos I cant be bothered anymore)so... I won't make another LONG post trying to convince you otherwise, as you are quite clearly brainwashed, well...at least to some degree....can I ask you this? Can you take off your rose-coloured spectacles and admit to anything that your wonderful country might have got even SLIGHTLY wrong over the last 200 odd years?

Posted by: BradleyOystermouth at December 01, 2004 04:24 PM (SgQqe)

155 C'mon Brad the Toaster Mouth, you can do better than that! Why not admit you cannot make yourself look at it from the side of the USA, as you are afraid it all might make sense to you. But then again...who do you irritate by agreeing?

Posted by: mary at December 01, 2004 09:31 PM (J7nZh)

156 Mary, ... even the lunatic Arab fundermentalists didnt hate our (the UK's) foreign policy to the degree that they felt the need to fly themselves and 4 hijacked planes into any of OUR tall buildings (that may all change now the UK is shootin' from the hip along with the good ol' US of A)....Methinxs the fundamentalists don't like your foreign policy, which is what i've been saying all along, and what drives them to do these things. I think they are pissed off that in 1948 Israel was created at the expense of Palestine, and the US doesnt seem to quite hold Israel (when it is so obviously guilty of wrongdoing) to account in quite the same as everybody else. I rest my case.

Posted by: BBBBBrad at December 02, 2004 07:43 AM (SgQqe)

157 The United Kingdom exists today through the courage and fortitude of the people that fought and in many cases died for the principle of freedom. The United Kingdom is composed of several nations and principalites, not just England. Without the support of the United States of America during both World Wars the UK might have been absorbed into a brutal autocratic super-state that viewed only a certain skin/hair/height/eye colour as being sufficient grounds not to enslaved, brutalised or gassed. Six million people of the Jewish race were killed, men, women and children, by human beings self absorbed in resolving the hell of a previous World War. Make no mistake, please, the nation of Israel is the root that grew the 'Old Testament' from which sprang the 'Koran' and provided the foundation apon which Christianity could be conceived. Do not 'mess' with Israel [or do so at your own great cost]. We will all die, whether it be one day, several days, one week, a month, one year several years, a decade or several decades. We each one of us will not reach a stage when we can stand up and say "i am right on my own account" I am Scottish not English! my family fought in both World Wars and lost generations through it. I am ashamed that we did not stop the sufferings of the people of Israel in the concentration camps. My Uncle at 19, as a bomber pilot was sent on bombing missions ultimately on suicide missions ["gardening in Lorient"] where he died [three weeks floating dead in the sea and attended when beached by the brave French resistance fighters]. The United States of America was founded on a principle of freedom. Yes, the United States of America has great evil as does all countries. She also has proved through some of the worst times in modern history that she is willing and able to stand up for what is right and fight with great honour and courage to pursue a struggle that is based on liberty and freedom. Too many that criticise the United States of America do so because they have the freedom and liberty to do so, thanks in no small way to the sacrifice made by the USA. Criticism costs little where you have the liberty to express it, it costs a lot when you may suffer slow torture or death. If changes are needed then begin with yourself first, before crying like a defiant child blaming a principle instrument of your succour. Gordon McGinn Scottish not English

Posted by: McGinn, Scotland at December 08, 2004 04:01 PM (y7Ltt)

158 Margarat Hassan was not murdered by Iraqi's or muslim fundamentalists, but by the secret service of Israel. If you go to any of the legitimate bipartisan middle eastern news organizations, you'll see that this is true. Israel claims publicly to have only 1000 military personel in Iraq, yet they also have 37 rabbis, which would indicate many more. It is well known amongst arabs and iraqis that the CIA and Isreali secret service are present in Iraq.

Posted by: mondo at December 11, 2004 04:50 AM (vQ8Ek)

159 Brad Brad, you and your small little world. If everything was civilized it'd be a great world. John has seen reality. I have seen reality. You can't just say, oh through diplomacy, all will be solved. How will you understand freedom is not free? Have you seen the memorial statue? Walk through, and maybe you'll get an epiphany. The reason you have these rights is because of the soldiers. Margaret Hassan is one of the modest women I have ever seen. I am deeply troubled by her death. You on the other hand, believe you can negotiate with terrorists. You do not see reality. People like you are the disgrace of this world. Please wake up, and join the marine corps.

Posted by: Peter at December 18, 2004 11:07 AM (8T+7E)

160 "Islam makes it incumbent on all adult males, provided they are not disabled or incapacitated, to prepare themselves for the conquest of countries so that the writ of Islam is obeyed in every country in the world. . . . But those who study Islamic Holy War will understand why Islam wants to conquer the whole world. . . . Those who know nothing of Islam pretend that Islam counsels against war. Those [who say this] are witless. Islam says: Kill all the unbelievers just as they would kill you all! Does this mean that Muslims should sit back until they are devoured by [the unbelievers]? Islam says: Kill them, put them to the sword and scatter [their armies]Â…. Islam says: Whatever good there is exists thanks to the sword and in the shadow of the sword! People cannot be made obedient except with the sword! The sword is the key to Paradise, which can be opened only for the Holy Warriors! There are hundreds of other [Qur'anic] psalms and Hadiths [sayings of the Prophet] urging Muslims to value war and to fight. Does all this mean that Islam is a religion that prevents men from waging war? I spit upon those foolish souls who make such a claim." Ayatollah Khomeini Now anyone, Democrats included, who think that these lying bastards will ever say anything truthful upon which any hopes or efforts for lasting peace can be based are deceived and pathetic people who will lead themselves only to death and the destruction of democracy forever. This opponent deserves no consideration as operating under the same underpinning and attitudes upon which we ourselves for the most part were raised and educated. They are a primitive and morally degenerate people in their own wickedly perverse fashion. They can be given no quarter, for they will only laugh at any mercy we offer. But what is most obvious now, with many examples, is that they are dedicated, inveterate, cunning and pathological liars, who cannot be believed, and that fact puts the entire so-called "Good Muslims" at severe risk for credibility. If we can trust nothing that they say as truth, we cannot trust them at all.

Posted by: Shep at December 19, 2004 12:40 AM (XsnCL)

161 I believe that we invaded Iraq because of the strategic implications of letting other industrialized nations control the flow of oil rather than the US. Lets face it folks, without oil, the American war machine withers and dies (Israel can tell you about that) . I know that if I where part of the militaryÂ’s 200+ IQ think tanks (yes they do exist), oil locations on the planet, and their control would most likely be a primary factor in maintaining military and industrial superiority within this limited gas / fuel powered industrial age. Anyone who says different is either got their head up their ass or is trying to stick you head up your ass!

Posted by: dogbreath at December 20, 2004 02:47 PM (U7jt0)

162 Lying arabs,

Posted by: peter at December 21, 2004 05:05 AM (htmLk)

163 I have long since stopped weighing up the rights and wrongs of this "war". I would much rather live in a "Western" civilisation - be it the UK or the USA. If these towel heads ever took over the world (and that is their objective) I would chop my own fucking head off. I disagree with their morals, I disagree with their religion, I disagree with their entire philosophy of life. If these scum want to make their own region Islam personified then that's fine with me but when they bring it upon the civilised world (i.e. 9/11)... then that is time to just retaliate and answer questions later. Wipe this scum out. By all means worship God, Allah, The Easter Bunny or whatever shit you want but don't make people die for it and if you are the kind that makes people die for it, be assured that you will be hunted down and you will die by the civilised world. Sometimes censorship turns to war. And the next time you're aiming a rock against a tank, ask why that should be. The USA is but a baby in the great timescale of the world yet Islam is at least a grand-dad. Living by Islam brings you a rock and living by capitalism brings you a satellite targetted rocket... Hmmm... maybe living by Allah is not as powerful as living by a rational mind after all. I want this war to pick up speed. I want religion to die tomorrow. If it can't die tomorrow then I want people to realise it no longer has the power to change the world. God (Allah etc) hasn't spoken for quite some time now. Let's face it... there's just us. Humans. We can either spend our lives killing in the name of this shit or decide to help each other and each live a decent and peacful life. To all Extremist Muslims out there... get the family together and watch Disney's "Jungle Book" one afternoon or go visit your parents then go out to work producing for your country. It might not get your name in the history books but it's actually not a bad life and no one gets killed. If you're still hell bent on being famous, write some music, draw some pictures, build a bridge, offer some peaceful philosophy on life and how to live it without resorting to beheading anyone who disagrees. Basically, learn to love, learn to live, learn not to seek the path of destruction as a means to progress (which in your case means regress). People like the mod cons, they aint gonna want to regress to the dark ages. Onwards and upwards, progress, progress, progress... live and let live or die like the dogs your actions prove you to be. Do this now or do this later but it's the only way forward.

Posted by: Red Devil at December 22, 2004 06:14 PM (QfHcT)

164 They are known as Imams, Clerics & Mullahs, we are known as infidels. In general we are unclean, not to be trusted & looked down upon by both the Sunii & Shiite Muslims. Specifically, we are hated by many of the Shiite fundamentalists. There are hundreds of Clerics who plant seeds of hatred towards the infidels & these seeds by the hundreds of thousands are spread across countless square miles of deserts & mountains. These seeds have been producing & multiplying since even before the days of the Crusaders. I lived in this area for almost nine years, I know the Muslim beliefs, I mingled with the people, I came to admire & even love some of them. I know that I still could have been killed over there strictly on the whim of an extremist Cleric even though I was not "an ugly American". I am not a dove or some radical protestor, I proudly served during the Viet Nam era in the U.S. Navy. This "war" is going to be worse than Viet Nam, not in human casualties but merely because we did NOT LEARN from history. Please contact our President & other elected representatives, urge them to cut our losses & get out, NOW. The only other option is to take over all the oil fields in Iraq, protect the fields, ship the oil to America & tell OPEC to kiss our all American _ _ _ !!!

Posted by: scott at February 05, 2005 11:53 PM (Bgk8j)

165 SOMETHING IS COMING...

Posted by: Christian at February 23, 2005 05:51 PM (oTitt)

166 Sick, Sick, Sick , Sick!!!!! fuckin sick!!! thats al i have to say

Posted by: Jon at May 02, 2005 09:25 PM (F1nba)

167 Replying to Brad Loveburger III, you should pull a tour of duty in Iraq and meet some of the citizens there. I met many wonderful people there that, while they do not want the US military in their country for an extended period of time, they are truly grateful that we liberated them from a tyrant like Saddam Hussein. Remember it was only sixty years ago that if weren't for the US, you would be speaking German rather than English and saying Heil Hitler. One thing I forgot...it would seem most British are opposed to anyone fighting for their freedom from a tyrant as it happened with your American colonies over 200 years ago.

Posted by: William at May 02, 2005 11:46 PM (YIsTa)

168 You are all the nastiest and most vile people I have ever seen. No wonder we got canned. All of you are BUNCH of DUMBASS SHITS. Especially that EVIL BITCH FUCK LAURA and anyone who is a Nasty Fucker!!None of you fuckers are UNITED at all; you patriot wanna-bes...Especially that ignorant fuck Laura. How can you dare call yourself an American when you speak so disrespectfully to your own neighbor. You had it coming BITCH! You should support those who have been hurt in all of this instead of keeping it going you ignorant butch dyke of a cunt!!

Posted by: Connor and Laci at July 23, 2005 12:39 PM (R1pKT)

169 how i cried when i heard the news of margaret i hope them disgusting evil sick bastards suffer pain for the rest of their lives then burn in hell forever what on earth had that innocent lady ever done wrong? i pray for margaret still even today that she is at peace in paradise, dont worry margaret them bastards will get their commupence r.i.p. x x x katie

Posted by: katie myers at August 12, 2005 12:29 PM (sYwqj)

170 those bastards who did it will meet there match what goes around comes around hopefully soon. i hope they die painfully

Posted by: kevin o'quigley at August 13, 2005 07:03 PM (KF1fi)

171 those bastards who did it will meet there match what goes around comes around hopefully soon. i hope they die painfully.

Posted by: kevin o'quigley at August 13, 2005 07:04 PM (KF1fi)

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13 Zero Days Since Last Beheading Video, and why Kevin Sites is a traitor

UPDATE: I spoke too soon. Margaret Hassan has been murdered in a new video tape.

I has been 13 days since the last time terrorists released a beheading video. The terrorists are on the run. For the past several months they have released a new snuff film at least once a week, sometimes more. With increased US pressure on terrorist strongholds like Fallujah, it seems that the groups responsible no longer have the luxery of producing propaganda films aimed at weakening the resolve of the Allies and at showing the Iraqi people that we are not invincible. This is a good sign. Keep them on the defensive.

Our campaign in Fallujah has uncovered the depths of the morally bankrupt system that is the jihadis dream. Posters were found throughout the city which "listed religious infractions, such as women not covering their heads or men selling music, which would be met with death. " Prisons, torture chambers, dens of beheading, the corpses of the exectued, and even a mutilated body show what life under terrorist rule is like.

While an anti-American propagandist at the Associated Press claims that US Marines were intentionally shooting at all civilians trying to flee Fallujah, those poor souls who suffered under the Taliban like rule of the terrorists tell a different story; "some of whom recount how guerilla snipers shot anyone who tried to leave their home once the assault on the city began."

So, while the mainstream press attempts to focus our attention away from the horror of our enemies toward the infractions of a lone Marine in the heat and passion of battle, let's remember to keep some perspective. We prosecute those who kill the unarmed, they reward them. We are ashamed of such behavior, they celebrate it. Our goal is to liberate the individual from oppression, their's is to oppress the individual through coerced obedience.

Ultimately our moral superiority lies in the fact that the system we fight for is better. Every individual soldier is not better than they, but the system for which they fight is.

This brings up an important question: what should Kevin Sites have done with his story on a lone Marine who murdered a wounded insurgent? The answer is simple: he should have reported the incident up the chain of command, period.

By playing the journalistic whore that he is, he has made things much worse for our fighting men and women. Remember Abu Ghraib? This is worse than Abu Ghraib. Abu Ghraib was nothing more than a bunch of childish pranks which offended cultural sensitivities. This was murder.

When the terrorists murder innocent Westerners they go to great lengths to dress them in the garb of Abu Ghraib. Because of the reckless way in which the media portrayed that scandal, many in the Middle East became convinced that the abuse at the infamous prison was just as bad under the US occupation as it was under Saddam Hussein. Abu Ghraib was the turning point. After Abu Ghraib many in Iraq became convinced that since the Americans were equally brutal, they might indeed have been better off under Saddam Hussein--at least under Hussein there was peace.

Kevin Sites, more interested in a Pulitzer than in the lives of American soldiers, has stolen the victory which was Fallujah and handed us defeat. Already, al Jazeera and the Arab News portray the Fallujah assault as one of murder, mass civilian casualties, and a humanitarian nightmare. Add Sites' report to the mix of lies routinely broadcast around the Arab world and what you get is proof positive, in the eyes of many, that the US is exactly as Noam Chomsky describes it: the world's greatest terrorist.

If this is your worldview, then are you not justified in taking up arms against the US? Those who fight us do so because they believe what they see on TV--America is the oppressor; America is killing children in Iraq on a mass scale; America has brought mayhem to the region; America wishes to destroy Islam; and American soldiers are murderers just like Saddam Hussein or any other corrupt regime in the region.

Because Kevin Sites could not control his journalistic instincts, we will see another onslaught of beheadings. The terrorists will find that they have a sympathetic population and will find new places to locate their torture chambers.

More young men will join the insurgency, because what choice does one have when a foreign power brutalizes your nation. More Americans will die as a result.

Kevin Sites, you are a traitor. Kevin Sites, you have murdered our friends and neighbors. Kevin Sites, I hope you rot in hell.

It has been 13 days since the terrorists last released a beheading video. Do not expect another 13 days to pass before the next one.

UPDATE: It has begun. In addition to al Jazeera and Arab News running this as their headline story, NEIN reports that the jihadis have begun to post the video on Islamic bulletin boards.

UPDATE II: Make that Kevin Sites and Chris Matthews--traitors both.

UPDATE III: Via the Big Picture, this from Article 37, paragraph 1, of the Additional Protocol to the Geneva Conventions of August 12, 1949:

It is prohibited to kill, injure or capture an adversary and resort to perfidy. ...
The following acts are examples of perfidy... (b) the feigning of an incapacitation by wounds or sickness

more...

Posted by: Rusty at 09:14 AM | Comments (36) | Add Comment
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1 You seem to be saying that Sites should have covered up (or at least, not reported) the incident. Am I reading you right, Rusty?

Posted by: Boyd at November 16, 2004 10:11 AM (VeBwJ)

2 No, that is not what I'm saying. "he should have reported the incident up the chain of command, period." Not filing a story is not the same as 'covering up'.

Posted by: Rusty at November 16, 2004 10:17 AM (JQjhA)

3 Hi Dr. Shackleford, Thanks for the link. In a way, I'm leaving it up in the air as to the intent of Kevin Sites. I hope we can learn more about him. It is a possibility his stories are spun by his editors. I raise that as a possibility because I simply find it hard to accept that he might be Blue Falconing the soldiers with whom he is embedded. Surely a normal human being would develop enough empathy with the soldiers to consider what the impact of the story and it's approach on those Marine's lives. If he turns out to be impervious to that and only in to self aggrandizement--then your take is right on!

Posted by: Sue Bob at November 16, 2004 10:19 AM (VZjkz)

4 Sorry, but I'm not in the "murder" corner. What about it is murder? Have we forgotten Michael Spann? Actually, sounds like 1 bullet was shot. That's much better restraint than I would have personally had. Have you seen the video (I have to assume you have)?

Posted by: Editor at November 16, 2004 10:21 AM (adpJH)

5 Speaking as both a combat veteran and a Marine let me make one thing clear. Just because a boy, girl, or man is not wearing a uniform does not mean that the term "civilian" as commonoly used in America applies. In the last 7 years a number of homicide bombers In Isreal have been boys and girls under 10. In Vietnam the Commies used really little kids to get close us and then set off grenades. I am sure the "civilians" shot by the Marines were active combatants. Folks I would not classify as civilian just because he had no uniform. And I would kill the b----- myself. My life or his; allways an easy choice for me. Which is why I am able to make these mean statements today. Rod Stanton Cerritos

Posted by: Rod Stanton at November 16, 2004 10:25 AM (a2hGw)

6 While you may feel that just reporting it to the Marine chain-of-command would be the way to handle it, I have to say that accusing Sites of being a traitor is a bit over the top. And I say this as a retired Sailor and the father of a Marine. If this was a Marine shooting an unarmed, severely wounded enemy, it is he who caused the PR problem, not Sites.

Posted by: Boyd at November 16, 2004 10:25 AM (VeBwJ)

7 Creating a problem is one thing, but spreading the news about it will get our boys killed. In war, propaganda is a weapon.

Posted by: Rusty at November 16, 2004 10:27 AM (JQjhA)

8 I just don't see this becoming an enormous story for very long. Nor do I think Abu Ghraib hurt us all that much. It's not as though these creeps need excuses to murder people, and comparison between the way the US deals with the inevitable human failings and the way the enemy does not do so isn't something that people of the Middle East are likely to miss. If they expect perfection of Americans, but still hate us, just how much chance do we have of winning them over anyway? That said, I think it may be useful to start imposing some costs on the press reflecting the fact that we're at war. Even if they can't always be implemented, knowledge that there may be a price to pay for sedition might serve to throw a little icewater on a small fire or two, before they develop into firestorms. It wouldn't cause me any grief were Kevin Sites to suddenly find himself in the middle of a no-man's-land during a battle some day, with no clear idea how he got there. I've seen this video on Canadian TV, and it appears to me that this soldier probably thought he was entering the site of a recent engagement where anyone lying around might be a potential threat. It's also possible that he perceived only two possibilities, a dead insurgent or an insurgent pretending to be dead in order to exercise perfidy. There was a famous case involving British forces in which the Brits fired on and killed a group of enemy waiving a white flag. It turned out that prior to the incident a number of enemy had killed a group of British soldiers while under protection of a surrender flag. I think (although I'm not certain) that the Brits who fired on the white flag were acquitted because the perfidy of the enemy had rendered the white flag an unreliable signal of surrender. What most people don't understand is that this sort of perfidy is also considered a war crime. I suppose it also may matter whether or not the fellow was dead before being shot. Was an autopsy performed to determine the cause and time of death? That might render the whole thing moot, and rob Sites of his journalism award.

Posted by: Demosophist at November 16, 2004 10:46 AM (OtR16)

9 I'm agnostic on weather the soldier is guilty of a war crime or not, but my inclination is that he is. What is important is how it is portrayed in the Arab media. The pictures and video are enough. Such pictures should never be allowed out.

Posted by: Rusty at November 16, 2004 11:05 AM (JQjhA)

10 Creating a problem is one thing, but spreading the news about it will get our boys killed. In war, propaganda is a weapon. I'd have a great deal less problem with the idea that Sites is blameless if I felt that those ready to excuse him actually understood the above principle. Alas, I don't think they do. My problem with Rusty's position is simply that I don't think it can be implemented in an airtight manner, as it was during WWII or other conflicts. I also think that if you're going to imbed reporters in a military action these kinds of things will get reported. I guess I just don't know where I stand here. I'm not convinced that this incident reflects all that badly on the US for lots of reasons, but I am worried that something else might. I don't think it'd be a bad idea to have some sort of potential penalty for reporting information useful to the enemy propaganda machine, and feel that our press is just a little too complacent about that possibility. If the press proves to be of significant service to the enemy, especially if it mis-reports an incident such as this, I can see them ending up at risk on the battlefield. It would be very easy for soldiers to "misdirect" them during an engagement. It might even be enough to bar a reporter from the battlefield. From an organizational perspective these are all group pathologies, and it were far better that we operated without them. But we don't live in an ideal world.

Posted by: Demosophist at November 16, 2004 11:16 AM (OtR16)

11 I'd like to know why the media is so hellbent on portraying us as the enemy, and not the enemies themselves? Any propaganda journalism should be outlawed. These people who report this shit ought to be thrown out of the US. That is anti-American to portray our soldiers this way. Rusty, on the one hand, you said that there hasn't been a beheading in two weeks, inferring that we are winning; on the other hand, you said that this video of the unarmed person being shot by a Marine will surely set off a new round of beheadings? Huh? Anyway, who knows if the bastard was *really* unarmed? If he was playing dead? So many possibilities; and only one alternative if the Marine gave it a second thought. It was either the Marine or the Iraqi. Guess what my choice is?

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 11:33 AM (ptOpl)

12 Apparently the video shows her being shot, NOT beheaded. Someone may have already poited this out, but I don't have time to read all the comments. "al-Jazeera said it had been given a videotape showing the shooting of a blindfolded woman thought to be Ms. Hassan" http://tinyurl.com/6he9o

Posted by: Homer Bombeck at November 16, 2004 01:12 PM (/+d9J)

13 My thoughts are with the American soldier, he did the right thing. I am not there, I haven't seen what he has, I haven't been through what he has. He may have been under the impression that the bad guy may have been concealing a deadly explosive, as I believe other "wounded" Iraquis have. In my view he should shoot first and ask questions later.... I am sure his family would rather visit him in prison than a cemetery. I am a Brit, I feel it's either the bad guys or us (Yanks & Brits). All our lads are doing a great job, I for one, am very proud of you. Dotty

Posted by: Dotty at November 16, 2004 01:18 PM (siFAl)

14 For you to call the actions of the marine in question a murder then you are completely insane. I have enjoyed reading your website for several months now but for you to refer to this incident as a murder makes you sound like someone from Democratic Underground. This is a war for christ's sake.

Posted by: Robert at November 16, 2004 01:21 PM (db8zB)

15 I am an American Soldier. I have served once already in support of Operation Enduring Freedom. I am eager for the opportunity to serve again. Any reporter that they send out with us will receive the ass-beating he richly deserves and then will be sent packing. Since he won't be able to climb into my mind, he will be unable to know what I am thinking or feeling the moment I decide that an enemy who stands before me and wants me to die catches a bullet from my M-4 Carbine. The only way that the reporter avoids an ass-beating is if he works for Fox News, Drudge Report, or Rusty himself.

Posted by: David at November 16, 2004 01:37 PM (xfI1/)

16 If anyone has any hints on how to get this scumbag Sites' press credentials pulled, I'll make a donation, write a letter or place a call. I can't stand the thought that GIs might risk their lives to protect some scumbag shooting "gotcha video" at their expense. Why on earth don't we have military reporters? At least they know what a prisoner is. And they wouldn't shoot video that could be used as al-jazeera recruiting tools.

Posted by: avenuebalum at November 16, 2004 02:18 PM (nTEvo)

17 POINT: On question of murder. An enemy soldier not in uniform? According to the Geneva Convention the killing of enemy combatants out of uniform is legal. They call themselves an Army. By self admission we should be killing every one of them. I could swear I heard someone yelling (He's faking) before a shot was fired. Our soldiers are supposed to take chances around a bunch of beheading asshole terrorists/insurgents? Bullshit! On Kevin Sikes. The news media has their Kevin Sikes. We have our trr. Think about it.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 16, 2004 02:42 PM (UkXdy)

18 I say they should let the insurgents have him he'd make for a great beheading video. The marines should have no obligation in nursemaiding him.

Posted by: Andre at November 16, 2004 02:56 PM (hD5mx)

19 Very good points. The more I think about it and the more I hear your arguements the less I am inclined to think of it as murder-in the strictest sense. It may just have been bad judgement in the context of the normal confusion and haze of battle. Let's suppose, for a moment, that it was murder. Making this assumption, releasing the video was still wrong. If you check out al Jazeera's site right now the headlines show the images. They won't show terrorists killing civilians, but when a Marine does it....This is what Muslims see every day. It is why they hate us. They truly believe we are murderers. Man I'm pissed off!!!

Posted by: Rusty at November 16, 2004 02:57 PM (JQjhA)

20 I have seen the video. Shots rung out but they totally blocked any images of the wounded Iraqi being shown shot point blank. It is known these bastards are armed, whether it's a gun they're toting, or explosives. Marines have walked into piles of dead bodies, only to discover booby traps among the dead. How are they to know whether this wounded guy (if he indeed WAS wounded) whether or not he is hiding a gun or an explosive? They are there to FIGHT and DEFEND, not to judge who lives and who dies. In my opinion, anyone who was stupid enough to remain there is an insurgent. If they aren't technically, then tough. They had their chance to get the hell out, along with the 200-300,000 or so neighbors of theirs.

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 03:06 PM (ptOpl)

21 Hell mosques have been turned into military headquarters. So we should hit them hard, KABOOM type deal over there in Iraq. Strap that Kevin moron on a 1000lbs bomb and drop him on one. Kill two birds with one stone. Or one twit and one bird, depends how you view it.

Posted by: Andre at November 16, 2004 04:11 PM (hD5mx)

22 I watched the video on al-jazeera the man was lying on his back when the soldier said he's f...... faking it then shot him at point blank range. IT also looks as if they are pointing out another older man who had been shot with arrows pointing to bullet marks on a wall that didnt appear to be there initially when they entered. So because i dont understand the lingo and i dont know what they are saying it looked to me as if the were implying he had been alive but wounded when they arrived but was also shot dead. If anyone can make out what they are saying or if i have just got this all wrong please let me know. They seem to be making a meal out of this anyway.

Posted by: L R at November 16, 2004 06:56 PM (SgQqe)

23 It's not murder, its business. Marines are under no obligation to capture or treat unlawful combatants illegally using sanctuary. Furthermore, from a tactical standpoint, Marines are under no obligation to subjugate the safety of themselves, their comrades, and members of the press to a wounded or seemingly immobilized unlawful combatant. Clearly Sites/Matthews/MSM hacks et al are traitorous scum, but this is not news. This Marine might have saved his own life and the lives of everybody on the scene by his decisive action. That is not murder. That is business. Froggy

Posted by: Froggy at November 16, 2004 07:25 PM (E1hup)

24 Well done Froggy, well done.

Posted by: grreyrooster at November 16, 2004 10:15 PM (YpcV2)

25 I'm not really as inclined to blame Sites as I am to blame MSNBC. Remember, he just reported what he sees, they edit out the ambushes and the booby trapped dead bodies and pull a clip that appears to be something evil and hype it up. If you were to read Daily KOS's or Atrios' take they would have you believe that Bush and Rumsfeld gave the order to hold summary executions. We know where the politics of NBC lie. If they can't have a democrat president they'll do their best to get the republican we have impeached. I believe that to be their ultimate goal.

Posted by: Jeremy at November 17, 2004 12:56 AM (PJ4Iq)

26 This war is a war fought in living rooms all over the world. This incident is a further example that the MSM is the real enemy and needs to be dealt with accordingly. I think that the embeds have been, on the whole a good idea, but all of their material needs to go through censorship and they should not be entitled to retain any permanent records thereof or to make any public statements about it without being subject to censorship. As for al-Jazzera, Al-Reuters, al-BBC and the rest of the arab media. Anybody with a camera should be treated like any terrorist with an AK47 or an RPG.

Posted by: Robert Schwartz at November 17, 2004 10:06 AM (wkd/n)

27 I'll open the bidding at $100,000 for identifiable remains of Kevin Sites.

Posted by: Noram Sinned at November 17, 2004 10:11 AM (4ZVUI)

28 The ironic part about Sites is that they are claiming that he was a "battle veteran"...where I wonder? Why not just bar reporters period, and let one of the soldiers do the recordings? I heard the soldiers can tell the reporters to get the hell out of their area. Why did the Marine shoot the Iraqi right there in full view of the camera if he knew it'd be recorded for all to see?

Posted by: Laura at November 17, 2004 10:28 AM (ptOpl)

29 Kevin Sites is a Dhimmi.

Posted by: CountZero at November 17, 2004 01:05 PM (ztsBT)

30 I wonder why the Marine hasn't been pulled from duty.

Posted by: John at November 19, 2004 01:26 AM (Jq8H8)

31 He has.

Posted by: Laura at November 19, 2004 09:07 AM (ptOpl)

32 I think it's a little soon to be branding Kevin Sites as a traitor. None of us were there. And maybe he did get permission to air his video. That still has not been established. I will agree that this video has produced a backlash of press that could endanger our boys and girls over there but I think you've done just as much damage if not more. You've apparently revealed this marines name and who was the source of that name. Curious because its as irresponsible, as your claim Kevin sites of being.

Posted by: Mrs greyhawk at November 19, 2004 09:18 AM (xA7u2)

33 These right wing nut-jobs won't ever realize who the real murders are. They are hoplessly indoctrinated, and U.S. fascism would not be possible without their ignorance and faithful support. I luv how these rightwing neo-fascists are so quick to label Citizens in their own country as terrorists, or insurgents. I think it would serve them well to learn a little bit about international law. ( though I know they never will, as facts elude them ) The people of an occupied nation enjoy a 'God-Given' Right to resist the occupation. This does not make them criminals, this makes them men who are protecting their country from invasion. We all have a right to self defense. And since they keep bringing up how these savages behead people and kill americans, I would like someone to name just one american that was beheaded or killed prior to the illegal invasion of their country. ( and if one of you nazi supporters brings up Iraqi involvment in the WTC catastrophy, you will truly show you stupidity ) In my opinion the U.S. fascists are the real terrorist savages. It is far more brutal and cowardly to kill innocent women and children ( at least 100,000 killed by U.S. bombings ) in air-raids. I know I do not need to explain this to anyone with common sense, or the slightest inclination towards civility. I also realize that the people who need to learn these lessons never will. Carry on Christian Fascists, I am truly ashamed that ye are our countrymen !

Posted by: alexx at April 04, 2005 05:42 AM (tEZjp)

34 If the white man came down to Africa with the intent of helping them and bringing christianity, eneded up taking thier gold and thier youth as slaves, why should anyone trust Foreing occupation. I do not support the beheadings and all that, by the so-called terrorists but one would result to anything to get rig of foregn ocupation. I DO not really blame these terrorists for thier actions. I see it as self defence

Posted by: victor at May 04, 2005 03:49 AM (Y0MB9)

35 I've seen the video that Sikes made and I'm glad that he showed it to the world. It isn't the first time that US soldiers did things against the Geneva convention and it won't be the last. I hope that the Iraqi's kill each and everyone of those murdering American bastards. Just as the US gov. used weapons with radioactive components in other places in the world, they always think that they are God all mighty. They aren't. If they would treat the peoples of the world with respect, they would get respect in return. For those that think that I'm some anachist or anti-war campaigner, I'm not. I myself am a former soldier (15 years) in one of the European armies, and I served in Somalia, Chad, Djibuti, Somalia and the former Yougoslavia. At this momment I'm suffering from radiation sickness (due to US weapons). If my health was better I would have fought the US soildiers myself. The only reason for the war is money. Bush and his gang are getting rich while the soldiers in both camps are getting killed and nothing will change that. The US people will only see what the Bush gang want them to see. 60 Years after Hitler, we've got a new one called Bush.

Posted by: A N at May 11, 2005 08:01 PM (XBdDl)

36 I was in the unit that the Marine who killed the insurgent was in. I was actually about 2 klicks west of that mosque when it happened. Not to mention the fact that he and I went through Scout/Sniper school together. Kevin Sites DID turn the video in to the chain of command. If the US is going to vote to send us in to every dumbass war the comes along, they need to see what war is like. If none of you like it, then enlist and come over here. Man up, chickenhawks.

Posted by: Martymarine at November 07, 2005 10:37 PM (hkDhl)

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November 15, 2004

Holiday Wish List

Via Flea

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US Warplane Shot Down by Terrorists Identified

*****EXCLUSIVE TO THE JAWA REPORT****MUST CITE JAWA REPORT****

Mike at Sworn Enemy sent me this link from John of Argghhh! Could it be that we have solved the mystery we first noticed a little over a week ago? US 'Warplane' shot down by terrorists:

US 'Warplane' launched near Samarra as reported by John:

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Zarqawi Update

Two quick hits before I go, via Chad. 1) Looks like another message from Zarqawi. It seems he's given up on Fallujah, but don't expect it to become pascified any time soon. 2) The leader of Jaish Muhammad, Moayad Ahmed Yasseen (also known as Abu Ahmed) was arrested in Fallujah. The man is said to have cooperated with Zarqawi in several beheading murders in Iraq.

Posted by: Rusty at 07:28 PM | Comments (5) | Add Comment
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1 This is great news! Now that this guy was arrested, he may possibly be able to say where Zarqawi is hiding out. Were those fuckers that stupid to think they would win?

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 07:40 PM (ptOpl)

2 Abu Ahmed should received what he gave. Oh, only if we didn't have to listen to the crys of the liberal terrorist supporting America hating assholes. PAYBACK IS IMPORTANT.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 15, 2004 09:10 PM (iWXp3)

3 Let him fess up where the other cells are hiding out, then behead him and send the tape to Al Jazeera. Notice how Zarqawi gave a message to his insurgents to fight with their lives if necessary to get the enemy (us) while his cowardly ass is safely tucked away somewhere FAR away from Fallujah?

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 08:23 AM (ptOpl)

4 first of your a ignorant we lose the war in iraq long time ago and zarqawi won i know you dont like the true well keep deluding yourself more thad we won the war in iraq and dont get mad becuse zarqawi is going to be on the history books like a great fighter alexander the great and napoleon bonaparte and no i dont like osama i admire fighters true fighter zarqawi got injured so many times and look at him still fighting wow thads incredible a men who stands up and fight for what he belives thads what you call a hero and yes he beaheads people but in wars you have the right to kill a person however you desire thads what we call the nature of wars you dont know anyting about wars my friend sorry ignorant so the war is about wining and his doing everyting he can to win, witch it works and now he won the war now he has to wait for us to depart from iraq ignorant. i Admire george washington he was a great fighter to ignorant he was the only one alive and got shot so so many times and thad why the people pick him to be our leader. dont you ge it we are the bad guys right now trying to steal oil form the poor country lol iam glad we lose lol ignorant.

Posted by: monica at October 05, 2005 07:19 PM (kgRG0)

5 if our country was invaded i would do everyting to win same what zarqawi is doing yes if zarqawi gets kill is over but i know his legend will live and thads what you cant take away from him ignorant

Posted by: monica at October 05, 2005 07:25 PM (kgRG0)

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Fallujah Film

Some footage from fighting in Fallujah.

(Simultaneously launched by BRD from Demosophia, Anticipatory Retaliation, and The Jawa Post)

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148 Killed in Chinese Jihad

Could China be on the brink of a bloody civil war with it's Muslim minority? Samuel P. Huntington noted in his groundbreaking book, The Clash of Civilizations, that, "The borders of Islam are bloody." In addition to China's large Muslim minority, it also shares borders with Pakistan, Kyrgistan, Tajikistan, and Afghanistan--all Muslim countries. While sectarian violence is not unheard of among the other great religions of the world, there is something unique about Islam in that 9/10 of those conflicts is between Muslims and their neighbors, or between Islamists fighting secular Muslim regimes. Here is a map of armed conflicts around the world for 2003. For all the latest news on China, I suggest following Simon's biweekly Asia by Blog report.

Telegraph:

The fighting broke out after a Han youth crashed his motorcycle into a Hui builder's tractor, tipping it over. The confrontation soon escalated into pitched battles between mobs armed with shovels and hammers. Molotov cocktails were launched across the river between Nanren and Weitang - the former predominantly Hui, the latter Han - and Huis from around the country flocked to assist their beleaguered brothers.
A local imam said that one of his followers was found beheaded in rice paddy ditches, a Hui official told The Sunday Telegraph. "They share the same market, but the Hui people are insulted by the Han's behaviour," he said. "The Han stallholders try to sell them pork, pushing it in front of their faces all the time. Now the imam says the Han in Weitang are savages who mock our traditions by cutting our throats."....

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1 I wonder how well Jihad will go over with the "benevolent" Chinese leadership?

Posted by: Gordon at November 15, 2004 05:07 PM (dEFhD)

2 How can they not love pork? Mmm. Chinese Sweet and Sour Pork.

Posted by: Bill Dautrive at November 15, 2004 05:47 PM (G95Uf)

3 mmmmmmmmmmm, pork.........

Posted by: Rusty at November 15, 2004 08:47 PM (JQjhA)

4 The Han (who represent a little over 90% of China's population) have long had a well-deserved reputation for chauvanism and government-supported efforts to undermine the distinctive cultures, languages, and other manifestations of non-Han ethnic identity among the minority peoples of the empire. And the modern state of China IS an empire in much the same way the Soviet Union was (except with less tolerance of separate identity among the conquered people). The eastern part of China has only sporadically controlled what is now the western half of China over the past few millenia, and the regions bordering Korea and Vietnam also feature indigenous people who generally do not identify themselves as members of the Chinese state. Given that, it's only natural that the Hui (who look a lot like Hans but are Muslims) and Uyghurs (from Xinjiang--they look more like other Central Asians) would identify with coreligionists who also are widely portrayed as subjugated to foreign influence. In short, don't forget that such statements are the only way the Chinese state will allow the Hui to express (indirectly) their resentments against Han domination. Beijing has no proximate cause to further repression of the Imams for opposition to US and/or Israeli policies, but complaining about the even harsher line taken by Beijing will get an Imam jailed and/or executed (and, besides, many of the Imams owe their positions to Beijing anyway, through the official state religious organs).

Posted by: Jem at November 16, 2004 04:02 AM (u1JGo)

5 FROM: MRS.JAMILA.ABDULRAHMAN PRAISE ALLAH, THE MOST BENEVOLENT. I am the above named person from Egypt. I am married to Late Abdul Rah man. Of blessed memorial who worked with oil petrochemical in England for ten years before he died in oil spillage in offshore work when he went to supervice an project in the year 2001. We were married for fifteen years without a child. He died after the accident oil spillage illness that lasted for only one week. Before his death we were both very devoted Muslims and since his death I too have been battling with both cancer and fibroid problems, when my late husband was alive he deposited the sum of: 16.000.000. Million (Sixteen Millions pounds. with an oversea security company and Presently this money is still with the Security Company. Recently, my Doctor told me that I would not last for the next three months due to cancer problem. Though what disturbs me most is my stroke sickness. Having known my condition I decided to donate this fund to either a Moslem organization or devoted Muslim individual that will utilize this money the way I am going to instruct here- in. I want this Muslim organization or individual to use this money in all sincererity to fund mosques, orphanages, widows and also propagating the word of ALLAH and to ensure that the society upholds the views and beliefs of the holy Quran. The holy Quran emphasized so much on ALLAH'S benevolence and this has encouraged me to take this bold step. I took this decision because I donÂ’t have any child that will inherit this money and my husband relatives are new Christians converts and I donÂ’t want my husbands hard earned money to be misused by people I call unbelievers. I donÂ’t want a situation where this money will be used in an unholy manner Hence the reason for taking this bold decision, I know that after death I will be with ALLAH the most beneficent and the most merciful, I donÂ’t need any telephone communication in this regard because of my health and the presence of my husb! ands relatives around me always, I donÂ’t want them to know about this development. With ALLAH all things are possible. As soon as I receive your reply I shall give you the contact of the Security Company. I will also issue you a letter of authority that will prove you as the original- beneficiary of this fund. I want you and the Muslim community where you reside to always pray for me; my happiness is that I lived a life of a true devoted Muslim worthy of emulation. Whoever that wants to serve the ALLAH must serve him in truth and in fairness. Please always be prayerful all through your life. Any delay in your reply will give me room in sourcing for a Muslim organization or a devoted Muslim for this same purpose Until I hear from you, my dreams will rest squarely on your shoulders. May the almighty ALLAH continue to guide and protect you? Regards, Mrs.Jamila.Abdulrahman

Posted by: jamila at December 20, 2004 04:11 PM (3H16+)

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Al Qaeda Bringing Nukes Over Mexican Border?

It's not so much that I'm anti-immigration as I am pro-controlling the border so I don't wake up one morning to find my native Los Angeles is lost in a nuclear holocaust. This Time magazine article reports that al Qaeda is keenly aware of weak border protections and planning to use it against us.

A key al-Qaeda operative seized in Pakistan recently offered an alarming account of the group's potential plans to target the U.S. with weapons of mass destruction, senior U.S. security officials tell TIME. Sharif al-Masri, an Egyptian who was captured in late August near Pakistan's border with Iran and Afghanistan, has told his interrogators of "al-Qaeda's interest in moving nuclear materials from Europe to either the U.S. or Mexico," according to a report circulating among U.S. government officials.
Masri also said al-Qaeda has considered plans to "smuggle nuclear materials to Mexico, then operatives would carry material into the U.S.,"

Both Charles at LGF and Robert Spencer at Jihad Watch connect the Time magazines mention of a missing plane to other similar incidents. My only question: Can you fit a nuclear weapon into a pinata?

PS- More here (hat tip Dan)

Posted by: Rusty at 01:42 PM | Comments (31) | Add Comment
Post contains 206 words, total size 2 kb.

1 I'm against any further immigration until our jobless rate hits 0% anytime that a country says "we need more immigrants because we need workers" all the while they say, well, we have a 4% unemployment rate is courting disaster. Our lax policies have only brought in gangs and now the terrorists see our soft policy as the soft underbelly from which to attack us with. Our politicians knew this too, but since they side with big business and cheap labor is always good for the big business but not so good for the little guy they'll keep it up and we'll be the ones getting hurt in more ways than just in our pockets. Myths about immigration (and freetrade) are that they make products cheaper. Not really, they just increase the bottom line that is all what big business wants, i've seen the outcome of this steadly rising in my area as more and more people are holding up cardboard signs begging for work and/or food and money. Sooner or later we're going to have to wake up and smell the coffee. I just hope its not too late. :-/

Posted by: Andre at November 15, 2004 02:15 PM (hD5mx)

2 We also have to stop employing overseas positions. Every time I call customer service, I get some raghead in India, Pakistan, wherever, and I can't even understand them! Too many medical professionals working in hospitals too that I can barely understand. Pretty rude and abrupt too, I might add. We should have closed the borders during Carter's regime. That's when this crap really started...after the Iran hostage situation we just marked that anniversary last week.

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 02:30 PM (ptOpl)

3 The borders of this country have never been sealed, EVER! Since before the days of Pancho Villa, as well as other border raiders, the US have never wanted to seal the border, the simple reason is cheap seasonal labor. Its all great when we complain we are paying $1.00 to 2.00 (mattering how close you are to the border) a head of leatuce, but no one takes those seasonal jobs because the no one will pay the prices for expensive labor. Everyone wants the expensive car in the drive way, the 150 channel digital video feed on our big screens, and big homes ... all at the bargain basement cost. Well the only cost you can control effectivly (which is your biggest target) is the labor to make the cheap expensive vehicle, laying of cables, and construction of those houses. We as a national will never seal the borders in this country. Everyone tries to make it a partisan issue ... which it is; the lying scum on both sides of the aisle dont care or give a shit.

Posted by: Salamander at November 15, 2004 04:04 PM (W2YA6)

4 Well, maybe not the Mexican borders, as most of them are hard working people and don't want to behead us! But the Mid East borders? Now that's another story.

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 04:09 PM (ptOpl)

5 Andre, 4% unemployment is almost too low. People have to change jobs for a variety of reasons, and ineffecient businesses have to close. Therefore, there will alway be unemployment. This is how it works. You could NEVER have a 0% unemployment rate because in order to get new workers to fill openings companies would have to pay even more, which would eventually cause inflation to rise. Like it or not, higher unemployment means lower inflation.

Posted by: Maureen at November 15, 2004 06:12 PM (ny5O/)

6 ditto maureen. Actually, the ideal unemployment rate is somewhere in the 5% rate. Anything below that would also be a sign of a stagnant society. We want technological changes.

Posted by: Rusty at November 15, 2004 08:49 PM (JQjhA)

7 I could beg to differ, as a college graduate I haven't been able to find a job as a programer in the 3 years since college, hell i can't even get a job selling computers! I've worked bussing tables got a taste of mex up close with one who was rude obnoxious, arrogant and snottily ignorant, needless to say after a week of taking it I quit that job and got another flipping burgers. Needless to say, i'm not "loving it" as I hear more an more doublespeak and triple speak from corporations who just really want to squeeze the last dime out of what is left of the middle class so that we can have a return back to the pre-1900's as far as monopoly corporations go. Sure this seems all good and find himming and hawing about it, but once a cold dose of reality hits you its like getting ice cold water thrown on you while you are in a deep sleep. Nothing wakes you up faster than that.

Posted by: Andre at November 15, 2004 09:13 PM (hD5mx)

8 Laura/Andre......I dont know anything about your ancestor's heritage but if you are not aware, let me be the first to inform you that they were economic migrants as well. Were your ancestors not allowed to enter the US, then chances are that you both would not be here today. The issue is about Al Qaeeda using the Mexican border as a way of entering the US, not for you two nobodies to complain about your dislike of foreigners. Would it make a difference if the health professionals you have a problem with hailed from Europe, Laura? Or do you dislike them because they are educated and successful? Lift yourselves out of the gutter and in particular your attitudes. After all the US is the land of opportunity for those prepared to work hard and also have the ability.

Posted by: James at November 16, 2004 06:02 AM (4PPsx)

9 James its the simple fact society has to have an enemy: witches, Moors, savage natives, Chinese, Germans & Japaneses, Africans, Latinos, Indians / Pakistanis / Bangladeshis, and now Araps. Society always has to have that boogie man to keep the mindless (never under-estimate the power of stupidity in numbers) amongst the population like sheep to follow the leader. Fear of what your people dont know is the biggest stick you can have.

Posted by: Salamander at November 16, 2004 07:11 AM (F26eZ)

10 Salamander. I agree with you up to a point. I would say that it is only certain elements of society who are opposd to immigration, that is those who feel that they are in competition with the immigrants, namely those on the lowest rung of the economic ladder and the uneducated. Fear and ignorance are great bedfellows.

Posted by: James at November 16, 2004 07:50 AM (4PPsx)

11 Bullshit James. I'd be here, just in Italy. The difference bet. the immigration to Ellis Island back in the early 1900's is that they were PROUD to become American citizens, learned the language and were hard working people. Can't say the same for the ones immigrating to America today. Some came over to learn how to kill us.

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 08:57 AM (ptOpl)

12 Case in point. Ignorant. Uneducated and now paranoid.

Posted by: James at November 16, 2004 09:29 AM (4PPsx)

13 Germany had near zero unemployment. So to make up for it they allowed uncontrolled immigration. Now they have 11 million problems to deal with. On the immigration issue. Can't relate to recent (last 100 yrs) as my family has been here from the formation of this great country. It seems to me that the Irish, Brits, Italians, Germans, Swedes, etc: joined the rest of America. Many even changing their names to appear what they wished to be, namely an American. They dressed, acted, behaved like Americans as quick as they could. They practised the majority religion. They quickly assimilated and their loyality was not is question. My people came to an empty land. Formerly, sparcely occupied by a people who were not a nation. They hadn't approached the iron age. No steel, no horses. Life must have been tough as they apparently fought each other constantly. They didn't have the wheel, domestic animals, a written language, a central government. Bless them, but the truth is 400 yrs ago and forever past that, more advanced societies always prevailed. That was the way it was through out the world. Even the Ameridians constantly displaced each other. Thru war and slaughter I might add. My ancestors came to a new land, to make a country. Recent immigrants are coming to reap what my ancestors have sowed. They haven't paid the price. My family has had it's members take part in or be killed in every war this nation has fought. I was raised by a good man. He was my step father because my father was an army air corps pilot who didn't come back from the pacific in 1943. Even my step day fought in WW2. I served in Viet Nam and my only son is now in Iraq. This policy of opening our doors to everyone is crazy. They are not coming here for any other reason but economic. I understand their point. I hope they understand my point. Which is. We have plenty of people already. Don't believe it? Try an Los Angeles freeway. In some areas water is even rationed. Perhaps those that wish to immigrate here should stay and fight to make their countries better. That's what I would do. Perhaps America can help them be like America. It's apparent that is what they wish to be like or they wouldn't be coming here. I wish the rest of the world good luck. I wish to be your friend. I wish to help you if I can. Come and visit. But please if you can't or won't be like us then stay where you are. We have enough problems already.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 16, 2004 09:54 AM (UkXdy)

14 ANDRE: Can't find a programing job? wow! Try another geographical area. I know some kids (to me anyway) recently hired at 70K. Right out of school. I believe they majored in computer science.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 16, 2004 10:02 AM (UkXdy)

15 Have to agree pretty much with the last posting. Visit America by all means,have a great vacation,enjoy your stay,but dont give us any problems,and most of all go back home at the end of it.

Posted by: sopotamia at November 16, 2004 10:52 AM (aDsLR)

16 James, you have no clue about immigration, its history, or are even remotely connected to it. I have no problem with people who have come here, became citizens and learned the language. However, we are talking about a long time ago. The immigrants coming over here now, do NOT learn the language properly, do not dress American, and insist on bringing their cultures, dress, religion and language with them. That's fine to be proud of your heritage but when taking up space in another country, you must become like them. You cannot expect to talk Arabic, Hindi, or whatever and get a job or be respected. My brother is a medical doctor. He sees many jobs being taken in major hospitals by foreign doctors, nurses, and other personnel. They smell to high heaven. They cannot be understood. These are people's LIVES we are talking about! These are sick people who need to be in a sterile environment. If you cannot make your needs met as a patient to these people, what kind of medical care do you expect to get? Of course, it's our fault. We hire these people because they accept cheaper wages. Same with the computer and telemarketing industries. Many, many jobs are being taken from Americans because the jobs are sent overseas. That is a major reason why there is so much unemployment. The heavy, physical labor is done mostly by Mexicans. America is lazy, they do not want to do the jobs they do. I don't have a problem with Mexicans. They are hard working, religious people. There are plenty of them here in Texas. And no, I am NOT in NYC. I was born and raised there, not there now. Maybe you don't have that problem in the land of down under. Why is it that people who aren't even in America seem to have all the answers or think they do?

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 11:47 AM (ptOpl)

17 why

Posted by: michel myers at December 13, 2004 02:37 PM (72NLY)

18 Fuck off

Posted by: michel myers at December 13, 2004 02:39 PM (72NLY)

19 hey guys !!!!!!!!! just chillax. the worlds a free place and we the bloody hell can get our life's worth only by working in ur countries.UR govt the hell wants us to build up it's technical base. we are wanted for our intellect as ur COUNTRY has not an ounce of originality. we get recognizeed for our talent and in the process barter out some heavy quid!!!! we will IMMIGRATE in search of jobs to america. SEE YOU THERE SOON...........

Posted by: arjun at January 05, 2005 07:37 AM (2pQ/l)

20 You must have heard the news, right. Supposebly a Mexican doctor smuggled in four Asian guys through the borders of Mexico in the States. It was reported to Cals. Highway Patrol, but these four guys are heading our way.....to Boston....why not D.C.? e

Posted by: e at January 19, 2005 04:52 PM (+7VNs)

21 We all know that the United States is a country populated by imigrants. We are also a nation of laws, or so we claim. My ansestors came here only after having followed an established and legal procedure that was anything but easy or quick. We still have the same laws pertaining to how one can come to this country and become a citizen. Every time I hire a new employee, I am still required to use and file an I-9 form, insuring that the new employee is here legally. If I fail to follow this procedure, or am caught with illegals working for me, I am subject to heavy fines and prison time....check the laws! Just an opinion, but I believe that we are being steered away from life as we have always known it to be in this country...because the only way that we can compete in a global economy, is to gradually lower our overall standard of living. This is why you keep hearing about the ever widening gap between the haves...and have-nots...and it's only just started. Those of you who have not yet noticed any adverse effects in terms of your ability to maintain your standard of living...will continue to discredit most if not all of what many are saying about the path we are now on as a nation. In time...maybe soon, maybe not so soon, those same people (will) be adversely effected...in some way.

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Bilal Hussein Alive, Still Anti-American

Complete Bilal Hussein Archives Here

A week ago today I noted that the AP was using Bilal Hussein to cover the terrorists' side of the story from Fallujah. You can see some of Bilal Hussein's propaganda photos here. Mr. Bilal became APs 'embed' to those forces trying to kill Americans all over Iraq. By hiring a photographer to follow our enemies and to distribute their propaganda, the AP has betrayed our country. Let me suggest that there are higher standards of morality than so-called journalistic ethics. When your fellow countrymen are dying in a war, the highest obligation is to nation. By distributing images and messages of the enemy you bolster their support. There is a reason the resistance in Iraq is not getting any lighter, it is because the messages they recieve in their media is that they are winning. Why give up when you think you are winning?

Today the AP releases a story on the harrowing ordeal Hussein went through as he tried to escape Fallujah. It comes as no surprise to learn that Hussein's anti-American roots go deep. He is a native of Fallujah, the town that brought you 'We love you Zarqawi' and 'Let's mutilate the bodies of American civillians'. AP story via Boston News:

In the weeks before the crushing military assault on his hometown, Bilal Hussein sent his parents and brother away from Fallujah to stay with relatives.
The 33-year-old Associated Press photographer stayed behind to capture insider images during the siege of the former insurgent stronghold.
''Everyone in Fallujah knew it was coming. I had been taking pictures for days,'' he said. ''I thought I could go on doing it.''

Wow, you mean you didn't realize that a 'war zone' meant, you know, a 'war zone'?? more...

Posted by: Rusty at 12:30 PM | Comments (14) | Add Comment
Post contains 828 words, total size 5 kb.

1 Come on, Rusty - don't you think you're being a little hard on the guy? I mean, it's not like he's got huge frickin' brass ones. I've got 1 terrorist sympathizing "journalist" in my cross hairs swimming upstream in Bockalakadocka River.

Posted by: Editor at November 15, 2004 01:08 PM (adpJH)

2 whoa!! now that is something I did not need to see!!

Posted by: Rusty at November 15, 2004 01:23 PM (JQjhA)

3 I just didn't want to go into the battlezone alone.

Posted by: Editor at November 15, 2004 01:29 PM (adpJH)

4 Yeah but I don't think that's what was meant by 'bring your gun'

Posted by: Rusty at November 15, 2004 02:25 PM (JQjhA)

5 I'm still waiting for a comment from Laura...

Posted by: Editor at November 15, 2004 03:22 PM (adpJH)

6 Uh, Editor, why? You're not going the route of Aussie James, or worse yet, COOqarUK on the Bigley blog?!

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 04:05 PM (ptOpl)

7 I'm not awaiting your comment about Bigley, here (see link in comment 1). By the way, who is Aussie James? Was he a troll?

Posted by: Editor at November 15, 2004 04:12 PM (adpJH)

8 No, but he is a terrorist loving, anti-American ass from Australia, who'd rather stick up for the innocent Iraqi's than our soldier boys.

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 05:44 PM (ptOpl)

9 Laura, Let me hint at what I'd LIKE to do to the entire ME (Israel exempted), but cannot say without reprisal from the "reality-based community" since they are so peaceful: HINT: Give the entire Middle East 72 hours to acquiesce to our every demand of them. If they refuse, launch enough nukes to fry 99.99% of it's inhabitants (including goats)... if you know what I'm getting at.

Posted by: Editor at November 15, 2004 06:22 PM (adpJH)

10 More on still alive and kicking Bilal Hussein

Posted by: Any moues at November 15, 2004 06:36 PM (5kitr)

11 Oh, I get it! You meant you wanted me to bring back my old adage, "nuke the motherfuckers!!" There, happy now? ;-)

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 06:36 PM (ptOpl)

12 No, no, no. I was just making sure you knew where I stood - not with Aussie James. This has gotten out of hand... I've never been one to Komoonikate with the pheemail tipes very well - just ask my gurlfrend. Let's start all over. If you see in the first comment of this thread I supplied a link. Rusty and I went back and forth a couple times about it and that's when I chimed in that I was waiting for you to comment - consid'ri' you might come from a different, ehem, perspective.

Posted by: Editor at November 15, 2004 06:44 PM (adpJH)

13 Editor: HOLY SHIT! Forgive me, but I usually don't click onto links that readers provide, for safety reasons. I've crashed my computer a coupla times so I'm more cautious nowadays, but I took the chance and clicked onto your link. Man, oh man! There's lead in them thar pants!!!!!

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 07:22 PM (ptOpl)

14 hey, while you're freely attacking one person who stayed behind to keep track of what was going on I have a thought for you. you being such an obviously intelligent person (nuke comment), i'm sure that you understand the gravity of the literally centuries of western invaders htat have been trying to take over the land in the middle eastern (you ever heard of the crusades), and I'm sure that you understand the skepticism that is fostered by these people.Im also sure that you know the long history of cia, mujahdeen, taliban and the soviet jihad- binladen's cia training im sure you are well aware of how we left the northern kurds hanging after the first gulf war and all so i wont get too far into the history of the region. I would certainly hope that someone who doesnt understand the social circumstances that created a culture would certainly not sriously suggest such a final solution with such a finite amout of knowledge. By the way, I dont know about you but if say, china had a history of invading america- and there was a chineese convoy coming down my street, i'd bomb the fuck out of that convoy too- I have people close to me fighting over there now and had them there 12 years ago as well- and all I want is for them to come home and let the Iraqi people govern themselves.

Posted by: spencer at December 15, 2004 05:14 PM (Q22Ni)

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US Troops in Iraq, "America, F**k Yeah!"

I knew there was a reason I think the funniest movie ever made is Team America: World Police. Thanks to Flea for e-mailing me this news:

The soldiers shared laughs during the more surreal moments, such as when a psychological-operations truck rolled through the city blaring the theme song to the movie "Team America: World Police." In the film, Rambo-like puppets hunt terrorists and blow up the Eiffel Tower in the process. There is no need to thank us, the puppets tell outraged Parisians.
Later that night, 500-pound bombs fell on Fallujah.

Tim Blair adds, "Surreal? It's perfect."

Frank J agrees with me.

Posted by: Rusty at 10:10 AM | Comments (15) | Add Comment
Post contains 115 words, total size 1 kb.

Body Found: Margaret Hassan / Teresa Borcz Khalifa Feared Dead

This is very sad. Chad at In the Bullpen has some interesting analysis. Let me just add that this is not a slam-dunk identification. The Islamist terrorists who are behind this murder could just as easily have killed an Iraqi woman for dying her hair blonde. In any event it reveals the type of scum we are up against.ABC News:

On Sunday, U.S. Marines found the mutilated body of a Western woman as they searched for militants still holding out in Fallujah. The woman could not be immediately identified, but a British aide worker and a Pole are the only Western women known to have been taken hostage....
Marines also found the disemboweled body of a Western woman wrapped in a blood-soaked blanket on a street in Fallujah. Two foreign women Margaret Hassan, 59, director of CARE international in Iraq, and Teresa Borcz Khalifa, 54, a Polish-born longtime resident of Iraq were abducted last month but the body could not be identified without further tests.

(Images-- Above right olish hostage Teresa Borcz Khalifa in terrorist video. Left: Margaret Hassan pleads for her life after terrorists threaten to behead her.)

ABC (Australia):

Â“It is a femaleÂ… missing all four appendages, with a slashed throat and disembowelled, she has been dead for a while but only in this location for a day or two,Â” said Benjamin Finnell, a hospital apprentice with the Navy Corps, who had inspected the body.

Others: In the Bullpen, Blogs of War, Backcountry Conservative, Interested Participant, Digger, Command Post

Posted by: Rusty at 08:57 AM | Comments (51) | Add Comment
Post contains 267 words, total size 3 kb.

1 FUCK FUCK FUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Goddamn them if it is true! That would be a first...a woman? I'm too enraged to say anymore.

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 09:49 AM (ptOpl)

2 Disemboweled? What kind of animals are these people. Why the hell are we treating them like people. Missing all four appendages? Are these nuts becoming cannibals?

Posted by: greyrooster at November 15, 2004 10:09 AM (aavE0)

3 If it's true I hope and pray a video will not released or would not have been taken. Another thing If so called Zarqawi or the ppl responsible for the attricites are captured ( would ( i hope) the soldiers be given the green signal to give them the same treatment what the victims were subjected to ) or would they be given fine treatments like how Saddam is been treated?? Question definitly to be asked.

Posted by: Roopesh at November 15, 2004 10:19 AM (q9wBH)

4 Hate to say it but I did say in a posting weeks ago that I thought Margaret Hassan and the Polish lady were more than likely already dead.These ragheads were too concerned about their own asses to be keeping hostages alive. The Jack the Ripper mode of execution shows you what satanic types we are dealing with here.Those women will have starved and been denied water for god nows how many days or weeks by all accounts. This shows the particular hatred of women in their religion. Women are only vessels to them.Western women not even that!

Posted by: sopotamia at November 15, 2004 10:53 AM (u4yGw)

5 They said the bodies appeared to have been dead a while; makes sense that Zarqawi already had them slaughtered and bolted out of Fallujah before we upped the attacks. Disembowelled? I don't even know what the word means...no, never mind, don't want an explanation. I don't understand how they thought the video of her fainting was considered "too harsh", yet they can do this shit to human beings??? It's worse than what animals do.

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 11:36 AM (ptOpl)

6 Send them all to ALLAH IN HELL! NUKE THEM ALL NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: Andre at November 15, 2004 12:01 PM (hD5mx)

7 You wont believe what some of special forces are doing to to these scumbags right now. What I just heard makes me wonder if some of our guys havent completely lost the plot. There was supposed to be a specific plan of action apparently but some of these ragheads heads are so willing to die its changing by the minute.

Posted by: wekno at November 15, 2004 12:08 PM (u4yGw)

8 Ok, I'm sick, more sick than I have ever been. My fiance is now being transfered to Falluj-hell and I'm scared to death. Why is it that we have this hell on earth. What is wrong with these towel heads? I'm in agreeance with "Andre" above, NUKE THEM, we have nothing to lose and everything to gain by this. I'm meeting with some of the Army wives tonight so we can console each other, this just cant go on. I feel like I've got so much to say, yet we are all sick of it. Please let me take this opportunity to wish all our troops a safe ride home. God Bless all of them and thank you for listening. Very scared - Sue

Posted by: Susan at November 15, 2004 02:21 PM (3pOYP)

9 My heart goes out to you, Susan! It is a shame that these lib's will stick up for innocents lost in Iraq, yet have no compassion for our soldiers fighting there, saying it's "Bush's fault" and that they are being misled! Anyone who is against this war, is anti-American, plain and simple. America, love it or get the FUCK OUT. May God be with your beloved, and those of others on this blog. Take care. xo

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 02:37 PM (ptOpl)

10 I wonder if the degenerate liberal would still blot their panties over these so called "freedom fighters" if they had a lib on their knees in front of a Banner that reads Allau Akbar. Will the lib on his or her knees be understanding while the "freedom fighter" saws his or her head off?

Posted by: OBEDIAH SNOOKS at November 15, 2004 03:08 PM (yBHNA)

11 If this is true, its truly dispicable. I'm surprised this time al-Zarqawi and his ilk, have not video-taped it. I say this because in my view, this is a central feature of the strategy. By using videos that are issued to television stations and scenes recorderd for display on websites. So if Zarqawi or others have murdered these two woman. We must certainly not dance to the depraved tune of the terrorist.

Posted by: karl at November 15, 2004 04:18 PM (PM/BC)

12 I'm sure they were killed before Zarqawi left the area. Why didn't the other insurgents, I wonder?

Posted by: Laura at November 15, 2004 05:46 PM (ptOpl)

13 These dirty animals WILL rot in hell. I just hope our guys send them there fast.

Posted by: Maureen at November 15, 2004 06:34 PM (ny5O/)

14 Also, I love how these pieces of filth have commited these atrocities, but when you go over to ABC online, their top international story right now is this: Report: US Marine Kills Wounded Iraqi http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=255110

Posted by: Maureen at November 15, 2004 06:53 PM (ny5O/)

15 Amen Maureen, Amen. I know something about this incident but cannot go into it now. Will advise with the real truth soon. Don't believe what MSMBC tells you. If they wish to play games with their wounded and dead the results are their's. Our Marines are hot. Time to settle up. GO MARINES GO: GET SOME: PAY BACK TIME.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 15, 2004 11:25 PM (iWXp3)

16 We just need to get out of that place FAST. Forget being Anti-American if you don't support this war. The place is a mess. Lets just leave them to their own devices and stay the hell away from us.

Posted by: Matt Bing at November 16, 2004 04:31 AM (ccz95)

17 Just thought I'd pass you this little gem from Falujah. U.S. Marine catches sight of Raghead slinklng out of house not 10 yards away from his new defence position. Raghead seen to be rapidly disposing of a rocket propelled grenade. Marine challenges said Raghead who deniles all knowledge. Bush,Blair good! (he says). ''LIke to be able to believe you but I just cant omar!'' (Marine Shoots Raghead clean through the head.) I cant say what I feel about news like this coming back from ordinary Americans like you or eye ecxepting that they are wearing a uniform, putting their life on the line, rightfully fighting for what they believe in.After all those beheading videos nothing shocks me anymore, I have no feelings,or sence of humanity for anyone or anything that is an enemy of the U.S.A

Posted by: wekno at November 16, 2004 07:47 AM (fYqXD)

18 Matt Bing: I hear what you are saying Matt but I dont think that you quite get it.This is some sort of last stand against all those that would have us bowing down to their God and their ways.We are a free people and we want it to stay that way.As much as there is truth in the sufferings of palestinians that have had their homes and land confiscated by Israel we must remember that Israel is the only bulwork holding these fanatics back from spreading out of control in the middle east.If we hit them hard now while we can, they will remember not to fuck with us again.This is the only language these morons understand.Long may there be civilised decent countries such as America that see the evil in our midst and be prepared to fight and protect the freedom that many of us so shamedly take for granted.That freedom must be protected now and for ever, by any means necessary.

Posted by: wekno at November 16, 2004 08:19 AM (fYqXD)

19 Wekno, they are now making such a bigass deal about that soldier that killed an "unarmed Iraqi". They may even press charges against him! What a bunch of shit.

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 09:00 AM (ptOpl)

20 Laura, and you can bet your bottom dollar that if this raghead had managed to somehow regain strength enough to let off a volley in the back of this Marines head, the same idiots would be bleeping on about how we lost another hero today in a stand off in a mosque. Holy shit,what do they want,your damned if you do and damned if you dont for christsakes!Do they want a 'live' Marine hero or a dead one!I cant be dealing with these people that make a big deal about some raghead that was trying to kill one of the good guys in all of this mess getting smoked. wheres the sense in that?I need to go and take a lie down,these idiots are just freaking me out big time.

Posted by: wekno at November 16, 2004 09:37 AM (fYqXD)

21 Just heard there's a video out of Margaret's murder, stated by her husband. God help us...I hope to God they don't show them disemboweling her on camera! Dear God, and they said the other one of her fainting was too graphic to show? What the fuck is wrong with these people? What do they expect to gain from killing a person who'd already been there 30 yrs. and was helping their sorry asses? Fuck Fallujah, Fuck Iraq, fuck all of them. It's time to carpet bomb them all and end it.

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 11:56 AM (ptOpl)

22 If reports comming out of Iraq are correct,this champion of humanity and peace has as a final insult to her lifes work and memory had her body mutilated and then quartered by these unbelievable psycopathic maniacs. It is indeed a sad day when someone that dedicates her wole life to the care of suffering people meets such an appalling end.

Posted by: sopotamia at November 16, 2004 12:23 PM (KdJpi)

23 Now I'm hearing the mutilated body found may not be Hassan's as the body had blonde hair. I'm not doubting Margaret's dead, I just don't think the two are related. What's scaring me is that it could be that of the other lady, Teresa Borcz, who seems to have blonde/grayish hair in the hostage video.

Posted by: Laura at November 16, 2004 02:59 PM (ptOpl)

24 To Laura and the others, if this marine did shoot and kill an unarm wounded combatant, then yes he deserves to be charged and jailed for the crime. It has nothing to do with how shitty the terrorist or insurgents are, which I truly believe that they are. It has all to do with American Soldiers being "AMERICAN" Soldiers. The U.S. did sign the Geneva Convention, and unlike the Japanese or Vietnamese, Americans should at all times strive to live up to OUR standards not some other country's. Americans do not, should not, and will not stand by and watch helpless individuals be butchered. If we just let loose flight after flight of B52's, we could level Iraq back to the stone age with out a lost of life. This could easily be done. But in so doing, we will kill many more innocents then the psychotic assholes who hide behind relegion. That is why Susan's fiance is heading into "Falluj-hell". To show the world how great America is and what we are willing to sacrifice for it.

Posted by: Butch at November 17, 2004 03:36 PM (Gqhi9)

25 Islam is very deceptive! To kill in the name of Alla the way they do is horrific. It is a demonic religion that leads people to Hell, it will fail like all other demonic beliefs. Pray for Israel, they are the choosen ones who will rid these "Donkeys of men" and send them to the depths of thier own evil. Israel will evently use nuclear weapons to protect themselves from the Arab world. The Arabs want one thing, to rid the Jews forever. But God gave that land to them. Arafat the terroist will never be laid to rest in East Jerusalem like he thinks. He belongs in Hell with the rest of his head hunting Arabs.

Posted by: sue at November 17, 2004 03:51 PM (rL0Tr)

26 Butch, so you think the Marine should be CHARGED for a CRIME? And what would that be? Defending himself and his comrades from harm and/or death? It is well known that these terrorists can hide explosives, if they are not armed with a gun, and set up booby traps. Even dead bodies have been set up so that when you go near them, something gets set off. If the Marine turned away, he would have been another dead hero with a gunshot wound to his back or blown to smitherenes. In war, you make split decisions. You are not there to ponder whether or not someone could or may not be an enemy. To do so would result in your death or injury. The others holed up in that mosque were all terrorists or freedom fighters. They weren't civilians. Were the terrorists even remotely threatened when they beheaded Armstrong, Hensley or Bigley? Was Hassan a threat when they shot her in the head? To me, THOSE are the CRIMES, not what our soldiers are doing. Had the event not even be recorded for everyone to judge, we wouldn't even be having this conversation. Let the boys do their job.

Posted by: Laura at November 17, 2004 03:55 PM (ptOpl)

27 Laura, the marine did do the right thing, and your right, if he hadn't he would have been comming home in a fresh body bag. Im a Vietnam vet and have seen so called civilians wired with grenades that killed many Americans trying to help them. War is hell and people get killed. The news reporter who ever it was should not have released the information the way he did.....he was not qualified in close combat procedures. 2 women are unaccounted for and brutily murdered. Do you think the Arab press said anything about them....the way they were executed? I'll bet not.....so screw the insurgent he got what he deserved.

Posted by: sue at November 18, 2004 07:23 AM (rL0Tr)

28 I agree - that poor soldier should never be allowed to be dragged through the mud like this. However, for some reason (free speech?? yeah whatever) the media has been given carte blanche to report whatever they want HOWEVER they want. And we all know that the majority of our entertainers and demi-gods in Hollywierd are the bleeding heart liberals who would love nothing more than to find one more way to slur our President. Frankly, the lengths they go to smack of slander and treason, but that's just my opinion. Not only do they present their own agenda and slant the information to suit that agenda, but they announce every move that our guys are going to make! No wonder they didn't find weapons... no wonder the key terrorists weren't found in Fallujah... (**aside** That is something that really cracks me up about these terrorists - their leaders flee and leave their followers behind to "die for the cause"... wouldn't you think that some of these morons would eventually figure out what a raw deal THAT is??) But think back to WW 1 and WW 2 ... hell even in Vietnam - people kept their mouths shut! Codes were used... radio silence was observed... element of suprise is a basic concept here folks. The unfortunate side of this is that we have taken a slide too deep into these loose practices now to be able to go back to the smarter way of operating. Try and keep quiet and suddenly the President is "trying to hide something." I'm sorry, but it is NOT the inherant right of every American to know every last detail of everything. War is ALWAYS on a need to know basis, and frankly a lot of it I don't WANT to know. To the Liberals: Let the President do his job and quit being so arrogant to think you can do it better!! It frightens me to contemplate what would happen if you WERE making the decisions based on such space cases like Michael Moore.... and that's a whole other topic to save for a different day ;o)

Posted by: Lori at November 18, 2004 05:13 PM (mIwX4)

29 I just can't wait to see the video!!!

Posted by: Craig at November 19, 2004 02:11 AM (Jfrfs)

30 The simple fact that they refuse to release or show the video makes one question if it really was Margaret Hassan at all. They had no trouble releasing videos of previous hostages such as Kenneth Bigley, so why now?? My stomach churns up in knots with this horrible sickly feeling which Im sure more readers experience aswell, even people who don't know about this blog. All you have to do is turn on the news, its everywhere. True, we may be in a different country, but still doesn't lessen the pain. Horrible monsters deserve a life of pain and suffering, just flat out killing them wouldn't be a just punishment for what these animals have done.

Posted by: taneil at November 19, 2004 08:54 AM (pkXeN)

31 So Laura and Sue, yes I believe that if he did shoot and kill a wounded combatant that the only threat he was proposing was breathing, yes he should be charge with "Murder". The reason is because he was not defending himself or his fellow soldiers. Our soldiers and marines are trained for combat, I know for I was both a soldier and a marine in the combat arms. I am not saying that they should waltz into a place and believe everything is rosy, but neither should they go in guns blazing if no shots have been fired either. No shots were fire at the time this group of soldier went in either. As for booby traps, well that is a part of war, an ugly part, but once again, our soldiers have been trained. We, the United States, has signed the GC (Geneva Convention). As such, we have certain responsiblities that we must live up. One of these are not to shoot "helpless or captive" combatants. I never said the ones inside the masque were innocent civilians. I said they were wounded combatants, aka the enemy. As for Sue, I both disagree and agree with you. I disagree with the soldier did what he had to do or he would be in a body bag. If the soldier and his fellow soldiers did as they were trained to do, no one should of been placed in a body bag. Now, I do agree that the media, while they should be allow to record the events, they should not be allowed to air anything until the Top Military HQ approves it or until the war is over. (Honestly I think even in criminal and civil cases at home, the media should not be allowed to post anything until after the trial.) Once again, the reason for this is not for the wragheads sorry ass, but because we should hold ourself to a higher standard and we should be responsible for what we do. Otherwise, lets just chunk the GC and kill every non american in the world who are not allied with us. Now to put in my disclaimer, We were not there, and we cant say if he was justified or not. Only those at the scene knows what happen, and the military should investigate the event. If most of the soldiers there believe there was a creditable threat, then slap the soldier on the back and say good job. If not, then slap the soldier in chains and put him in prison.

Posted by: Butch at November 19, 2004 04:54 PM (Gqhi9)

32 Get off it Butch, if you truly were a soldier in combat your understanding of setting standards don't line up with combat reality. I was in the special forces 1966 to 1970 and knew vets that did night recons behind enemy lines for missions they would never be able to share with the likes of you and the media. So what standards are you refering to? You sound more like a bleeding heart media junkie than a combat soldier. Your living in dam dream world. You need to whitness a few Arab executions of innocent men & women. When they start executing kids or babies and selling videos on the streets of Bagdad you might have another view. So I disagree with your setting of standards, there never have been standards in real combat. You would know that if you experienced it like many of us in Vietnam.

Posted by: sue at November 19, 2004 05:51 PM (rL0Tr)

33 Actually Butch is right, i was also a marine and i have a few of my younger cousins there right now fighting for "Our" freedom. Soldiers are trained for the worst scenarios and situations,"We" the americans signed the GC and that is specially more than anything for the safety of our soldiers, we do not abuse, mistreat or torture another human beign, not the enemy, not anyone, if we do how can we complain about the enemy mistreating, abusing or torturing our soldiers? The GC protects our soldiers in the arms of the enemy more than it protects the enemy. The man that was shot and killed was unjustified, that man was already wounded, unarmed and not a threat for the soldiers, if you look closely to the video this men where wounded on the floor and the american soldiers where standing up pointing their guns at them, so how was this wounded man a threat? and even if he did have a gun the soldiers had control of that specific situation and he wasn't pointing any gun or weapon at them, the truth is even at war there are principles specially us being americans and respecting human lives and our laws, something they don't do. So if we act like them why differs us from them?. If you kill someone you should be trial for murder because it wasn't self defense or defending another soldier's life. If some are blind to see this is pretty sad, but then again don't be surprized when that action backfires and hurt the soldiers more, meaning that actions like that makes the enemy more angry and end hurting more innocent people like Margaret just to hurt our goverments. Every human life is valuable and important no matter where they're from or their beleifs and "US" as americans should know this very well. And sue i am sorry to say this but every war is bad and aweful, Vietnam, Iraq, etc...and Butch is right and that doesn't make him a media junky, because many many soldiers think like him or me, and remember something, you are american so learn to respect others way of thinking, because you may have your way of thinking but that doesn't mean you are right, freedom of speech and thinking, learn to respect that and at the end that is why this forums exist so everyone can express their way of thinking. Peace out and God bless you.

Posted by: james at November 20, 2004 03:23 PM (4hJWf)

34 i'm sitting here reading this crap that you're saying, and i'm furios. butch and james need a reality check, how can you disrespect our soldiers like that. you sitting from the comfort of your own home saying there was a crime committed in that mosque. we are fighting a differnent type of war, against monsters with no regard for human life, if a soldier made a decision to save his life and the life of his brothers by killing a waste of human life, then so be it the important thing is those boys are still alive bottom line.

Posted by: bridget at November 20, 2004 04:07 PM (+7VNs)

35 Thanks Bridget, don't worry though I ran into these type people comming home from Nam. I was spit on and called baby killer.....sooooo I'm used to the flak from crap. yes they are disrespectful, but we fight for them to. I say to James and Butch... war is hell and were dealing with a new breed of enemy that would love to have you guys in thier training centers....why don't you join? You have no guts to fight for this country that is obvious from your statements.

Posted by: Boy named sue at November 20, 2004 05:06 PM (8o/Rk)

36 I disagree with you James Every life is not valuable. Hitlers certainly was,nt. I can,t see how that american was supposed to slap chains on that guy and drag him around while in combat. Anyone with a bit of combat knowledge knows that sometimes prisoners of war can not be taken. This was true of the falklands war. But don,t let the secret out or there,ll be a big investigation into that too by those desk sitting do gooders, who live in that fantasy peace world. This war is keeping those physcos off our land for a bit longer.. God knows how many of them are already here!!! I,ll never forget 9/11 it was so horrible. I live in Britian and wonder when it will be our turn. Thanks god for strong leaders. I think about your boys out there as well as our own and my own personal friends.

Posted by: Nic at November 20, 2004 05:46 PM (+7VNs)

37 http://www.vpcenter.org/Videos.htm For those James & Butches who want to see what Islam does to Infidels (which you are)check out the barbaric world of Islam and what our boys are dealing with. "Islam is Satan"

Posted by: Boy named Sue at November 20, 2004 06:35 PM (8o/Rk)

38 These are sick animals that need to be perged from any civilized world. God bless the Jews and pray for Israel

Posted by: Bill at November 20, 2004 08:08 PM (8o/Rk)

39 Long live Israel.......we will live to see the day when the Arabs and thier Islam religion will be nuked off the face of the planet!

Posted by: Bill at November 20, 2004 08:12 PM (8o/Rk)

40 So cross-naming Sue and most of the rest of you, Are you saying we should give up everything that America is suppose to hold dear, and start sinking down to the level of these terrorist. If we do, then we are no better then freaking Hitler or even worse then Hitler, Stalin. And if Hitler and Stalin do not deserve to live, and we down on their level doesnt that mean we may not deserve to live either. (For you mentally challenge that is Hitler = Deserves to Die, We = Hitler, We = Deserve to Die). I would also like to know where you paraniod, blind and hard head individuals get off saying I am disrespecting our troops. All I said is if they do not live up to the GC to the best of their ablities, then they dont deserve the respect, because then they like the boy name sue would want, have become terrorist themselves. I am not so blind that I know some time the GC can not be followed. But every soldier must think seriously about breaking it instead of doing it on a whim. I believe I give more respect to our troops then all of you "Nuke them all and let god sort them out" pysco. I believe our troops are better, both in combat and in morallity, then these wrag heads over in Iraq, and though it would be easier to nuke them all, our troops wont do that because we are better. As for me spitting and calling Cross-naming Sue, a baby killer, you have know Idea what I am about. I believe the Vietnam vets did an outstanding job in Vietnam, and if the crappy politicans would of kept their nose out, could of easily won that war, hell they won every major battle in the war. But I like to inform Sue, that it was not I, but the United States of America, The US Arm Forces that agree to go by the GC. They are the ones who set the freaking stands for our troops to live, fight and maybe die by. And Bridgett, unless if you are cross-namer also, it makes not different what type of war we are fighting. "AMERICA" sign the GC. END OF DISCUSSION. Until we cancel that, all of our troops should try the utmost to follow it. As for my fighting for this country, I have served my time, and I did what I was order to do, and I freaking did it living up to the GC. Now I admit, I did not get to go out and crawl around in the jungle at night, because I was in the artillery, to be more specific, 8" self-propelled. So I did fight for my Country. And I "VOLUNTEERED, which if you were a Vietnam vet, there is a good chance that you did not Sue. As for "ISLAM is SATAN", I say it is not Islam, or muslim, but it is Fanatics that are satan. It is the Fanatic in Muslim, Jews, Christians, that posion this world. The ones that are so full of sht, that they can not see, hear, or listen to different view points. The ones who believe that there is My way or no other, that needs to be getting rid of. The truly goodly people on this earth are those who can agree to disagree and let every one live in peace. But from those on here, I can see that James is the only one can listen to what is being said. And he is right, the more atrocities our troops commit, the worse it is for our forces. Once again I state this is not for love of the freaking wragheads/terrorist, but for the well being of our troops. So Sue and Bridgett, you told me to go join one of their camps, but I never said I support these wragheads. So why dont you go fly to Iraq, strap on 50 - 60 pounds of C-4 or maybe 8 or 12 Claymores, and walk in to the middle of Mosul surrounded by Muslims, and denotate yourself. Both of you stated we should fight them on their own grounds. That we should sink to their level while we are fighting this war. And I tell you what, before you nuke yourselves, send me a picture of you, and I make sure we have some Crusaders cards with your pictures on them made up.

Posted by: Butch at November 22, 2004 10:45 AM (Gqhi9)

41 I never said we should sink to their level. shooting a insurgent who was trying to kill you during combat, and who might still be posing a threat is not sinking to their level, it's making sure one of these bastards doesn't send another one of our boys home in a bag. if we were to sink to their level we would be beheading these people and broadcasting it or disembowing there women because of there beleifs. there is no perfect war, war cannot be fought by the book, split second decisions are made in combat, because life or death can happen in a second. how could somebody sleep at night if this brave soldier went to jail, in this country where child molesters are rapist are set free without serving even half their sentence. but here we would have a true brave american rotting in a cell because he didn't want to take a chance with his fellow brothers lives, and some peice of shit camera man wants his 15 minutes of fame. if by the gc he "broke the rules" then maybe these rules shouldn't apply when it saves our soldiers lives. your comment about us nuking ourselves is both imature and stupid, it simply shows your mentality. we are simply true americans who love this country and stand behind our brave troops risking their lives everyday for freedom.

Posted by: bridget at November 22, 2004 12:39 PM (6krEN)

42 OPEN LETTER TO MARINES By Kevin Sites For one thing, if you read my disclaimer above, you would know that I said I was not there and truly do not know if he comitted a crime. "BUT IF" he did shoot and kill "AN UNARM, WOUNDED, INCAPICATED (that means not moving)" enemy combatant, he does deserve to be tried for murder. I have no problem with a soldiers defending themself. I will even say if the soldier enter the building with the wounded combatant and there were still other active enemy combatants around, the soldier would then also be in his right to neutralize, (aka kill) the combatant because the enemy is still a threat. But if all the enemies are only breathing and bleeding, they do not need to be killed. As for the cameraman, check out the story. Now once again, I am not saying his words are true or not, just that the allegations do merit an investigation by the military. As for me wanting to put a "True brave American" into prison, well "IF" he killed an incapicated enemy, then he was either not brave, (aka he panic), or a true American because he killed a freaking "HELPLESS" enemy. And by breaking the GC, he did not save any freaking bodies lives, because there was no threat, but he did place thousands of Americans in danger by ignoring the GC. If enough of our troops ignore the GC, then not only in this war, but future wars, Americans will no longer be protected by it. And I can see how much you love our country and our troops. You love them as much as a vigilante lynching party loves and cherish the law. It is perfectly okay as long as the law protects you, but have it protect someone you don't like, will throw it away and take the law into you own hands. The Commanding Officer, Lieutenant Colonel Willy Buhl, for the battle of Fallujah stated "We're the good guys. We are Americans. We are fighting a gentleman's war here -- because we don't behead people, we don't come down to the same level of the people we're combating. That's a very difficult thing for a young 18-year-old Marine who's been trained to locate, close with and destroy the enemy with fire and "close" "combat". That's a very difficult thing for a 42-year-old lieutenant colonel with 23 years experience in the service who was trained to do the same thing once upon a time, and who now has a thousand-plus men to lead, guide, coach, mentor -- and ensure we remain the good guys and keep the moral high ground." This is what I have been trying to make all of you see. The GC demands that US troops live by this, and by following this and only breaking the GC in the utmost dire situations, can we retain the moral high ground.

Posted by: Butch at November 22, 2004 04:26 PM (Gqhi9)

43 Well said, Bridget. I feel the same way. Fuck the GC, these insurgents aren't playing by any rules. We are not there to mind our manners, it's a war and aren't we there to get the enemy?

Posted by: Laura at November 24, 2004 07:03 PM (ptOpl)

44 By saying Fuck the GC, then this is truly saying you or Bridget really do not give a SH?T about our troops. The reason for this is okay, these assholes in Iraq don't go by the GC, but if we don't then in any future wars no country will. Our troops will never be given the benifit of it. It will then be Fucking Okay to tortue and butcher our POWs not only in Iraq, but any where else in the world. You are saying that if we fuck the GC, then we are no better then the shitty wragheads themself. So if we do, Laura how about sending me your picture to and you can follow Cross-naming Sue and Bridgett and when I put your picture on the Crusader card.

Posted by: Butch at November 29, 2004 04:08 PM (Gqhi9)

45 So did anyone even notice that Teresa Borcz Khalifa was released? She is alive... Let's focus on the positives as they come - leave the namecalling to the liberals. ;o) Have a great day~!

Posted by: Lori at December 01, 2004 04:39 PM (mIwX4)

46 Laura does have a good point, lets everyone give a prayer of thanksgiving for Teresa's release. I also think I read somewhere that the body found did not match the dna of Margret. Lets all pray that this is true also.

Posted by: Butch at December 02, 2004 11:51 AM (Gqhi9)

47 Laura, Bridget, and the "Vet" named Sue: It's pretty obvious that you're all upset, but that hysteria is affecting your judgement. Luckily, the DOD nor the government is run by hysterical, genocidal maniacs that have no control over their emotion. I am not a liberal and I am in favor of the war. But I agree with Butch, who appears to be one of the only clearheaded people here. The GC is there for OUR trooops, it's not just an idealistic standard. If we do not follow the GC, we invite all sorts of misery onto our troops, whether that includes executing POWs or unleashing chemical or biological attacks against us. Butch did not say that anyone was guilty or innocent. That is for the military to decide, not you, not I, definitely not the media. Everyone needs to calm down and realize this. We all have friends in the military and we want to see them all come back alive. You can't make any claims that I can't, so don't tell me that you love America more than I. Sue, I don't believe for one minute that your were in Special Forces in Vietnam. The world is full of posers and I believe you are one of them. Real SF guys don't tell war stories, they don't have anything to prove. I know a lot of them very well, have for years, and they won't even tell me. They won't even bring it up. More likely you're a war-obsessed loner who reads Army manuals in the basement. You may have been a soldier who tried out for SF but was not selected. Most of the posers are either kids or people who weren't selected. At any rate, SF is the QUIET PROFESSIONALS, they don't talk. SF guys are highly educated on foreign cultures, counter-insurgency, and on the legal aspects of war. They are diplomats, teachers -- and yes, soldiers. Sue, yes, I'm calling you a liar. If you still think you're really an SF guy, I invite you to post your creds here: A-Team, Q-School class, and some of them men you served with, I'd be happy to have you authenticated and put this matter to rest.

Posted by: Settle down people at December 28, 2004 12:47 PM (UEB1q)

48 BOMB IRAQ AND GET RID OF THE BASTARDS THERE INSANE AND ARENT EVEN LIKE ANIMALS THERE WORSE CUTTIN PEOPLES HEADS OF WHAT KINDER CARRY ON IS THAT THERE SICK AND I PROMISE THEY WILL BE BROGHT TO JUSTICE.

Posted by: DANIEL at February 01, 2005 08:02 PM (ccZdJ)

49 long life israel fuck all arabs in the world

Posted by: hazard at March 30, 2005 12:52 PM (vOi44)

50 LOve the site keep up the EXCELLENT WORK! VPCenter

Posted by: Victory at April 14, 2005 07:21 PM (82DsT)

51 hmm..this is quite interesting

Posted by: generic drugs at September 26, 2005 03:06 AM (3+p55)

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No Blood for Ivory / France Invasion Compared to Soviets

Incidentally, I'm agnostic on France's illegal invasion of the Ivory Coast. I'm just wondering when International ANSWER will show up at the French embassy to protest?Reuters:

Ivory Coast President Laurent Gbagbo accused France on Monday of backing his rebel opponents and compared its military behaviour in his country to the 1968 Soviet invasion of Czechoslovakia....
"Using the death of its soldiers at Bouake as a pretext, France has destroyed our absolute security," Gbagbo said, referring to the fighter jets he said had been bombing rebel positions and had brought his forces within a day of retaking the rebel stronghold of Bouake.
"Objectively, it has taken the rebels' side," he said.
Asked about Chirac's warning about the danger of leadership emerging in Abidjan with fascist tendencies, Gbagbo recalled that the French president had supported the single party that ruled Ivory Coast for 40 years.
"What could be closer to fascism than a single party? We were in prison under the single party supported by France. This is an insult," he said.
Gbagbo said French troops were now less visible on the streets in Ivory Coast but added that their deployment after the air raid that killed the French peacekeepers was intolerable.
"It was like the invasion of Prague in 1968," he said.

Posted by: Rusty at 08:39 AM | Comments (12) | Add Comment
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1 Do we know the relationship between the French troops and the UN peacekeeping force? I'm confused.

Posted by: Jane at November 15, 2004 09:07 AM (+7VNs)

2 Found it: As part of a combined French-U.N. peacekeeping force, Paris has more than 4,500 troops in CÃƒÂ´te d'Ivoire, where a civil war has partitioned the territory into a government-held south and a rebel-held north. The U.N. Operation in CÃƒÂ´te d'Ivoire (UNOCI), created by the U.N. Security Council in April 2004, has a military strength of over 6,000 peacekeepers. But in an unusual arrangement, French troops have the right to act alone and do not come under the military authority of UNOCI. The two forces are mandated to monitor a May 2003 cease-fire and peace agreement that was signed by the rebel forces and the government of President Laurent Gbagbo.

Posted by: Jane at November 15, 2004 09:56 AM (+7VNs)

3 The frogs are starting trouble again. Just like they did in Viet Nam and Algeria. They will run and leave the mess for others. FROGS GO HOME! NO BLOOD FOR COCOA!

Posted by: greyrooster at November 15, 2004 10:28 AM (aavE0)

4 Jane: Ref, Quote WHATS FRENCH / UN RELATIONSHIP ? Yeah, youve got me there. Well whatever it is it sure aint Kosha or Halal and if theres any recieving to be done you can bet the French will be doing it. Surrendering up their asses for a good old UN pummeling

Posted by: wekno at November 15, 2004 11:12 AM (u4yGw)

5 Im so sorry. I let impulse get the better of me. Im realy not all bad.You see I just hate those Anti American know it all Gaulist surrender Monkeys. surrender Monkeys

Posted by: wekno at November 15, 2004 11:19 AM (u4yGw)

6 Can you believe those Frogs actualy wanted to call Algeria Southern France, until the Algerian liberation kicked their sorry asses all the way back to Paris, just cant put up a fight,all they do is moan and harp on about the U.S. this and the U.S. that,always belly aching about something.

Posted by: wekno at November 15, 2004 11:27 AM (u4yGw)

7 Wako Wekno son of a fucking bitch piece of rotten shit. Here you are again criticising the french. Dude, I've finally figured you out! You went to France in the hope to finally find a lady that would accept your uglyness and help you to loose your virginity. But that hasn't happened and now look at you all pissed off. My friend, don't worry, you still have your two hands. Two fingers for your tiny little cock and 5 up your big fat asshole, lovin' it aint you? Have fun dude. And don't choke next time you suck my cock lil' slut

Posted by: federico at November 15, 2004 08:23 PM (dNXmc)

8 Rusty: Federico?

Posted by: greyrooster at November 15, 2004 11:29 PM (iWXp3)

9 OCIRREDEF SI YTSUR (DUDE)!

Posted by: wekno at November 16, 2004 08:33 AM (fYqXD)

10 October 17th: The day in 1961 that the French police killed more than 200 Arabs in an around Paris. They beat them to death in police stations. Strangled them to death in police courtyards. Shot them in the streets and threw the bodies into the river. None were armed. Then the French rounded up over 10,000 Arabs and jailed them. They deported without trial 100's who they thought may be demonstrators against the selective curfew imposed on arabs only. Many of the french police were recognized as being the same ones who years before rounded up the Jews for deportation to Nazi death camps. The chief of police in Paris in 1961 was later found to be a Nazi collaborator. NOW THE PRINCE OF FROGS, CHIRAC SAYS AMERICA MISTREATS ARAB PRISONERS. DID THE NASTY FRENCH START THIS WHOLE ISLAMIC TERRORIST THING BY THEIR PASSED BEHAVIOR? LIKE THEY STARTED THE VIET NAM THING. NOW THE IVORY COAST THING. START SHIT AND RUN. THE FRENCH WAY.

Posted by: greyrooster at November 16, 2004 08:52 AM (UkXdy)

11 human = human human+human = war war+war= -human warX=-human/warY XYWar= no solution.

Posted by: human at January 27, 2005 10:52 PM (z3ycO)

12 CHIRAK IS A WHORE BIATCH SO ARE ALL THE DIRTY FRENCH! I HATE U FRENCH HYPOCRITES, LIARS AND STUPIDO WHOES

Posted by: DIRTYFRENCH at January 27, 2005 10:55 PM (z3ycO)

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Palestinian Civil War Watch

The Palestinian people are headed for a civil war. One of my good friends sent out the warning to bloggers last week that we should not celebrate Yasser Arafat's passing. Gee, and I already had the party hat on!

Let me just say that it is good diplomacy for the President to pretend that he cares about Arafat's passing. It is also a good idea for the State Department to pretend that this represents a historic turning point for Middle East peace. Thank goodness, though, that I am neither an Administration official or an employee of the State Department. I am a blogger--an amateur pundit. I practice speaking truth to ~~power~~ something or other.

I'm not going to tow the party line. Yasser Arafat? Good riddance. Middle East Peace? Pipe dream. The Arabs in the occupied territories are headed for a civil war. Here is more evidence from CTV:

On Sunday evening, militants firing assault rifles burst into a mourning tent for deceased Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat, killing two security guards and wounding six others.
Abbas had just entered the tent, along with 10,000 others, including about 3,000 armed men, most of them police officers. He stood with Gaza strongman Mohammed Dahlan and shook hands with mourners.
Palestinian Prime Minister Ahmed Qureia insists the shooting was not an attempt to kill Abbas, who is also known as Abu Mazen.
"What's happened, we're sorry for what's happened, but anyhow it is not targeting Abu Mazen personally," Qureia said....
For his part, Abbas also denies that he was targeted, saying a "random shooting" broke out. "But not in my direction." He also denied reports that the gunmen shouted any slogans against him.
The Associated Press reported that the gunmen barged into the tent shouting, "Abbas and Dahlan are agents for the Americans!''

Commissar wonders if there is a Zionist conspiracy here? Misha wishes the PM all the best.

Posted by: Rusty at 08:16 AM | Comments (3) | Add Comment
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